Recommendation? I'm having a hard time figuring out what I should do to prepare my knife (3/16th 1095 annealed) for quenching and tempering.

C

Carl_74

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May 23, 2023
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I have canola oil and I'm making a tank for quenching but I don't have an electric kiln or a consistent way of heating the blade. I have an acetylene torch and propane tanks I can refill but I'm not sure what steps I should take to make sure it comes out hard enough before tempering. I would like to know if I should do a quick low heat run before a final heat and quench. I have been mostly filing it so it doesn't really get very hot to cause stress points but should I heat it first or go for the quench without it. Not sure how much it matters.
 
You probably want to ask this over in the “Shop Talk” forum in the Knifemakers section. Lots of knowledge over there.
 
So a bit under 5mm thick, how long is it? Have you filed in bevels yet?
Using canola oil and without a good heat source it'll all be a bit imprecise whatever you do, so don't sweat it too much. Getting some kaowool or similar would help you build a crude shell to trap the heat. Place the blade in the shell and heat the spine, trying to get as even a heat as possible on the edge without overheating it. Then quech in the oil.
You want at least 4L of oil and to have heated it to around 60c.
You probably can't get a consistent enough heat with a torch to make thermal cycling worth while. At this stage it won't get hot enough to cause problems unless you're forging; you are worried about grain growth not detempering, and grain growth happens above 800-900c

Sending it out to a heat treatment service would also be an option
 
Alex Topfer said:
So a bit under 5mm thick, how long is it? Have you filed in bevels yet?
Using canola oil and without a good heat source it'll all be a bit imprecise whatever you do, so don't sweat it too much. Getting some kaowool or similar would help you build a crude shell to trap the heat. Place the blade in the shell and heat the spine, trying to get as even a heat as possible on the edge without overheating it. Then quech in the oil.
You want at least 4L of oil and to have heated it to around 60c.
You probably can't get a consistent enough heat with a torch to make thermal cycling worth while. At this stage it won't get hot enough to cause problems unless you're forging; you are worried about grain growth not detempering, and grain growth happens above 800-900c

Sending it out to a heat treatment service would also be an option
Click to expand...
Thanks for the the help. I'm currently working on finishing the bevels and as it's probably not going to turn out perfect but I just want to actually finish a knife for once and have it be somewhat functional. Surprisingly I haven't seen or come across the kaowool method you mentioned and I'll definitely look into it.
 
Yeah, may as well have a go

I was thinking something like what Quinn Dunki builds for soldering in this video:
A forge/kiln is primarily a way to concentrate heat around a workpiece, the exact heat source is a secondary aspect
 
If you’re just doing stock removal on annealed steel, you can go straight to the heat and quench steps. However, to get the most out of 1095, you need a consistent heat temp, 10 minute soak time, and a fast quenchant. Canola oil is ok in a pinch, but for 1095, you would be better off using a fast quenchant like brine.
 
I did my first heat treats with a brick forge. I stacked some firebricks and used a propane weed burner for heat.

I strongly suggest you practice using scraps of 1095 and use a magnet to train your eyes.
 
No need to do any additional normalizing or pre-heat treatments on a stock removal 1095 project. Heat to your austenitization temp & oil quench.

As mentioned above, you won’t get the best out of 1095 this way, but you can get a serviceable blade and some learning experience with what you have. We all start somewhere. Good luck, & please share your results!
 
Thanks for the information. I'll be posting it once I get it finished. Might be a while.
 
Don't file the bevels too thin. You want the edge to be around .03-04" thick. Make sure you sand them smooth and get rid of all the deep file marks and scratches before HT. Take the bevels to a m=nice clean 220 grit for HT. After HT, start back at 100 grit and go up to 400.

A torch will work fine if it is big enough. As suggested, some firebricks (soft type) stacked to make an L or U will help heat the blade more evenly.
I used to use a propane Prest-0-lite plumber's torch. If using an A/O torch, don't use much oxygen. You don't need a high temperature flame like for welding.
Use a magnet to check if the blade is hot enough. When the blade stops sticking to the magnet you are about 50°F below the temperature for the quench. The blade should be a medium red when it is ready, not bright cherry red (too hot).

The canola oil needs to be warmed to around 120°F for the quench. No higher than 130°F. You can heat a metal bar or rod and quench it a couple times to warm the oil.

If you fill in your profile with the information and your location someone near you may offer to help with the HT.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Don't file the bevels too thin. You want the edge to be around .03-04" thick. Make sure you sand them smooth and get rid of all the deep file marks and scratches before HT. Take the bevels to a m=nice clean 220 grit for HT. After HT, start back at 100 grit and go up to 400.

A torch will work fine if it is big enough. As suggested, some firebricks (soft type) stacked to make an L or U will help heat the blade more evenly.
I used to use a propane Prest-0-lite plumber's torch. If using an A/O torch, don't use much oxygen. You don't need a high temperature flame like for welding.
Use a magnet to check if the blade is hot enough. When the blade stops sticking to the magnet you are about 50°F below the temperature for the quench. The blade should be a medium red when it is ready, not bright cherry red (too hot).

The canola oil needs to be warmed to around 120°F for the quench. No higher than 130°F. You can heat a metal bar or rod and quench it a couple times to warm the oil.

If you fill in your profile with the information and your location someone near you may offer to help with the HT.
Click to expand...
Thanks for helping me out with this. I wasn't really sure on the thickness and I wasn't entirely sure about using the acetylene torch. I'll definitely update my profile.
 
Sando said:
I did my first heat treats with a brick forge. I stacked some firebricks and used a propane weed burner for heat.

I strongly suggest you practice using scraps of 1095 and use a magnet to train your eyes.
Click to expand...

I made, and still use, the exact same set up. It worked pretty well, fairly even heating.
 
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