I know the preset angles on the sharpmaker probably won't match the factor angle of the axe. It is just a small camping axe about 2' long and the blade is 5" inches. So how can I properly sharpen this? This is new and have been used only once but I would like to keep it sharp for next time.
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How do you sharpen an axe with the sharpmaker?
- Thread starter zimmerDN
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If it's has no edge left, I'd start if off with a file and then use sandpaper like fishface suggested.
You won't need to be super constant with your angles and you'd want it to be pretty wide, so it shouldn't be too hard to freehand it.
You may want to take the head/blade off the handle too.
You won't need to be super constant with your angles and you'd want it to be pretty wide, so it shouldn't be too hard to freehand it.
You may want to take the head/blade off the handle too.
I'm not sure what the instructions say but you can flip it over, put the medium (course if you have them) rods into the two slots on the bottom and freehand grind the edge (that's what I do). I'm not sure of the exact angle I get but it seems to work well.
You can't use the angles on the top of the unit because most axes have too much shoulder and you would be profiling until Christmas to remove enough metal to be able to sharpen most axes.
When cutting I carry a cheap two-sided 2" x 6" stone that is course on one side and medium on the other. It works okay for touching up the edge as needed. I use this on the wedges also when splitting logs.
Doesn't the DVD/video say something about hatchets and ax sharpening?
You can't use the angles on the top of the unit because most axes have too much shoulder and you would be profiling until Christmas to remove enough metal to be able to sharpen most axes.
When cutting I carry a cheap two-sided 2" x 6" stone that is course on one side and medium on the other. It works okay for touching up the edge as needed. I use this on the wedges also when splitting logs.
Doesn't the DVD/video say something about hatchets and ax sharpening?
Cliff Stamp
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zimmerDN said:
Any axe properly profiled for wood cutting will be more acute than the 20 degree setting on the Sharpmaker so you can use those to touch up the edge quickly.
Most axes outside of a few like Gransfors Bruks have NIB edges which are far too thick and obtuse for wood cutting and need to be reground with a file then a coarse/medium hone to properly taper the edge.
-Cliff
If most axes/hachets don't come with the proper blade angle for wood chopping. How do I fix it? I did find this axe a little hard to use just like others I have used before but I just thought it was because of the size of it resulting in a lack of blow force on each strike. How can I measure the angle btw?
Cliff Stamp
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[axe edge too thick]
Grind off the unnecessary metal. The best way is with a wet wheel grinder, a belt sander will be faster but chances overheating the edge. If you have some time then a large bastard file will do but be prepared for about an hours hard work, dpending on just how thick the axe bit was initially and your physical ability.
Exactly how low to grind the edge depends on your skill, the class of the wood and the strength of the metal in the axe. After each serious felling session, or when ever you have the time, spend 10-15 minutes grinding. Shape the edge first, and then generally bleed the grind back into the shoulder.
Most references will tell you to hit the shoulder first and assume you are going to finish it in one session. If not, rework the edge first as otherwise you will see little effect from your first few sessions. As you thin the shoulder back you can then recut the edge some more.
When I was sorting a lot of this out (with knives as well as axes) I did the modifications on cheap blades and used when they broke down as a limit that better blades/axes had to be able to pass. Some general notes to aim for in regard to felling axes :
-2" back from the edge the bit should be 1/4" thick
-the very edge, 1/16" of an inch wide should be ~15 degrees per side
-back 1/2" from the edge the bit should be 7-8 degrees per side
NIB edges are often multiple times this thick and obtuse and thus the performance only a fraction of optimal. Note for example a quality small hatchet should easily be able to sink 2" into a fairly soft wood like clear pine.
The above notes are the standards of professional woodsmen with high quality axes who use them on medium density woods like oak,birch,fir, etc. . They would also tend to avoid heavy pin knots. If you can pass them you are a rare breed, even if you can match them you will standard apart as axe work isn't common any more.
The axe likely had a large influence, you can easily double the performance of most NIB axes, and I have seen larger increases still.
Calipers and trig is the easiest way.
The bit on felling axes is convex, carpenters axes can have flat ground edges but these are more for cutting and shaping than full depth chopping, you don't swing a carpenters axe from the shoulder. The problem with NIB axes isn't that they are convex but they are way too thick, you want a very light convex curvature not a heavy one.
Hardwood axes should have a primary hollow grind, the bit should dip in right after the eye, if your axe doesn't have this you can grind it in but it will take a long time even if you use an angle grinder. Ref :
http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/hults_before_after.jpg
The retails are in the review, it was a long and multi stage process and had a severe influence on the performance of the axe. I would never recommend you actually do this, take it to a knifemaker and have them regrind it, or better yet buy a different axe.
There are axes with primary convex/flat grinds but they are either made for splitting or to work on really soft woods like balsa.
-Cliff
zimmerDN said:
Grind off the unnecessary metal. The best way is with a wet wheel grinder, a belt sander will be faster but chances overheating the edge. If you have some time then a large bastard file will do but be prepared for about an hours hard work, dpending on just how thick the axe bit was initially and your physical ability.
