I can't get this Damascus pen blade sharp!

S

SubSpace

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May 26, 2011
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Hoping for some advice here--

I use a spyderco sharpmaker for all my sharpening. It's never failed to put a nice razor edge on any of my Case knives. But on my new Damascus Peanut, I can't get the pen blade sharp enough to cut butter.

The clip blade I've got almost hair shaving sharp, so I don't fault my technique, nor the steel itself. But I am baffled as to why I can't get this small pen blade sharp enough to open an envelope. I've just spent close to an hour sharpening, stropping, testing, and repeating to no success. I have many, many knives and have gotten them all sharp. Why is this peanut pen blade giving me so much frustration?

I should note this is my only Damascus knife, and it was dull from the factory. I've only owned it for a couple of weeks and today was my first chance to sharpen it up. I'm about ready to send it to Bradford and pay for them to sharpen the darn thing!

What could be the culprit here (and yes, I know full well the culprit could entirely be me!)
 
First, stop trying to use the sharpmaker on the knife.

Not all knives come from the factory with the same edge angle, and if there is a subtle difference the mechanical gizmo won't work. You'll be trying to re-bevel instead of sharpening the angle that's already there. I'll be honest, I hate those sharpening gizmos, and think they are a rip off of the consumer tricked into buying them. This ain't rocket science, in spite of that's how the makers of the sharpening gizmos try to make it out to be. That's how they get money out of your pocket into theirs.

Take a dry erase maker, and mark up the edge bevels real well. Then just hold a sharpening stone in your left hand, (if your right handed) and the knife in you're right. Gently lay the blade flat on the stone, and pay close attention as you slowly bring the knife blade up in angle as to where the edge bevel comes in contact with the stone. When it looks like you're there, start honing the edge in a small circular motion on the stone, starting way back at the kick, and working your way slowly up to the blade tip. Take at least a full minute getting there. Honing in a circular way will keep the edge in constant contact with the stone at the same angle. It will be close enough.

When you reach the blade tip, stop and examine the edge and the dry erase marker. Did the fresh new steel go all the way to the edge, or is there still marker on the very edge? Use the results from the marker pen to adjust your angle.

Forget about the slice from the stone thing. Holding the blade in constant contact with the stone while honing in a small circle is way easier, will result in more even bevels, and is faster. The type of stone won't matter much, diamond, washita, even an old gray carborunum stone like silica or aluminum oxide. Just for yuks, this past year I've been using my old Boy Scout stone I found in a box of old stuff in the attic. It's a bit beat up, and dished, but it still puts a shaving edge on my pocket knife. After wards I just strop in the back of an old belt. Whispers through envelopes like they weren't even there.

Most people over think sharpening. Like I said, this ain't rocket science. It takes very little to develope a feel for the knife on the stone. It's almost instictive, if you let yourself go, and don't think about it too much. You have to relax, and just feel the rythem of the blade on the stone. With very little effort, you will be able to touch up your blade on the bottom of a coffee mug, top of a car window, or even a smooth stone from the creek.

Carl.
 
Carl's advice is sound. The circular motion is what I use on my pocket diamond hones (DMT 'credit card' style). :thumbup:

The only thing I'd add is, get yourself a good magnifier (10X or better) and closely examine the edge as you sharpen, under BRIGHT light. Sometimes, it's hard to see if ALL of the black marker has come off, all the way to the edge. Oftentimes, there'll be a hair-thin (literally) 'stripe' of it left at the edge, which can make the difference between 'sharp' and 'dull', if you overlook it. Actually seeing what's actually going on at the edge, can make all the difference. Any flaws in the sharpening angle will become obvious at high magnification. I think this is the number one bug-a-boo that plagued my efforts for many years. Don't think I ever quite sharpened all the way to the edge. Checking for a burr at the edge is a good way to verify that too.
 
Thank you both. I found one of my grandfather's old sharpening stones. It's got a rough side and a not as rough side. Should I start with the roughest, or the not as rough? Also, do I need to oil the stone or anything like that?

I appreciate the advice.
 
