In Re: Buck's Rendition of 420J2?

afishhunter

afishhunter

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It is my understanding the Buck 371 Stockman, and 389 Canoe, (among others that I don't have) are equipped with 420J2 blades.

Does Buck use a special heat treat on their 420J2, and/or run it at a higher Rockwell than "everyone else"?
I haven't noticed my two 371 stockman's and single 389 canoe dulling any faster/more often than my 301 with 420HC, when used for the same tasks.

I will be among the first to admit my years of "Hard Use" are long over.
At most I've been "Medium Use", (if not "Light Use") for the most part, over the last 4 - 5, or so years.
However, even in 2014-2015, prior to my being forced to retire from driving an expedited box truck ocean to ocean, and border to Gulf/border, in 2017, and still had "hard use", I didn't consider the 420J2 to be noticeably "inferior" in usability and edge holding, compared to my 420HC Buck knives, or my Rough Rider's with 440A come to that.
Pretty much everything I've read online concerning 420J2 claims it is "soft" and incapable of holding an edge. That's not what I've experienced with Buck's rendition of 420J2.

UNRELATED QUESTION:
Does "Surgical Instruments" include scalpels and other blades used in the O.R., or just forceps, scissors and cups/pans/trays, etc., commonly located and used the O.R.?
 
OK, I got off the couch. 420J2 is listed at 53-55 and 420HC is 58 Rockwell so 4 points lower.
Real world meaning, I have no idea but I bet it is not worse than the Camillus 440A.
Tasks for a pocket knife do not include skinning out a full Elk so as your real world
experience shows it is just fine for pocket knife needs.
Some steel expert will surely wander in here....

420J2 001.JPG
 
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According to the wife, surgical instruments include pretty much everything on the prep table.
If they use it on you in surgery, it's included....
.....even the occasional kazoo if the doctor is a hack.

Edit.
A slide whistle would be really funny.
 
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I have a 371 stockman with a 2018 date code. At the time I bought it, I specifically chose the 371 over the 301 because there were more than a couple of threads where guys were complaining about weak back springs on the 301 (since then I have gotten both a 302 and 303 which have good spring pressure) but the 420J2 steel of the 371 gave me a bit of a question mark. Once I received the knife and began to use it, I can really not tell much of a difference between 420J2 and 420HC. That being said, I don’t use it hard, just typical edc stuff around the office. It has been a good knife. I would certainly buy another if I lost it.
 
longbow1968 said:
I have a 371 stockman with a 2018 date code. At the time I bought it, I specifically chose the 371 over the 301 because there were more than a couple of threads where guys were complaining about weak back springs on the 301 (since then I have gotten both a 302 and 303 which have good spring pressure) but the 420J2 steel of the 371 gave me a bit of a question mark. Once I received the knife and began to use it, I can really not tell much of a difference between 420J2 and 420HC. That being said, I don’t use it hard, just typical edc stuff around the office. It has been a good knife. I would certainly buy another if I lost it.
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Yeah, the 301 does have "light" springs. I'd guess somewhere between a "3" and "4", (if a 92/93mm SAK is a "5"), on the two I have.
Personally, I like the301's "light" backsprings. I never have to fight with the knife to open it when my hands/fingers are cold and/or wet. The springs are plenty strong to hold the blades closed, and to keep them from flopping half closed from gravity, when open. That's the only job the backsprings have.
My 371's and 389 are a little "heavier"/"stiffer": at, or just under, a "5". Again, I don't have to fight with them, or need a tool, to open em'. :D
 
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I can tell the difference between 420j2 and 420hc. both in using and in sharpening. that said I carried a Buck canoe in the 420j2 for awhile and I did plenty with it and it did fine with lighter tasks.

it was easy to touch up and much faster than the 420hc. also way faster and easier to reprofile using less aggresive grits. so there is a real difference between 420j2 and 420hc.
 
I agree with jb, there is a difference in hardness and the edge holding and sharpening. Also about the weak spring complaints. I’ve noticed on my 301s and 303 that they were kinda tight when they were new and had some polish compound in amongst the springs and pivots. After cleaning and lubing they were better and after some use and break in the blades move more freely and have more snap when opening and closing. So instead of weak springs it could be some binding and gunk that makes them seem weak.
 