Exactly how low to grind the edge depends on your skill, the class of the wood and the strength of the metal in the axe. After each serious felling session, or when ever you have the time, spend 10-15 minutes grinding. Shape the edge first, and then generally bleed the grind back into the shoulder.
Most references will tell you to hit the shoulder first and assume you are going to finish it in one session. If not, rework the edge first as otherwise you will see little effect from your first few sessions. As you thin the shoulder back you can then recut the edge some more.
When I was sorting a lot of this out (with knives as well as axes) I did the modifications on cheap blades and used when they broke down as a limit that better blades/axes had to be able to pass. Some general notes to aim for in regard to felling axes :
-2" back from the edge the bit should be 1/4" thick
-the very edge, 1/16" of an inch wide should be ~15 degrees per side
-back 1/2" from the edge the bit should be 7-8 degrees per side
NIB edges are often multiple times this thick and obtuse and thus the performance only a fraction of optimal. Note for example a quality small hatchet should easily be able to sink 2" into a fairly soft wood like clear pine.
The above notes are the standards of professional woodsmen with high quality axes who use them on medium density woods like oak,birch,fir, etc. . They would also tend to avoid heavy pin knots. If you can pass them you are a rare breed, even if you can match them you will standard apart as axe work isn't common any more.
The axe likely had a large influence, you can easily double the performance of most NIB axes, and I have seen larger increases still.
Calipers and trig is the easiest way.
DGG said:
The bit on felling axes is convex, carpenters axes can have flat ground edges but these are more for cutting and shaping than full depth chopping, you don't swing a carpenters axe from the shoulder. The problem with NIB axes isn't that they are convex but they are way too thick, you want a very light convex curvature not a heavy one.
Hardwood axes should have a primary hollow grind, the bit should dip in right after the eye, if your axe doesn't have this you can grind it in but it will take a long time even if you use an angle grinder. Ref :
http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/images/hults_before_after.jpg
The retails are in the review, it was a long and multi stage process and had a severe influence on the performance of the axe. I would never recommend you actually do this, take it to a knifemaker and have them regrind it, or better yet buy a different axe.
There are axes with primary convex/flat grinds but they are either made for splitting or to work on really soft woods like balsa.
-Cliff
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- May 9, 2005
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If you're not striving for a really great edge, you can try this useful site.
They say "If you have any visions of shaving with your ax like the lumberjacks of folklore, forget it. It'll be sharp, but not that sharp."
Not with this method but it certainly is possible.
They say "If you have any visions of shaving with your ax like the lumberjacks of folklore, forget it. It'll be sharp, but not that sharp."
Not with this method but it certainly is possible.
- Joined
- May 9, 2005
- Messages
- 1,767
wsyocum said:
There's the method mentioned in the manual but there are problems. You may very well be working out big nicks. Nobody seems to keep their axe sharp except people who have grown up sharpening them or enthusiasts, so it could take a while. If the edge is too thick you'll only be hitting the shoulders.
I wouldn't recommend a Sharpmaker-only solution for these reasons. I don't even use a Sharpmaker-only solution for many knives. Use the Sharpmaker for touch ups maybe. Start with a grinder or a file or maybe a diamond hone. It's not that hard to just remove enough metal so you can take it to the Sharpmaker.
Cliff Stamp
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wsyocum said:
Sharpening essentially has two stages, for anything not just axes :
1) shape an edge with the most coarse abrasive on hand
2) refine the very edge with an abrasive optimal for the type of cutting
With axes the first stage is often involved due to the sad state of modern axes which on most axes to make them optimal actually requires the use of an angle grinder or other power equipment because even the primary profile is off. Jim Aston has this process decribed in detail on a few pages, showing work he has done and others taking axes and regrinding them.
Even back when axes were much better than they were now pretty much everyone serious about use recut the edges, usually on large wet wheel grinders, because different people worked better with different edges, strength, experience, wood type and steel all influenced the optimal profile.
The above specific details about angles come from Cook's book where he devotes four pages to sharpening axes, Lee does a decent job on sharpening axes in his book on sharpening as well. Do you have to think about angles, and grinds, no, of course you don't. Here is a trivial method :
Step one : Use a marker on the edge, try a pass with the medium rods in the 20 degrees sharpmaker settings, if this hits the edge continue until sharp then repeat with the fine rods. If it doesn't hit the edge go to step two.
Step two : Take a mill bastard file and grind the edge down a little. Go back to step one.
You can even just stop at the filing stage if you want so the most trivial method would be :
Use a marker to outline the edge, take a file and cut the marker off until the edge bevels meet.
This however for most axes would not give you anywhere near an optimal wood cutting profile and the edge retention and cutting ability would be really low. If you want better performance you have to put more effort into sharpening.
For anyone serious about axes get Cook's book. It is filled with interesting stories about axe use and history and has the most specific descriptions of use and care I have seen. Lee's book on sharpening is worth a read in general.
-Cliff