i found the recipe for a sager

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Mar 31, 2016
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the axe is dipped in the powdered solution then forged as normal, then quenched in a solution of the powder and water. one part prussiate potash, one part iron borate one and one half parts saltpeter, 2 parts blue vitriol, two parts sal-ammoniac, three parts salt and one part concentrated lye

https://www.google.com/patents/US547361 who wants to make a sager?
 
Nice find! I wonder if it actually produced any real measurable benefits.
 
Nice find! I wonder if it actually produced any real measurable benefits.

Exactly what I was thinking. Honestly, do we really know is this was superior to any other truly premium axe? My feeling is that Sager axes were very good, but this secret sauce can't be a truly scientific, precise, exact magic formula for making the best possible axe. Maybe it helped, probably it did, but it feels like a homemade formula that is mostly good, but not something that couldn't be improved upon with tons of testing or modern science. So the exact formula is probably somewhat flexible. And if it isn't, then the exact steel formulation used becomes important in replication so duplication is still a problem.

Having said all of that, I still think that it is very cool to see this historical info.
 
They are great axes. Nobody makes anything close to them today as far as I know. They were the choice of the professional fallers here in the north west. By far they are the most common of the Puget Sound patterns I come across. The peeling, swamping and topping axes are a mixed bag, but always good quality, but when it comes to the felling axes that get swung all day they are usually Sager Chemicals.
 
well, if i had a beat up sager and a beat up KP, i'd test it, like seeing how much force it takes to chip the edge. so what might happen, is we get 2 axes, new, maybe CT basic jerseys, treat one and leave the other plain. do an edge retention test, a chip test and a corrosion test. i can provide the baseline (except rust) tests as i got a CT jersey recently. i cant however, treat...... it because im broke
i dont have the stuff to treat it
 
Thats cool !
They are a great axe. But I wonder if the patent process was just as much marketing BS as much as real science.
 
Maybe it helped, probably it did, but it feels like a homemade formula that is mostly good, but not something that couldn't be improved upon with tons of testing or modern science. So the exact formula is probably somewhat flexible. And if it isn't, then the exact steel formulation used becomes important in replication so duplication is still a problem.

I've seen something like this before. There was a certain steel required for the formula to work at it's full potential.

But all that aside, I've noticed that Sagers, when they do rust, tend to pit deeply (1/8") . I've seen this numerous times. I suspect the surface treatment is responsible for this.
 
Sager%20warranty.jpg
 
Could this be similar to a nitrocarburizig? That process is used a lot on guns which is my wheel house. On a finished grind it wood give axe surface a 20 thou hardness of 60+ rock
 
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Could this be similar to a nitrocarburizig? That process is used a lot on guns which is my wheel house. On a finished grind it wood give axe surface a 20 thou hardness of 60+ rock

I don't think it is related at all. Borax is used in forging though and that formula has iron borate in it. So that might explain that ingredient.
 
prussiate potash-Potassium ferrocyanide finds many niche applications in industry. It and the related sodium salt are widely used as anticaking agents for both road salt and table salt. The potassium and sodium ferrocyanides are also used in the purification of tin and the separation of copper from molybdenum ores. Potassium ferrocyanide is used in the production of wine and citric acid.[4]

In the laboratory, potassium ferrocyanide is used to determine the concentration of potassium permanganate, a compound often used in titrations based on redox reactions. Potassium ferrocyanide is used in a mixture with potassium ferricyanide and phosphate buffered solution to provide a buffer for beta-galactosidase, which is used to cleave X-Gal, giving a bright blue visualization where an antibody (or other molecule), conjugated to Beta-gal, has bonded to its target.On reacting with Fe(3) it gives a Prussian blue colour. Thus it is used as an identifying reagent for iron in labs

saltpeter- It can also be heated to several hundred degrees to be used for niter bluing, which is less durable than other forms of protective oxidation, but allows for specific and often beautiful coloration of steel parts, such as screws, pins, and other small parts of firearms.

blue vitriol- Copper sulfate can be used as a coloring ingredient in artworks, especially glasses and potteries.

lye-A lye is a liquid metal hydroxide obtained by leaching ashes (containing largely potassium carbonate or "potash"), or a strong alkali which is highly soluble in water producing caustic basic solutions. "Lye" is commonly an alternative name of sodium hydroxide (NaOH) or historically potassium hydroxide (KOH), though the term "lye" refers to any member of a broad range of metal hydroxides.

sal-ammoniac-It is commonly used to clean the soldering iron in the soldering of stained-glass windows

iron borate- Borax is used in forging. I will just go out on a limb and say this will do the same.

Most of this was from Wikipedia.
 
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