I think I want some waterstones

B

bgentry

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Aug 3, 2009
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The idea of waterstones appeals to me; what I've seen on video looks fun; seems like a slightly different experience. I also just kinda want to see "how the other half lives" if that makes sense.

I have several types of sharpening stones: Norton Crystolon/India, Spyderco medium and fine profile stones, DMT 8x3 XXC, C, and EF, plus some other random stuff I don't really use.

Steels I want to sharpen: Mostly basic stuff like VG10, 8Cr13MoV, and German stainless kitchen knives. I have one ZDP-189 blade, and will probably end up with some S30V, and perhaps AEB-L. I'd like to be able to sharpen any blade I might come across for friends or maybe even as a hobby business.

Finish I want: I'm mostly interested in cutting performance. Though I must admit that I don't have a solid grasp of what types of finishes perform best in what media. For food, I like an edge that can grab soft material and slice through it. For looks I'd love to produce some of the perfect mirror edges I see on display on this forum and elsewhere. If those mirror edges slide off of slick material when trying to cut it, I guess it's mostly just for show, but I've never experienced one; I only know that my "polished" edges seem to slide off of plastic zip ties and things like that.

Money: I've already got way too much money sunk into sharpening gear. My sharpening box must weigh 25 pounds, plus other stuff stowed away. But I'm willing to put down more money if it's worth it. I'm torn between trying a "starter stone" for say $50 or under, or buying something that I'll just end up buying eventually anyway. Presuming that I'm going to really enjoy waterstones, my budget could go to $200 or so, though I'd like it to be less.

Stones I've seen recommended:

Nubatama: Ume 1k, Bamboo 150, Bamboo 5k. Seems great, but polishes to a "hazy finish"? Sort of expensive at over $200.
Bester: 1.2k gets rave reviews except that you have to soak it.
Arashayama: 1k and 6k get Knifenut approval. Better than the Nubatama? Equal? Price is about the same and I'd need something more abrasive for repairs and reprofiles.
Naniwa SuperStones: Seem to get very good reviews and are 30 to 40% less than Nubatama and Arashayama.

I think that about covers it. Thanks for any advice you can offer.

Brian.
 
Go with the Nubatama set and don't look back. Best stones you will ever purchase... Well... I might be a little bias :)

The Arashiyama stones are very good especially the 6k but not on the same level as the Nubatama stones. Great upgrade from the basic king stone.

The Naniwa SS are also good stones if you sharpen razors because they polish to a insane level. The 3k for example will best most 6-8k stones in finish, nearly a perfect mirror. This also means a very slick edge which I take your not exactly looking for. The low grits also wear very quickly and combined with being a very soft stone I can't recommend them for knife sharpening.

The Naniwa chosera line is excellent for knife sharpening, I didn't like them at first but they are growing on me. Most of the chosera stones are VERY hard almost like spyderco ceramics which didn't appeal to me but after a few months of playing with them they have shown their value. They are a all business stone and leave a "hazy finish" because even at high grits they don't really polish. The edges stay toothy at high grits. Only drawback is they tend to produce more burr that's harder to remove.

There is a much deeper story behind the bester stone, its good but promoted highly for somewhat of the wrong reasons.

Last but not least the Nubatama stones,

Nubatama stones were developed for those looking for a premium waterstone that had more than one inviting feature. They "polish" like a natural stone which creates a better cutting edge especially at higher grits. They also mesh well with natural stones allowing for a easy transition. These may not seem like huge differences but for someone like myself they allow me to sharpen a wide range of cutlery without issue.

The best feature of the Nubatama stones is the cutting speed, they are the fastest stones I have ever used and provide the best cutting edges I have experienced. Even steels with up to 4% vanadium I would say they beat diamond stones and do it in style :D
 
knifenut1013 said:
Nubatama stones were developed for those looking for a premium waterstone that had more than one inviting feature. They "polish" like a natural stone which creates a better cutting edge especially at higher grits. They also mesh well with natural stones allowing for a easy transition. These may not seem like huge differences but for someone like myself they allow me to sharpen a wide range of cutlery without issue.

The best feature of the Nubatama stones is the cutting speed, they are the fastest stones I have ever used and provide the best cutting edges I have experienced. Even steels with up to 4% vanadium I would say they beat diamond stones and do it in style :D
Click to expand...

You make them sound like the best of the best. Very, very tempting. Couple of questions:

1. I'm not interested in natural stones. I don't have the money or the mentality. I'm guessing this is just a side benefit. If I don't care about that, do you still recommend Nubatama to me?
2. CKTG has a "set" paired up that I mentioned in my initial post: Bamboo 150, Ume 1k, and Bamboo 5k. Is that what you'd recommend too? 150 grit seems like it should remove metal very fast; sorta like my DMT XXC. 5k should be far more polish than the DMT EF or even the Spyderco fine white.
3. Is it safe to flatten these with the XXC and not damage it?
4. I guess I'd need my diamonds again if I want to sharpen something like S90V, which has something like 9% vanadium? Metal chemistry is not something I know a lot about. I just looked up a "high end wear resistant steel" to see how much vanadium it had to compare to your 4% figure.

Thanks for the help. I enjoy this community. :)

Brian.
 
1. Yes, because they still have all the other benefits.
2. It's a great starter combo. If you do try and tackle more wear resistant steels though you will find more stones to be needed. Keeping a tighter grit progression is a must with high wear steels though switching to your diamond or ceramic hones would likely be the ideal route in such cases.
3. Yes, with the 5k I would recomend a finer method after the flattening though. Some sandpaper around 1k or even the 1k Ume stone would do, its just a surfaced e texture thing.
4. Yes, everything has its limits.

I use daily a 180, 1k and 5k bamboo stone to sharpen mainly kitchen knives and the occasional folder/hunting knife. The only "issue" I sometimes run into the the need for a stone between the 1k and 5k on harder more wear resistant steels. This can often be corrected by making a little mud on the 5k but not always. It's a minor issue and one you will probably notice on the ZDP. In these cases I usually just microbevel or simply not worry about it, 5k is a very fine finish and leaving a bit of tooth from the 1k by just lightly polishing with the 5k gives a good performing edge.

As a example,

I carry a CPM-M4 spyderco mule team, the 1k to 5k jump is too large for the wear resistance of the steel so I microbevel the edge on the 5k and call it good. Takes me all of 2 minutes and the edge is silly sharp, I use this knife daily so easy maintenance is what I look for. I could use my diamond stones but truthfully I get a better edge from the Nubatama's.
 
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