I had a Spyderco Delica lockback fail today.

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kgriggs8

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I am normally a liner lock or a frame lock fan but everyone keeps saying how the lockback is superior to the liner or frame lock. I got a Delica and I was cutting some industrial cling wrap, the kind that they wrap large boxes in. Nothing extreme, just slicing through the plastic wrap and I looked down and the lock has undone itself. I didn't cut myself but I could have. I have no idea how it happened because I was not holding it tight enought to depress the lock and I was not doing anything that could be consider even moderatly brutal. I was just slicing through, it is a sharp knife so I didn't need to use much effort.

I am kind of happy it happened because so many people were telling me that the liner lock is junk and the lock back is so much better. I love the Delica and I will still use it but I am sticking to liners as my primary carry knife from now on. I love Spyderco and I am not saying that they did a bad job or anything. I wouldn't be surprised if a liner lock would have failed doing the same thing (well actually I would because I was very surprised that the Delica came unlocked). It just goes to show me that all locks can fail and I really do not believe that lock backs are any better than a good liner or frame lock and I like them better anyway.

In a way, I feel vindicated. In extreme use, the lock back is probably a stronger design but in everyday use, I don't think it matter at all. I am not going to pry up any manhole covers with any knife so I think I am fine with liners and frame locks.
 
This sounds like the classic case of pocket lint blocking the lock to me. Have you checked the lock or the blade for lint lately?

Either that or you accidentally depressed the lock somehow without realizing it or as I said above it was barred from seating all the way or not at all.
 
It is supposed to be going back anyway because there are flaws in the steel. It is like air bubbles or pock marks along the back of the spine. It is almost new so there was not any dirt or lint in it. I just wanted to use it a little before I sent it back to Spyderco.

I must have pressed the lock somehow or maybe the blade snagged on the plastic and caused it to unlock somehow. I don't know but since it was going back anyway, I wanted to at least try it out to see what it can do. I didn't want to send it back without ever using it.

Anyway, I have had liner locks and frame locks come unlocked as well it just kind of made me feel better to know that they can all fail. I love liner locks and frame locks so at least I am not stuck with and inferior lock design just because I find it more comfortable.
 
Well I suppose any lock can fail somehow, but I don't see how a lock-back could fail doing the task that you were doing.

IMO, the only way that it could have failed was:
1) It was'nt really locked to begin with. But since the Delica makes that distinctive "clack" sound when you open it, I think you would know if it did'nt lock.
2) You somehow disengaged the lock in your grip.
3) The springbar came loose from the handle and there was no pressure keeping the blade open--but I also think you would have noticed this too.

I'll still take a lockback over a liner-lock any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Allen.
 
Maybe they'll work out what happened to the lock when they have a look at what happened to the steel.

Please let us know if they tell you anything useful.
 
Try and AXIS lock. :) Mine gets lots of lint in it and it still works. Never had one fail yet.
 
I have had liner locks fail on me but never a lockback unless you count breaking one or two over time. I believe the next best thing to a fixed blade is a lockback then a compression lock and if I do buy a knife with a liner lock I make sure it is a bloody good one.
 
kgriggs8 said:
I am not going to pry up any manhole covers with any knife so I think I am fine with liners and frame locks.
Click to expand...
A lot of people posting that this is how they saw releases? Care to note some examples of such?

As for your arguement :

1) no idea why it failed
2) no check on repeatability
3) no comment from the maker to check possible faulty lock

Yes, that seems like a reasonable case to argue that the lockback isn't inherently more stable to me.

Obviously you can get lockbacks that are poor. I had a cold steel one break, not release, but actually break in pieces under very low loads, any decent liner would have been much stronger.

The cold steel lock bar was obviously flawed, problem with the steel, it happens. This doesn't mean all of them are like this, nor that the design has inherent flaws.

stevekt said:
Why would you feel better knowing all locks can fail?
Click to expand...
Standard arguement when defending poor performance is to claim everything has similar standards and thus it isn't really poor. If all locks are instable under torques then the liners have no inherent design weaknesses.

-Cliff
 
Hi Kgriggs8.

Did you spine wack the knife to test the lock after the failure?

Would you be so knind as to ask Amanda to show it to me when you send it in?

sal
 
Yes,lockbacks are not without thier issues.

When you are cutting on a heavy downstroke(which is how most knives are used) you are putting pressure on the back of the handle and guess what,that is where the lock release is!

There are also more parts to break,bend or loose than on a good liner or framelock.
Spring bars have been know to break and spring bar pivot pins could work their way out of the handle-either would render the lockbar useless.

