how to tell new from old?

W

Willeford

Joined
Oct 1, 2006
Messages
36
hello,

i´m thru with Saks, Opinels and Douk Douk´s. Those are ok knives but actually they are boring (just my opinion). I´m lusting for traditional knives like Case, Bulldog Brand, Great Eastern etc. for a while now. So i´ve ordered a Schrade Old Timer Congress just to get a collection started. Now after some research i found out that Schrade bancrupted in 2004, and people say that the knives the new manufacturer of the brand produces are not like the original quality.
is there a way to find out my knife is pre-2004?

thank you

ollie
 
post a photo
show the whole knife .show the tang stamps. show any packaging.
-there will be no doubt.
 
i'll check back later -i'm in Australia .I collect USA made Schrades.
If it doesn't specify USA on the tang. its Chinese more than likely.
with that in mind theres nothing wrong with them as a knife.They are not collectible in the same sense as American Schrades which are no longer made.
cheers
 
thanks for the info. from what you said i asume it´s china made. on the pic i´ve seen was no US-stamp on the tang. and it was very cheap.

ollie
 
Just look for the USA mark on the tang, for the real article (knives actually produced by Schrade, NY USA). The 'new' ones (Chinese production) won't have it. This is what I look for in listings on the 'Bay, in particular. If the knife doesn't have the USA mark on it, or if the pics don't sufficiently show it, I move on (in spite of what the listing might say otherwise). This isn't a comment on quality, by the way. I have no opinion there, haven't handled any of the new ones.
 
Schrade never made a congress pattern in the Old Timer range. The only one Schrade made was in what was called the open stock range, these ran before the Old Timers were released and continued in production for awhile alonside each other. 974 was the open stock Cat No.

Russell
 
I can easily see how someone can get burned buying by name. It would be great if one of the trad buffs could put together a list of companies like Schrade, Camillus, etc., and the years they went under. (Maybe this already exists?) Then new guys could have a base line when they start looking for vintage knives.

When did Old Henry go into business? I think it was just recently.
 
Thalestin said:
If it was new and cheap you already have your answer
Click to expand...

Not necessarily, I've found quite a few USA Schrades and Uncle Henrys in out of the way hardware stores for cheap. Just a note, if it isn't on display, doesn't mean they don't have it. Some places have them in the back, figuring no one wants the old knives. :eek:
 
Hi Willeford. Welcome to BladeForums, and for sharing your interest in Old Timer pocketknives.
Unfortunately, as everyone else has said, your's is undoubtedly a modern import and not an original.

The originals were made by the Imperial-Schrade Corporation, and the new ones are made in China for Taylor Brands. I can usually tell the difference, often with just a glance. Here's how:

The paperwork. New paperwork says Taylor, old paperwork says Imperial-Schrade and probably mentions Ellenville, NY.
Handle materials. New ones are offered in many materials that the old ones never were. Buffalo horn, wood, etc.
Taylor is making several patterns that were never made by Schrade: Boot knife, hawkbill, congress, Shark.
Tang stamp. The originals always had USA as part of the front stamp. The Taylor knives usually just say "Schrade" or "Schrade Handmade."
Box style and design. The last Schrade boxes were similar to the Taylor packaging, but not exact. Earlier Schrade boxes aren't even close.
Availability. Some folks are finding the originals still today in out of the way hardware stores and elsewhere, but for the most part knife dealers have been sold out of original USA-made Old Timer knives for years.
50th Anniversary Old Timers and 100th Anniversary Boy Scout Old Timer knives are all imports.

Hope this helps!
 
Servus Ollie!

I own a Schrade Old Timer Whittler. Which is definitelly not made in the US. The tang stamps speaks a clear language. I bought that one on a german online shop. On the tang stamp is written "China". The knife is made nicely, no doubt. I carry it from time to time. If you have an specific question, you can contact me via PM.

BTW: Nice to have another german guy here in the coolest subforum all around the world

Kind regards from Bavaria!
Andi
 
I THINK Schrade went out of US production in 2004, Camillus in 2007. I've heard some people state that some of the very last run knives were a bit questionable in quality due to production uncertainty. Nevertheless, Schrade USA can boast a long and illustrious career, some really decent items can be seen on the Old knives and the OT range are an honest workhorse for sure.

I don't have any US Schrades and only one Chinese knife. A lot of people express doubts about these, but the 3 OT lockback I have in Horn is very acceptable, no blade play or gaps. The horn looked a bit rough around the pins and much to my surprise it has smoothed out and is fine. I'd like a saw cut delrin US model but they seem to have become outlandishly expensive new/oldstock. Nice small lockback.
 
Just occurred to me, I think all the new imported Schrade-branded knives are stainless steel ('400 series', as listed by vendors). If one prefers the carbon blades, as with the USA Old Timers, that's a very significant factor to consider. Schrade USA also had some stainless blades, and marked most/all with a '+' after the SCHRADE mark. I think those were 440A, which wasn't bad stuff.
 
willgoy said:
I THINK Schrade went out of US production in 2004, Camillus in 2007. I've heard some people state that some of the very last run knives were a bit questionable in quality due to production uncertainty.
Click to expand...

The collectors here at Bladeforums made up a term for those last run knives, "End of days" knives. There was a lot of mis-matching of parts, whatever fit together, but from I've seen the quality remained consistent. I have several and have not noticed any problems with the fit and finish.
 
I use the search phrase 'schrade usa' on the big auction site. Pass on anything that doesn't show a clear tang stamp w/ USA on it.
My local knife shop has pre-2004 Old timers/Uncle Henrys for sale.

Welcome to the addiction. BTW there's really nothing wrong w/ the knife you bought. Schrade and Rough Rider knives are an inexpensive way to to try out a new slip joint pattern.

Unfounded rumor --> My knife store says that Schrade and RR are produced in the same factory. <-- unfounded rumor.
 
well , now i´m taking part on two auctions, on the named side for used but in good condition, US-made Schrade Old Timers.

thanx guys
 
there are plenty of good ones on the ebuy.
i just got pipped at the post on a beaut old uncle henry LB7.
would have been about 50 bux inc freight to OZ-not bad .
 
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