How what when (Sharpening)

C

CoGraphic

Joined
Sep 11, 2015
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Just a curious because i am learning how to sharpening on stones and have not made much progress, where i live there is no one that i know or any businesses that sharpen knifes or anything close to that so i am unable to find myself a mentor. So my questions are, what sharpening system do you use and why? How long did it take you guys before you were efficient with your sharpening system? When did you guys start sharpening? When sharpening how long does it take for you do get the edge you want? Also, when learning how to sharpen, did you learn it yourself or did someone teach you? Sorry for all the questions just curious!

Thank you
 
What are you using for stones? If you are using bench stones I would suggest that you get a sharpmaker or something similar and practice at what angles to hold the piece your working on. I have used the sharpmaker for a couple years now and I figured I would try out some free hand, and I can tell that getting used to angles on the sharpmaker has helped a lot with my consistency on bench stones. It all comes down to consistency and proper angle at which to hold your work peice. You could also get a couple of cheap knives a practice with them and if you mess them up it's no big deal, just keep practicing and you'll get there! Hope this helps somewhat.

Thefirstsuspect,
 
What sharpening system do I use and why? I use bench stones. Because there are so many to choose from. Diamond, Arkansas stone, natural Jap stone, synthetic water stones, etc. And I learned as a kid by my grandfather to sharpen freehand. For knives that require a nice cosmetic edge (like the ones I sell), I use a clamp on guide by Razor Edge Systems, simply for that "perfect" looking edge. Learning how to sharpen freehand on bench stones means that I can sharpen any knife on just about any abrasive...my muscle memory has been tuned to do so. Not relying on a guided system that you may not have with you at the time you need it.

How long did it take before I was proficient (sharpening freehand)? So long ago I never remember not knowing how to sharpen a knife. Literally I was probably 7 or 8 when I learned. By the time I was working for my father in high school, I had the reputation across town as being the guy to sharpen your knife! Not trying to toot a horn here...at all. Anyone who knows me knows I am not trying to toot my horn! I really couldn't say....except that I am always learning new stuff and techniques....thanks to forums like THIS GREAT one. Even from know it alls like Cliff Stamp....I have gleaned good info from. Always learning and improving.

When did I start sharpening? Yeah....about 7 or 8 years old. 37 now. Or is it 38? Gee I don't even know.

How long does it take to get the edge I want? Depends on the condition the edge was in to begin with. Touch ups.....15 minutes maximum. Sometimes 15 seconds on a ceramic honing rod is all it takes. But for a new edge on a new knife, using bench stones, usually 30-40 minutes progressing from about 120 thru 8000 maybe. All bench stones by hand. Diamond stones help to shorten some of that time on carbide full steels. Some guys, depending on the edge they make, can put a new edge on a new knife in 5 minutes or less. They form a low angle edge geometry at low grit, then raise the angle to establish a microbevel with the finer grit stone...not really caring what grit the actual edge bevel is....as long as the apex is finished to the higher grit they want. I've recently tried this technique and I like it, but for my knives I sell, the edge has got to be polished for cosmetic reasons simply. So I take the long route usually. For cosmetics sake. A perfectly functional edge (and one that excels I might add) can be made by this method (low angle around 10° or less to establish the geometry and thin out, then raise to microbevel at the desired final angle)

Did I learn myself or did someone teach me? My grandfather taught me when I was young, but that was just the basics.....holding the same angle thruout the session. These forums have been priceless in learning more complex sharpening theory (toothy vs polished....edge angles...thinning...etc)
 
CoGraphic said:
Just a curious because i am learning how to sharpening on stones and have not made much progress, where i live there is no one that i know or any businesses that sharpen knifes or anything close to that so i am unable to find myself a mentor. So my questions are, what sharpening system do you use and why? How long did it take you guys before you were efficient with your sharpening system? When did you guys start sharpening? When sharpening how long does it take for you do get the edge you want? Also, when learning how to sharpen, did you learn it yourself or did someone teach you? Sorry for all the questions just curious!

Thank you
Click to expand...

I use the XC dia plate for flattening, then i have 320 1k and 5k of shaptons i am working with. I was thinking of trying an actualy sharpening system but i did not want to take the learning curve out of sharpening because i eventually want to sharpen on stones.
 
samuraistuart said:
What sharpening system do I use and why? I use bench stones. Because there are so many to choose from. Diamond, Arkansas stone, natural Jap stone, synthetic water stones, etc. And I learned as a kid by my grandfather to sharpen freehand. For knives that require a nice cosmetic edge (like the ones I sell), I use a clamp on guide by Razor Edge Systems, simply for that "perfect" looking edge. Learning how to sharpen freehand on bench stones means that I can sharpen any knife on just about any abrasive...my muscle memory has been tuned to do so. Not relying on a guided system that you may not have with you at the time you need it.

How long did it take before I was proficient (sharpening freehand)? So long ago I never remember not knowing how to sharpen a knife. Literally I was probably 7 or 8 when I learned. By the time I was working for my father in high school, I had the reputation across town as being the guy to sharpen your knife! Not trying to toot a horn here...at all. Anyone who knows me knows I am not trying to toot my horn! I really couldn't say....except that I am always learning new stuff and techniques....thanks to forums like THIS GREAT one. Even from know it alls like Cliff Stamp....I have gleaned good info from. Always learning and improving.

When did I start sharpening? Yeah....about 7 or 8 years old. 37 now. Or is it 38? Gee I don't even know.

