How to prevent old rust from returning??

I

ichor

Joined
Aug 27, 2002
Messages
1,988
I'm posting this on the HI forum because there seem to be so many instances of "rust" discussions because, after all, we Khuk people deal with carbon steel. And the folks on this side of the forum are consistently knowledgeable in this area.

I just bought an older CS Twistmaster. The big one. It is a helluva knife and those of you who know this knife are aware that it is the ultimate, twist lock Opinel.......on lots and lots of steroids. Huge, thick, 4 3/4" clip point blade of Carbon V...gigantic Kraton handle. If you've ever handled one you know that it is almost as close to a fixed blade that a folding knife can get.

OK. I paid only 12.50 for this knife so I'm pleased with what could be the ultimate "beater". However, it has obviously had some major rust problems and the previous owner cleaned it up very well. You know, when you clean off the rust, and even tho' the black residue can still be seen, and the steel feels about a smooth as it can be........but when you hold it up to the light, the rust color comes out.....and you know that this knife will be suseptible to rust in those areas forever.

So, how do you get rid of this malady? Do I need to polish (grind) this knife's surface down to where I can't see the blackness anymore (there's plenty of steel in this knife)? Do I just live with it and make sure that I always clean and oil it (not a problem for me, as I have owned Carbon steel knives all my life). Will this knife ever gain that great, rust protecting "patina" that all of my old Ontario butcher knives achieved....or will that rust just keep popping up? Thanks in advance for any info.
 
to keep it from returning....use mineral oil.
 
ichor said:
I'm posting this on the HI forum because there seem to be so many instances of "rust" discussions because, after all, we Khuk people deal with carbon steel. And the folks on this side of the forum are consistently knowledgeable in this area.

I just bought an older CS Twistmaster. The big one. It is a helluva knife and those of you who know this knife are aware that it is the ultimate, twist lock Opinel.......on lots and lots of steroids. Huge, thick, 4 3/4" clip point blade of Carbon V...gigantic Kraton handle. If you've ever handled one you know that it is almost as close to a fixed blade that a folding knife can get.

OK. I paid only 12.50 for this knife so I'm pleased with what could be the ultimate "beater". However, it has obviously had some major rust problems and the previous owner cleaned it up very well. You know, when you clean off the rust, and even tho' the black residue can still be seen, and the steel feels about a smooth as it can be........but when you hold it up to the light, the rust color comes out.....and you know that this knife will be suseptible to rust in those areas forever.

So, how do you get rid of this malady? Do I need to polish (grind) this knife's surface down to where I can't see the blackness anymore (there's plenty of steel in this knife)? Do I just live with it and make sure that I always clean and oil it (not a problem for me, as I have owned Carbon steel knives all my life). Will this knife ever gain that great, rust protecting "patina" that all of my old Ontario butcher knives achieved....or will that rust just keep popping up? Thanks in advance for any info.
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Ichor, I'm sorry to tell you that the knife is completely and irrevocably ruined. If you can actually see that level of surface rust, the molecular and even sub-atomic structure of the chromium steel and 0.3% molybdenum sub-strata has been severly compromised by continued and horribilitic ionizing rustification of the connecting metallic platelets, and you would be _extremely_ foolish to even use it in this condition! :( I'm just surprised it hasn't snapped in half by now and cut your hand off or something! As the CS Twistmaster's are of course outdated and antiquated technology (not to mention very hard to find now), I would be glad to take it off your hands, just to prevent you from accidentally severely injuring yourself or a loved one. Of course I'll be willing to pay you $20 or so to offset your costs and for shipping & handling, etc.

Take my advice, and get rid of this "killer blade" ASAP before you regret it! :eek:

Just doing my best to help!

Regards,

Norm
 
I have a large drop point Twistmaster and it is a heck of a knife for the money. I don't think they make 'em anymore, do they?
 
I gots one of thems... I think. I remember it to be a tanto one. It was too big to be a small knife and too small to be a big knife. I haven't seen it in a couple of years. Then I came here.
 
I bought about five, I think it was, of the CS Twistmasters when they had their big closeout on them.

I gave them away as gifts and kept one. Nasty got to see it along with all my other sharp and pointy goodies Saturday.
Amazingly I didn't even need a slobber rag to wipe things off with after Nasty got through drooling.:eek: :D ;)
Nasty wasn't really all that nasty, but he is one big Bro!!!!:p :D ;)
 
Sorry to hear that Bruise...tell ya what, I'll give you the same deal...$12.50 when ya find it!

I wouldn't do this for just anybody, so let's just keep it between us... :-)


No kidding on drooling at Yvsa's place...seems like I came home parched! It's a *very* cool knife, it was all I could do to not make offers left and right! I wonder why they stopped making them? Not "cool" enough with the auto fans?
 
A non-toxic product called Evap-o-Rust will remove even the deepest rust. Apparently some Walmart's carry it in quarts. You can find dealers via a Google search. After that, plenty of . . . mineral oil. :)
 
Nasty said:
Tom...what removes mineral oil? ;-)
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Hand-made silk Katana covers, AND YOU KNOW THAT PERFECTLY WELL! :mad: (mumble, mumble, mumble)

(Failing that, mineral spirits or cat fur.)
 
