I'm not a RECOMMENDED BUYER ON EBAY.

koldgold

koldgold

Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
1,441
Last month I bid on a Schrade knife Display containing 5 knives, the seller had listed this Display as "MINT".
As I had a set the same as this one in my collection already, I bid top dollar for this “Mint set”.
However, Living in Australia, ment the Postage Costs are high between the U.S. and Australia.

When the Display arrived, water had been on the knives for some time and they were rusty, one knife had a crack in the bone scale!
I sent it back to the seller for “A full refund” – as I believe the Display was not “As the seller had described it”.

My postage cost to send the Display back to the seller was almost A$70.
The seller gave me a full refund, and left this feedback on ebay, NOT A RECOMMENDED BUYER.

As a buyer, did I do something wrong? Sending this “Mint Display” back to this seller, that often sells knives?

This is the first time I have run into a seller like this on ebay in many years, Just look at my feedback.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/200947775054?ss ... 370wt_1285

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THAT IS RUST IN THE NAILPULLS - YES RUST ON A STAINLESS BLADE.
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Something happened to that display between the time that the seller photographed it and when you received it. Those red rub marks (?) or stains around the peanut aren't in his pictures. But because the surface tear is the same, I know it's the same display.

And the red stuff in the thumb nails? It's not rust, is it? Those blades are stainless.

Regardless, the seller should have been happy to take it back since you paid postage. And no, I wouldn't call that set "mint", and the construction defect on the one knife should have been disclosed.
 
koldgold said:
The seller gave me a full refund, and left this feedback on ebay, NOT A RECOMMENDED BUYER.
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According to eBay policy, the seller can't leave any negative comments or insinuations for you, the buyer. All you need to do is contact eBay and they will remove the feedback.
 
Hi Bob,
If you look under the Peanut you can see a water stain. Water had been in the indentations in the Display for some time.
And yes “Something happened to that display between the time that the seller photographed it and when you received it”.
The seller did not support the knives in any way, so they were all let move around in the Display.
That is why “Those red rub marks (?) or stains around the peanut aren't in his pictures. But because the surface tear is the same, I know it's the same display”.

“And the red stuff in the thumb nails? It's not rust, is it? Those blades are stainless.”

Well yes it is rust,
and it came from the carbon steel springs; and yes Stainless Blade Steel does rust, because it has more carbon in it, then say Surgical Stainless Steel that will not rust.
Even Marine Stainless Steel will stain or tarnish because of the small amount of carbon in it.
As for the large crack in the bone scale, on one of the knives - I would not say that was Mint...
The rust on the Peanut's back springs was quite deep, and could not be removed....Ken
 
Returns when the buyer and seller are on different continents pose a problem. Especially as it applies to shipping costs on large items. Sounds like a case of bad photography for the auction (old pictures?) and poor shipping practices too. This is the ugly side of doing business on Ebay.
 
Two of the most overused words on ebay are "mint" and "rare".I refuse to buy anything with those words in the description.They just set my BS meter into overdrive. :)
 
JTR357 said:
Two of the most overused words on ebay are "mint" and "rare".I refuse to buy anything with those words in the description.They just set my BS meter into overdrive. :)
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I'm partial to the term "cleaned to near mint" when coupled with blurry pictures.
 
JTR357 said:
Two of the most overused words on ebay are "mint" and "rare".I refuse to buy anything with those words in the description.They just set my BS meter into overdrive. :)
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I agree!

Mint is for coins and after dinner treats and rare is for beef.

Knives are not minted!

I wish people would leave the hype behind and accurately describe the items, or just can it and say "see photos".

As a fan if vintage razors, I read descriptions for the sole purpose of finding clues with regard to the ignorance of the seller (not derogatory, many sellers really don't know what they are selling). Educated buyers generally care about their reputation and will answer honestly (usually) ignorant sellers have no basis for terms like mint, perfect, grail, great condition, etc (and I don't think they are necessarily nefarious, they just don't know what they are talking about).

As to the topic at hand, if you return something, do not expect the seller (who paid for the fees and watched other potential buyers get outbid, then move on to spend their money elsewhere) to want to deal with you again or recommend you to others. Right or wrong, it is the way it is on eBay.
 
Hi Hal, and UNIT.
I rely on two things when buying anything; when I cannot see the item in person.

(1) I expect the seller to at least look at the item, he has for sale; and this seller did not do that.

I then rely on the seller’s opinion of the condition of the item, he has for sale.
The use of the word mint to me; indicates the seller thinks the item is as good as it was from new - give or take some small marks from age or handling.

This item was never sold from new, with Rust or a crack in one of the bone scales.

(2) I rely on the photography supplied by the seller; In this case the seller’s photos were OK, the item looked OK to me. (From the Photos supplyed)

There was a water stain showing in the photos, under the Peanut. However, the Rust under all of the knives were not shown.

I also fell that all buyers; assume the seller, will secure and protect all items to be transported by mail.

I blame the seller for not looking at this item, when listing it as MINT.

The seller gave me a Full Refund, and that cost him about $60, and I had to pay $60 to return the item.

I also belive this could have had a better ending, if the seller was prepared to discount the item, by a little nogosiation with me.
 
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koldgold said:
Hi Hal, and UNIT.
I rely on two things when buying anything; when I cannot see the item in person.