I take comfort knowing that the lock bars on my framelocks are three times or more the thickness of a spring bar in a lockback(when was the last time you saw a framelock bar snap under the conditions that folders are used for).

As to what you have been reading concearning the saftey of a framelock or good liner lock consider this-If you are using a folder in a way in which your hand holding it looses its grip enough to slide across the liner or framelock and cause the lock to release you are most likley doing something you shouldent be doing with a folder anyway.I personally do not cut sideways with a folder,hammer a folders blade into wood and pry it sideways back and forth or anything else to this day that has caused a good linerlock(like a Microtech) or a framelock(like a Sebenza) to come unlocked and cut me.

Point is you should carry what you like and feel safe using, you havent been using inferior folders-sounds like you have allready figured that out.
 
I am sorry to hear about your bad experience with the Delica. My EDC is a Delica and in the few years I've been carying (and abusing) it I never encountered any failures.
I wonder if you could reproduce the malfunction. You could see if there is a mechanical problem or simply an accidental disengage of the lock. Try the spinewhack test or any other (prefferably non destructive) manner to close the knife (without operating the lock, of course). See if it fails and under what circumstances. This will help you make an idea about its limitations and wheather should you send it to Spyderco for repairings.
 
I just tried the spinwhack test. No hint of failure. I just grabbed the knive like I had it when I had the lock fail and pulled the blade towards the rear as if it was under some strain from the plastic not cutting right away. As I pulled the blade back, the lock button gets pressed into my hand and I see the lock start to disengage! The harder you do it, the more it opens. I can easily make it fail by grabbing the blade with two fingers and pulling it back. I don't know if this is a failure or if this is the way all Delicas are. If some of you fellow Delica owners can test your knife in the way I described, you could fill me in on what happends.

Sal Glesser,
Sir,
I will put a note in the package that you would like to see the knife. Any chance I could trade the Delica in on a Calypso Jr. if I pay the cost difference? ;) ;) I had a Calypso Jr. and thought highly of it. I had no complaints at all. I prefer the tip down carry and flat ground blade as well. Never hurts to ask. :D
 
Firstly, I have carried a Delica as an EDC for sometime now in rotation with a Calypso Jr and had no problems with the lock.

Secondly, I carried out the test you suggested with my Delica - no problems.
 
wire eddge said:
When you are cutting on a heavy downstroke(which is how most knives are used) you are putting pressure on the back of the handle and guess what,that is where the lock release is!
Click to expand...

Yes, but even if you press the release, you won't release the blade, that can happen only on the upward stroke, were you don't put weight on it.



wire eddge said:
Spring bars have been know to break and spring bar pivot pins could work their way out of the handle-either would render the lockbar useless.
Click to expand...

What do you mean by spring bar? The actual SRPING bar or the lockbar? I have never heard of a spring bar breaking, it doesn't bear any load. By the time the pins come through your FRN, you are putting some serious load on the lock. A load so high that most linerlock would be questionable as far as they are tested (in the 300# range for a 3 in folder).

wire eddge said:
I take comfort knowing that the lock bars on my framelocks are three times or more the thickness of a spring bar in a lockback
Click to expand...

Again I assume you mean the lockbar, otherwise your point would be moot. Have you seen the lockbar of a Chinook or Manix? You are not able to bend or break that in you hands let alone just with you thumb. The actual thickness of the lock bar even of a framelock were it bends is not overly thick. Not to mention that lock back lockbars are hardnened for maximum strength while the lockbar of a linerlock has two parameters to be optimized for (spring and strength). Last but not least the tension strength of steel is many times higher than its compression strength.

Actually I have nothing against liner or frame locks. If they are well made they are certainly strong enough for my purposes, but that doesn't change the facts.
 
Hi Kgriggs8.

I'll be happy to replace it with any current model of equivalent value.

However, if the lock didn't defeat with a spine wack, then it's hard to understand why the lock "failed". The lock on an FRN Delica runs about 290 inch/lbs.

I can't replace it with a Caly jr. That model has been disco'd and we don't have any. Sorry.

sal
 
I would like for someone to show me a frame-lock with the lock-bar THREE times the thickness of the Delica's spring bar.

And the real bad thing about frame-locks and liner-locks is that if the geometry is'nt just right, it does'nt matter how thick the lock-bar is for the lock to fail.
And another bad thing about a liner-lock or frame-lock is that it can APPEAR to be locked up solid and still fail the slightlest spine-whack.

good luck,
Allen.
 
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