How long does it take to get the edge I want? Depends on the condition the edge was in to begin with. Touch ups.....15 minutes maximum. Sometimes 15 seconds on a ceramic honing rod is all it takes. But for a new edge on a new knife, using bench stones, usually 30-40 minutes progressing from about 120 thru 8000 maybe. All bench stones by hand. Diamond stones help to shorten some of that time on carbide full steels. Some guys, depending on the edge they make, can put a new edge on a new knife in 5 minutes or less. They form a low angle edge geometry at low grit, then raise the angle to establish a microbevel with the finer grit stone...not really caring what grit the actual edge bevel is....as long as the apex is finished to the higher grit they want. I've recently tried this technique and I like it, but for my knives I sell, the edge has got to be polished for cosmetic reasons simply. So I take the long route usually. For cosmetics sake. A perfectly functional edge (and one that excels I might add) can be made by this method (low angle around 10° or less to establish the geometry and thin out, then raise to microbevel at the desired final angle)

Did I learn myself or did someone teach me? My grandfather taught me when I was young, but that was just the basics.....holding the same angle thruout the session. These forums have been priceless in learning more complex sharpening theory (toothy vs polished....edge angles...thinning...etc)
Click to expand...

Wow thank you for all this
 
CoGraphic said:
Just a curious because i am learning how to sharpening on stones and have not made much progress, where i live there is no one that i know or any businesses that sharpen knifes or anything close to that so i am unable to find myself a mentor. So my questions are, what sharpening system do you use and why? How long did it take you guys before you were efficient with your sharpening system? When did you guys start sharpening? When sharpening how long does it take for you do get the edge you want? Also, when learning how to sharpen, did you learn it yourself or did someone teach you? Sorry for all the questions just curious!

Thank you
Click to expand...

1)
I use benchstones freehand 90% of the time. Nothing else comes close for versatility and speed combined. Mostly waterstones, but also combination silicon carbide, diamond plates etc. Often for convenience I use silicon carbide on one of my washboards (link below in my signature). For finish work and maintenance I use polishing grade waterstones, smooth honing steels, most often paper and compound over washboard, or diamond lapping film if its high carbide steel.


2)
I am still learning to improve, proficiency was pretty depends on the specific abrasive media - waterstones take the longest to learn but are very rewarding.

3)
I started as a pre teen, but I also wrecked as many edges as I improved. Wasn't until I was in my late teens, early 20s that I broke it down and began to learn how to get clean sharp edges with a coarse stone - how to set bevels. At that point my edges improved considerably.


4)
Currently I can usually take a hammered edge to very sharp in under 15 minutes freehand - treetopping sharp. To go higher than that takes me a bit more time, mostly QC and observation.


5)
I learned almost entirely myself though did read plenty of tutorials where I could find them, which wasn't often in the days of internet infancy. I learned a lot from watching higher end Japanese sharpening videos, Murray Carter and learned to go a lot faster from using my washboard and studying the technique of fast moving maestros like Jason B.


For me, learning to do the best job with coarse stones really paid off - trying to make it through a progression of finer hones is a real challenge if you aren't 100% at the low end - each step up only gets more difficult in terms of technique - allowable deviation and tactile feedback tend to drop off hard at the upper end. Those rough edges served me well under hard use at work too.


Sharpening big blades like machetes is good for learning as well, really lets you see where the tool is woobling on the abrasive and teaches you to key in when using smaller tools. Realistically, sharpening lots of different tools is a help.
 
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If I'm sharpening by hand I use the ERU system which can be perfected in half an hour. The user supplies the stone or plate, the rest comes with the kit. Simple effective and repeatable. It takes a chore that seems vague and makes it specific. No strop needed with this tool, it is its own strop. The ERU is the most accurate sharpening tool on the market and before you ask, yes I can back up the statement. :)

Enjoy the process, Fred
 
CoGraphic said:
Just a curious because i am learning how to sharpening on stones and have not made much progress, where i live there is no one that i know or any businesses that sharpen knifes or anything close to that so i am unable to find myself a mentor. So my questions are, what sharpening system do you use and why? How long did it take you guys before you were efficient with your sharpening system? When did you guys start sharpening? When sharpening how long does it take for you do get the edge you want? Also, when learning how to sharpen, did you learn it yourself or did someone teach you? Sorry for all the questions just curious!

Thank you
Click to expand...
The only system I have is a lansky turnbox, I bpught it because it was cheap and well recommended here. I like it, and use it for quick touch ups if my edge is too far gone for steel or strop, but not gone enough to bust out the stones. Only thing that I dont like about it is cleaning the rods. It took about one knife to get proficient with it, as long as the edge isnt to obtuse its easy.
Mostly I use stones. I learned from my dad when I was a cub scout, and learned the boyscout way of sharpening which is one hand, away then towards on a stone at a pretty steep angle, and did that for 30 years until I read the stickies here. Could get pretty damn sharp too. Now I raise a burr, cut it off, raise one the other way, cut it off on the first sharpening. Then go back to the cub scout way of doing it (one side, even if 10 or 30 swipes, then the other) after.
I see you are in Wyoming. Dont know how often you get to the Denver area, but give me some heads up if you make it down here and I would be happy to spend a lil bit to show you the basics.
 
I always had cheap dual grit hardware store stones lying around. I never really paid attention and as long as I got a usable / improved edge, I was happy. Over the last few years I've started to focus. I recently bought a sharpmaker and I am very happy with it. I just use the standard medium and fine grit rods. I may progress to the ultra fine rods and plan to go back to stone sharpening once I refine my skills on the sharpmaker.
 
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Im not as good as samuraistuart, started a couple years later, and I'm a couple years younger. But that gives you an idea, its not a quick thing. Just got to practice, and try stuff, no one knows it all, even here. Be glad you have youtube. I was trying to learn it by myself, and while those who were trying to teach me knew a thing or two about a thing or two.... Well, have you ever tried to teach a 14 year old? Wasted a lot of time being smarter than those guys.
 
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