Svashtar said:
Ichor, I'm sorry to tell you that the knife is completely and irrevocably ruined. If you can actually see that level of surface rust, the molecular and even sub-atomic structure of the chromium steel and 0.3% molybdenum sub-strata has been severly compromised by continued and horribilitic ionizing rustification of the connecting metallic platelets, and you would be _extremely_ foolish to even use it in this condition! :( I'm just surprised it hasn't snapped in half by now and cut your hand off or something! As the CS Twistmaster's are of course outdated and antiquated technology (not to mention very hard to find now), I would be glad to take it off your hands, just to prevent you from accidentally severely injuring yourself or a loved one. Of course I'll be willing to pay you $20 or so to offset your costs and for shipping & handling, etc.

Take my advice, and get rid of this "killer blade" ASAP before you regret it! :eek:

Just doing my best to help!

Regards,

Norm
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Norm...thanks so much for your candid advice and more than generous offer. If I cut off more than one finger with this fatally flawed, low tech accident waiting to happen, I will contact you.

Bruise......I don't know.....a "pocket knife" with a 4 3/4" blade, 1/8" thick and 1 1/4" at it's widest point is pretty close to being a big knife.

Nasty.....good offer to Bruise....that's exactly what I paid for this flawed ugly duckling. I think you're right.....a knife that you can't open with one hand just doesn't have a prayer any more. But, when I snap this sucker open and twist lock it......man pull, push in any direction.....no.....repeat.....nada, zero, zilch blade movement.

Semper fi.....you're right, they don't make'em any more. I have kicked myself a dozen times for not taking advantage of the clearance, Yvsa mentioned, on these things a couple years ago.

It feels like a monster knife because of the big, round checkered zytel handle(not Kraton, as I said before) . The grip is so secure it makes you feel that you could do anything with it and not lose control. Plus, for a knife with this huge blade it is feather light and, to mind , doesn't feel at all unbalanced (I may be....slightly....maybe).

Thanks for the comments. At 17 bucks, including shipping, I think I'll keep it for now. :D :D
 
BTW, since this knife is "ruined" anyway, what can I apply that will accelerate the "patina" for a more uniform, less splotchy color on the blade?
 
but I wouldn't cut food fer a while with it. Bluinng is a controlled corrosion, and does quite a bit to keep a multi duty knife from rusting badly.

Kershaw made some twist locks in the 90's, nice ergo handle design with rubber insets, but the backsprings were tempered too hard and many failed by simply snapping. Knif still works, but won't hold itself shut.

Keith
 
ichor said:
BTW, since this knife is "ruined" anyway, what can I apply that will accelerate the "patina" for a more uniform, less splotchy color on the blade?
Click to expand...

I've gotten the best results with plain old white vinegar. Here's what I do for khukuris; I assume it would work equally well on your Twistmaster:

First, clean the blade of the knife so that it is free of grease. Windex seems to work pretty well for this, as does dishwashing detergent. It also helps if you heat the blade before applying the vinegar. I usually run it under hot water or leave it in the sun for a while. While the blade is heating up, take some cheap vinegar and put it in an old mug or other microwaveable container. Heat it up for around 45 seconds or so. You don't need it boiling, but you definitely want it hot. Once the vinegar is hot, add a few drops of dish detergent to break the surface tension--this will keep it from beading up on the blade. Use an old toothbrush to evenly coat the balde with the vinegar. I usually keep brushing it on for a few minutes, then let the blade sit for a few minutes. Keep an eye on it because rust can start to form very rapidly. I usually go for several shorter etchings rather than one long one. It seems to give better results. Once the patina has developed to your satisfaction, thoroughly rinse the blade. It might not be a bad idea to use some baking soda to neutralize the acidity of the vinegar, but I don't usually do that, and I haven't had any problems. Once the blade is completly dry, give it a liberal coating of mineral oil as soon as possible. Other things you can try include citrus fruit, yellow mustard, and hot sauce.

--Josh
 
What Josh said, or just give it a very liberal coat of mayonaise and let it set overnight. Instant patina, well sorta anyway.:D ;)
 
I'd just use it in the kitchen for a while. ;) Cut vegetables, meat, spread condiments...rinse and wipe after use just like any carbon steel kitchen knife. Perma-Blue cold blue works well for a quick, black finish that holds oil well.
 
You could just send it to me me...I'll get it right back to you in about 10 years with a perfect patina and a razor sharp edge.

(I even have mineral oil in abundance on both my garage floor and cats!)
 
After using my new/old Twistmaster for almost a month now (at the produce stand where I work, cutting oranges, onions, lemons, et al)......and sliding a cut lemon over the blade and letting it set for a while......I'm happy to report that the blade is well on it's way to "patina-ization".

Since there seemed to be so much interest in this knife, I thought I'd post this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=42577&item=3681014269&rd=1

No affiliation.....I don't know the seller from a bale of hay, but he has over 5000 feedback and less than 2 percent non-positive, which is where I draw the line for bidding. I have the clip point, which I prefer, and this one is a drop point. I sorta (I think) stole mine for 12.50 and this one starts at 20 bucks, but I didn't get a belt sheath and I would gladly pay an extra 10 bucks or so for the original cordura sheath. This is a big, fat, round handle that doesn't go very well in your back pocket (but it's what makes it so secure in the hand). . :eek: :D
 
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