I always start as light (fine) as possible. No point in removing too much metal, especially while you're trying to get comfortable with the technique. BUT, I will re-emphasize taking a close look at the edge with a magnifier, before proceding. Use the marker trick, as mentioned before, to verify you are maintaining a good angle. Once you know you can do that, if you want to use the coarse side, go ahead. Take it slow & easy, and keep inspecting the edge as you work.

Edit:
As for oiling the stone, don't worry about that now. While you're still trying to see if your angle is right, the oil will probably make the process more distracting & messy than you need at the moment. Place your focus on watching how the ink comes off the bevel as you work.
 
I'm firmly in the no oil camp. I don't use any oil or water on my stones. Hone dry, and just wipe off with a clean rag or paper towel.

Carl.
 
Thanks again. I'm going to go practice with an old SAK before attempting on my Damascus...
 
SubSpace said:
Thanks again. I'm going to go practice with an old SAK before attempting on my Damascus...
Click to expand...

That sounds like a good plan. The SAK's blade might be a tad softer than the damascus, which might take more time when you're ready to tackle that. So patience is key (always). :thumbup:
 
first of all, your sharpmaker is crap so throw it right out the window.
second, your not getting to the very edge of your blade. Use a sharpie to see that you are indeed removing what you want.
3rd, get some kinda magnification device to get a closer look at that edge.
 
The above suggestions are golden, but I would like to add my two cents. You can also adjust the angle at which you hold the knife edge to the Sharpmaker stone if your blade bevel doesn't match up to one of the preset angles of the Sharpmaker. There's no hard and fast rule that says you have to hold the blade exactly vertical. I've had to do this on several of my blades when I saw the bevel wasn't the same angle as the sharpening stick, and as a result was not allowing the edge to touch the stone (stick...whatever its called on the Sharpmaker). It's probably easier to use the above technique on a large, flat sharpening stone, but it is possible to do on the Sharpmaker also. However, I will add that I only use the Sharpmaker to "touch up" my blades. Trying to put a whole new bevel on a blade with the Sharpmaker is a lot more work than I'm willing to do. I'll use a large course bench stone or DMT stone for that task.
 
The folks that are recommending your throw your hard earned money out the window and buy a stone have good intentions but I really feel you would be making a bad choice. I have and enjoy the Spyderco Sharpmaker system. I also have stones, belt sanders, paper wheels, water cooled wheels, sandpaper, etc.

I would first ask you if you are keeping your sharpening rods clean (Gray/Brown stones after every sharpening 5-10 sessions or when they go slick, and White stones after every sharpening session)? I have sharpened many cheap steels, highly wear resistant steels, and various damascus steels with good success. Due to the fine abrasive of the Sharpmaker system you will have to be patient with some steels. The Sharpmaker does have areas where it could be inproved, but it is a solid system for maintaining your sharp tools.

When you are first sharpening a knife for the first time, it will take longer due to setting up the angles as mentioned above (not all knives come with edge bevels set to 30 or 40 degrees inclusive). A few tools or supplies to have handy while sharpening: Strong light, a marker to color the edge so you can see where your sharpening effort is located in relation to the top or bottom of the bevel, and if you can a loupe (15 power) like this one from Lee Valley (click the company name to see the item). The loupe I linked to will give you both the light and the magnification in the same accessory tool.

Another thought is that you should not be so quick to the strop. Wait until you have the knife sharp off of the stone rods before going to the strop with very light or no pressure with good angle control.

Again, this is simply my two cents.
 
there has been good advice on the issue.
Except for throwing away sharpening tools.
I learned the basics of sharpening on the sharpmaker. Now that I am proficient in freehanding, I still use the sharpmaker rods a lot, but now freehand. for touchups etc I tend to use the fine and ultra fine on a very regular basis.

I believe we talked about this before eccvets.. If you don't like the system, that's fine. But please don't go on a crusade against it just because you cannot use it.
 
Thank you all for the replies. I like the sharpmaker and have had great success with it in the past. But I do want to learn to sharpen freehand. The advice received on this forum has been very helpful.
 
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