(1) I expect the seller to at least look at the item, he has for sale; and this seller did not do that.

I then rely on the seller’s opinion of the condition of the item, he has for sale.
The use of the word mint to me; indicates the seller thinks the item is as good as it was from new - give or take some small marks from age or handling.

This item was never sold from new, with Rust or a crack in one of the bone scales.

(2) I rely on the photography supplied by the seller; In this case the seller’s photos were OK, the item looked OK to me. (From the Photos supplyed)

There was a water stain showing in the photos, under the Peanut. However, the Rust under all of the knives were not shown.

I also fell that all buyers; assume the seller, will secure and protect all items to be transported by mail.

I blame the seller for not looking at this item, when listing it as MINT.

The seller gave me a Full Refund, and that cost him about $60, and I had to pay $60 to return the item.

I also belive this could have had a better ending, if the seller was prepared to discount the item, by a little nogosiation with me.
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Hey, no offense, but this sounds like a defense/ counter attack you are stating for your case.


In your OP you asked if you did something wrong.

I am just stating my understanding and expectations of how things work on eBay. See, really there is no right or wrong, there is just the way it is...and that way is subject to change with the people participating in the transactions.

You can expect and demand all you want, but the reality is what it is, and you likely won't get everyone to conform to your expectations. Given this probable fact, you are left with the choice to go forth educated with the insights I and others provided, or go forth expecting that every item is going to be explained as you suggest and photographed as you suggest. I will suggest that a lot of sellers are ignorant (compared to a collector's knowledge pool) and perhaps sell many items and simply don't have the time or inclination to explain/describe/photograph in the capacity some of us might want.

If you are seeking statements from people here as to which side they take, I'll suggest that you will get people from both sides speaking up. But none of their opinions matter in my opinion because the deal is done and we are all left with nothing other than an opportunity to learn from it.

I hope this doesn't anger you, I'm just not sure what your intentions are here.

One other thought. If a guy has an item like this and never touched it and it cracks/rusts/degrades naturally is it better or worse than the same item that was removed from the package/container/display by a non-collector and (perhaps only the exposed surfaces) slathered with rust inhibitor and then stored in humid conditions to prevent the scale cracks?

I ask because this is another conundrum we see frequently with NOS antiques...and it gets argued both ways. The result of these conversations is (almost always), that the item is what it is and it's up to the seller to figure out a value and bid accordingly.

Buyer's research is generally done with questions and photos. Study photos and ask questions. If your research indicates that the seller is ignorant (on the level of your collection standards) or otherwise unwilling to clarify things for you, it is up to you to bid/buy accordingly.
 
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Well put Unit. Great example of the "cost of doing business on Ebay", and it exposes the risk of buying stuff in another country when shipping costs are at stake. If it were a domestic transaction, it would not have been as big a deal. I learned right away that selling big heavy items is not as convenient as small compact items, and vise versa with purchasing. A seller covers himself for this fact, not the buyer.
 
As a buyer, did I do something wrong? >>> Technically, no. The item was described as "mint." The item was, in eBay parlance, "not as described."

With that said, it is clear from the original listing photos (Auctiva photos = typically of higher resolution than those hosed by eBay) that the item ... at least the (stained) foam insert and the nail pull on the peanut ... was not "mint." Thus I can only reasonably suspect that at the time of purchase you knew you were not getting an item that appeared as it did on the day it left the factory. Unfortunately for you, it arrived in even less "mint" condition than depicted.

Knives shipped along with display case, or a box for that matter, should be individually wrapped. Expecting a knife to remain secure within its associated recess in the foam insert during shipping is unreasonable. It could also be dangerous. I'm surprised this seller, with almost 7,000 feedback rating, opted to ship in such an amateurish fashion.

I agree that a post-sale negotiation would've made this deal much sweeter, with the seller offering, and you accepting, a reasonable partial refund. After all, this ain't a bad set of knives. Not mint, but not bad. I'd like one for my collection.

Finally, The seller is in violation of eBay policy by leaving derogatory feedback. I would ask eBay to remove it if I were you. The seller might receive an admonition also.
 
citytransplant said:
As a buyer, did I do something wrong? >>> Technically, no. The item was described as "mint." The item was, in eBay parlance, "not as described."


The seller is in violation of eBay policy by leaving derogatory feedback. I would ask eBay to remove it if I were you. The seller might receive an admonition also.
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Ebay just sent me an email saying "They find nothing wrong with the sellers remarks". It looks like the seller was within eBay's gidelines after all.
 
This reminds me of debating the results in the NFL when the verdict comes in on an instant replay review.
 
koldgold said:
Ebay just sent me an email saying "They find nothing wrong with the sellers remarks". It looks like the seller was within eBay's gidelines after all.
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or maybe not:

This comment has been removed by eBay. Learn more. Buyer: koldgold (672) Aug-31-13 07:22
VINTAGE SCHRADE + USA OLD TIMER SPECIAL EDITION KNIFE SET BONE (#200947775054)
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This is a reply eBay sent today after, I received the first "We can not help reply"

"Thanks for getting back to us.
I would like to apologize for the wrong information you received from the previous email by my teammate.

Im glad to inform you that I successfully remove the negative feedback in your profile since it falls under the category for feedback removal.
We just need to wait for it to disappear on the system."
 
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