DeSotoSky said:
OK, I got off the couch. 420J2 is listed at 53-55 and 420HC is 58 Rockwell so 4 points lower.
Real world meaning, I have no idea but I bet it is not worse than the Camillus 440A.
Tasks for a pocket knife do not include skinning out a full Elk so as your real world
experience shows it is just fine for pocket knife needs.
Some steel expert will surely wander in here....

View attachment 1465010
Click to expand...

Per Spyderc's chart 440A has 0.7% carbon and 420j2 has 0.15%. I'd take Camillus over ChinaBuck 420J2. I'm often tempted by the ChinaBuck sale price, but the steel keeps me away.
 
I think very few of us have just one or two Bucks for EDC use in fact most of us here have the exact opposite problem...Too many to choose from lol! So if some of the China Bucks intrigues you give one a try! The difference in steel is small..especially in light use. Most folks have a budget and sometimes the difference in price between the USA and China versions is huge especially for a few of the 300 series. Pick up a used one on the bay and try it. If for some reason it doesn't meet your expectations/needs gift it to a knife less friend. I see China Bucks go incredibly cheep if used and sometimes new. It's STILL a Buck..
 
bucksway said:
I think very few of us have just one or two Bucks for EDC use in fact most of us here have the exact opposite problem...Too many to choose from lol!
Click to expand...

So true, ... so true ...
My Buck collection is minuscule compared to a lot of the fine folks here.
I only have five or six brass or German Silver 110's to choose from (three have upgraded steel: one is a CPM154 drop point, one a S30V, and a circa 1974 or 1974 two dot with 440C. The rest are "only" the standard 420HC) plus two 110 LT's (one a SK Blades "Smoke Jumper" with CPM154, the other a Racer web special with 420HC) and a SK Blades "Lil' Jack 112", and an Made in USA "Walmart Special" 877 fixed blade with white handle, for belt knives.
For the pocket I only have two 301's (standard and the 2018 BF knife), three 371's, each with different covers, one or two 389's, and I forget what 37x number (or is it a 38x number?) jumbo trapper with ultra fine serrated Wharncliffe secondary. (some TV "professional" fisherman signed it. "Bill Dunce" maybe?)

The belt knives really don't compete with the pocket knives for carry time. Truth to tell the 877 doesn't compete with the 110's and 112, either.
I had the local (now late :( ) leathersmith and/or shoe/boot cobbler make a sash sheath of my own design, to carry the 877, (or Mora Number 1 or Cold Steel FINN BEAR), a 110 or 112, (or vintage Old Timer 6OT or 7OT), and a large stockman (or moose, two blade slipjoint folding hunter, or other 4 inch plus closed knife) simultaneously.

On days I don't carry a fixed blade, a 110 or 112, or occasionally a two blade slipjoint folding hunter, or 7OT is on my belt, and at least a stockman is in my pocket.
Since roughly 1963, (first time through third grade. I was in hospital for at least 75% of that school year; mumps, (twice) measles, (twice) pneumonia (at least thrice) chicken pox, and defective tonsils, so my mum demanded I redo 3rd grade. :( Never mind the fact my grades were good enough to advance to the 4th ... and the school district wanted to pass me ...) when I received my second pocket knife, I've never carried just one knife.
 
The last few months I have thought about the China Bucks a little differently than I used to. Buck USA is doing well but many of us,because of Covid-19, are not and 10 or twenty bucks makes a difference. So a cheaper option is welcome. Plus some of the fishing theme slippies are cool!
 
Some guys may hate on me for this, but I would like to see Buck test the waters on bringing back the 317 by offering one in the import line. I would even be okay with the standard wood scales.
 
My 301 that I bought new (about 1970) back in the day is in well earned retirement. Used to carry in EVERY day when I worked in the shop. It never failed me, and I never loaned it to Bubba or anyone else. I could start carrying it again tomorrow and it would do the the same good job. I carry a Delica 4 nowadays so that I don't scratch my Bucks. :-) I also carry a Buck Vantage if I really have to slice something, it's easy to sharpen if necessary, but I usually just strop it.

Have a blessed day,

leon
 
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