I met a knifemaker this weekend....

J.Marsillo

J.Marsillo

Joined
Nov 8, 2000
Messages
1,255
Here's what he told me...start out with 5160 or 6150 for the first 10 years, its an idiots steel.He wouldnt mention any other steel's and told me not to waste my time with low perfomance steels such as W-2 any 10XX or springs and such.I cant argue with the quality of his work its very impressive,on the same note i cant seem to take anything out of my head about W-2(Morans favorite?) or any 10 series steels.:confused:
He also left me with this peice of advice humming in my head "the secret is in the blue" referring to proper forge atmosphere,"work the steel until you can get no scale to form at all for one straight hour"....Isnt that impossible unless you are in a room devoid of oxygen ? Decarb forms at a rate of 1/32" per hour :eek: maybe i missed something on that??
I'm about ready to order some prcision ground flat stock and start sending out for HT.
sorry for the drunken rant but i need to reinforce everything ive learned so far :confused:
 
The biggest secret in the industry is that most knifemaker's don't know much. That doesn't mean a whole lot in regards to their final product, but the BS I've heard and read is stacking up, and the pile gets bigger with the more I learn.
 
5160 and 6150 are both "low preforance" spring steels (his words). W2 will also out cut these spring steels by a bunch, maybe not bend as much but out cut, yes.

I don't even know what to say about his blue forging practice :confused:

As Larrin said. Lota BS in this game.
 
Valimas, it appears that your B.S. detector is working just fine. You'll get used to the blowhards, their useless babble, and how to flush it out of your headgear. IMHO there is something to be said for experimentation and testing. I'm sorry you had that experience.:D
 
Joe , there are people like myself , who try very hard to destroy he myths and BS. Stay with this forum ,the more you learn the more the BS will be obvious !!
 
All you can do is smile and let folks like this fellow run out of wind ... then move on. You can't argue with 'em (unless there's good reason to do so, such as others being misled within earshot, but generally it's a fruitless endeavor).
 
I wonder if by "in the blue" means to keep the flame blue - propane rich environment, rather than oxygen rich (green to yellow to orange flame). In that case, it's good advice for keeping scale under control. But you'll still have it once you pull the knife out of the forge.


5160 is a simple steel to work with...but I do not believe it to be low performance. 10xx steels are also spring steels. Both are used by many knifemakers and you can count on one of them to show up at nearly every cutting competition around.


That said...I think the knife world could benefit from a Discovery-Channel-sponsored-show titled "Knifemaking: Myth Busters" or something like that.

Led, of course, by Kevin Cashen. :D
 
I don't know who called the pica lo player a S.O.B, But what I want to know is who called that S.O.B. a Pica lo player. Just smile and walk guy. That guy is as squirrelly as a city slicker at a Texas rattle snake round up. Besides, he just admitted to you that it took him at least 10 years to advance past crap materials. That should be a one week course. Mike
 
All the knife steels out there with just a few exceptions will make excellent blades. Some will hold an edge slightly longer, some will sharpen a little easier, some are a little tuffer, some are stainless, some take a finner edge, some just plain cut better. Bottom line, the best magicle high performance steel never envisioned by man with a crappy heat treat can be out performed by the simplist cheap steel with a correct heat treat. Everything is a trade off, the trick is to get a well ballanced steel and heat treat it correctly, wether it's W-1 or S30V.

Test and test and test some more. When you think you've got a good steel and heat treat combo don't be afraid to experiment with anouther steel and heat treat. I should also add that edge geomitry plays a roll here, some steels you can get away with a thinner edge than others, and a thin edge cuts better. Of course a chopper will need a thicker edge.

I'd suggest 5160 or 1084 or O-1 or starting, they make excellent knives and are somewhat more forgiving than some of the other steels. Doesn't mean there inferior, just have differant properties and can make outstanding knives.
 
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