I must be back in the stone age

[PartialSerrations]

I don't know if a thread has been started so if there is one, please direct me to it. I have handled a lot of knives and I learn something new everyday about knife steels. In today's knife world we want a knife to hold an edge forever and be easily resharpened. Todays newer steels such as S30V and ZDP 189 are extremely hard and require you to use a diamond hone to sharpen them. They are extremely hard and many knifemakers are working harder than ever to make it their steel of choice in custom knife making. I do not like to take a lot of time to sharpen a knife. I want to run it across my sharpmaker a few times and strop it and that's it. I prefer a once adored 440 C steel due to the ease of sharpening. Many users prefer harder steels because they want the edge to last forever. Does the edge really last that much longer? A properly heat treated 440 C steel is all the knife you will need in my opinion? I have handled 154cm and ATS 34 as well due to the fact that I can get them shaving sharp. BG 42 is another steel that is relatively easy to sharpen and no special stones are required either. A lot of knife makers still use it. Share with me your thoughts.

 

[Cobalt]

I think this is always a good throwaround topic. Knife steels are constantly changing. There are Fads that come and go like Vascowear and nitinol and other stuff. Sometimes these fads turn out better metals, but usually not. You cannot go wrong with the tried and true steels and there isn't any one steel that is the best at everything. I am wary of new super steels as they are usually not as super as people say they are.

I like the comrpomise steels. They do not excel at any one thing but do very well in all departments.

The steels you mention are tried and true and do very well overall. I like 440C as a general knife steel for all around use. ATS34/154cm is also a good steel for all around general use and D2 is even better IMO, but I like the tried and true non stainless steels as well, such as 52100, 5160, A2, etc.

In my opinion it is the knife design and heat treating that makes all the difference. A master heat treater can do wonders with an average steel.

Hollow ground, flat ground or saber ground blades for different uses. Edge types also. look at what the convex edge on a CS trailmaster can do on freehanging rope. Impressive.

There are many well known knifemake4rs that swear by 440C an I have no issue with this, as I like the steel.

I'd also like to hear what other serious knife users as well as knifemakers prefer as their steel of choice for all pupose use.

 

[Dog of War]

While it's true that very hard tool steel and certain high alloy stainless blades can be slower and more difficult to work on ordinary stones (Arkansas, SiC, AO) that's only a factor if you're doing heavy reprofiling or removing extensive damage. For touch-ups and general maintenance sharpening very hard and high alloy steels IMO really aren't a problem, as all these media are still much harder than steel.... plus with high HRC steels there's generally less tendency to form large and stubborn burrs.... AND with better edge retention you'll spend less time sharpening anyway. So to me, high hardness - high wear resistance - superior edge retention are good trade-offs against slower removal of metal when sharpening.

 

[Cobalt]

all true. and to add to your comments. I like ceramics for sharpening versus diamond hones, because I like to remove the least amount of metal as is possible. Diamond hones can really take off metal on an edge.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Todays newer steels such as S30V and ZDP 189 are extremely hard and require you to use a diamond hone to sharpen them.

S30V is usually hardened to 58/60 HRC, this is not very hard for a cutlery steel, ZDP-189 is harder but nothing new hardness wise for knives. People have been using hard blade steels for a long time, 64-65 HRC, you don't need diamond abrasives to sharpen them either. Diamonds are nice for the final finishing on some steels, and it isn't like they are expensive or hard to get.

I do not like to take a lot of time to sharpen a knife. I want to run it across my sharpmaker a few times and strop it and that's it.

This has to do more with how the knife is ground and the suitability of the steel to the tasks it is being used for than the machinability of the steel. If the machinability is an issue with sharpening then something has gone very wrong.

Does the edge really last that much longer?

A harder steel can last many to one time longer, more wear resistance can translate to greater slicing aggression, it also allows you to grind thinner profiles so the knife cuts better and since it is harder it can cut more things without damage and be easier to sharpen . Ref :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=364976

-Cliff

 

[yoda4561]

Assuming no serious damage or reprofiling I find the very hard steels easier to resharpen, the edge gets cut nice and crisp, with minimal burr formation if any.

 

[Artfully Martial]

Edge longevity can be a big deal to those who can't resharpen easily in the field.

440C and AUS8 are fine with me, use them all the time. I prefer D2 and VG10 though. VG10 just seems to be sharper (maybe it's all in my head) and D2 seems to be invincible (I've never had to sharpen my D2 knives, so can't say on the difficulty there)