INFI - What can it take?

C

Cadman2008

Joined
Apr 20, 2010
Messages
111
My little boss street is having a bad time of it... I decided yesterday (I think. weekend has blurred a bit) to strip the chicken run, and thought I'd use my boss street to just break that one annoying bit of chicken wire (1.0mm, or 1/26th of an inch galvanised wire) by chopping at it with the sharpened blade.

I whacked it 3 times, it dented but didn't chop the wire, and I ended up with 3 small rolled edges on the knife. Now, I know for a fact that the wire is not rated "high tensile", but does the galvanising process harden it? Who knows... Either way, was I being unreasonable in expecting the BS to cut through it without damage?

Just to nip it in the bud, yes I know I should have used a pair of side cutters or pliers, but by the same token I should have probably used an axe or saw to trim that pesky gum tree last night, rather than my BWM. We do strange things with beer in the veins..
 
Used a Lansky to get it to 25 degrees a side (uneven factory grind) then mousepad + 400, 600, 800, 1200 grit paper, then black then green compound loaded strops. It was basically mirror finish on the convex edge. After I had damaged the edge I sat down and spent about 40 min trying to get the dings out again, pretty much finished it now. Honestly tho, looking at that link, I think I might have a problem with it. Maybe my convexing method is over thinning it, but I don't have enough experience in sharpening to know if I've screwed it up. I need a microscope to photograph the edge I think. I might even go try with my crappy $100 digi camera and see what I can do.
 
That sounds like a mad slicer:thumbup:
I would use the hell out of it and see how it holds up.
Warrantied for life so you are covered:D
 
I took it back out and chopped the wire a coupla times, here is the result on the wire:

2roqfl3.jpg


and here is a closeup of the blade. Best as I can get with my crap photo skills, but that big mark is a chip, the pronounced furry bit to the right of the chip is... fur of some kind. ignore that bit.

21nqq1x.jpg


I haven't heated it up, used any power tools on it, so I can't have changed the temper on it. You can see where I've smoothed off the coating using the mousepad/sandpaper thing. I can't get an edge on of the blade, camera just blurs it out each time, even with the macro button and stuff.
 
It's a knife, not a wire cutter. Go to the hardware and invest $10.00 dollars on a pair of side cuts.
 
Good pix:thumbup:

I really have no experience with that wire,
but I am not shocked with the result.
It seems to me that your edge is optimised for slicing,
not heavy duty work.

The magic of INFI is not that it won't damage at the edge if used harshly,
It's that the blade will not fracture, and fail easily.
What looks like a chip is most likely a tear out.
Rolls and dents can be lifted back into line with a butchers steel,
instead of sharpening past the damage, your knife keeps it's original profile longer...

Bet the original Boss st edge would eat that wire:D
Mine rolled out with the cut a sunroof in your truck edge...
 
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Galvanized steel isn't made harder by the galanization process but the process does protect the steel from corrosion. All it is is a coating on the steel that is hard in it's own right but can flak of. Any of us in the Power Line trade and or Power Generation deal with this all the time. What ever you do don't weld on the junk unless you have a force air mask, Zinc fumes are BAD on the body.

When it comes to steel wire I use dikes period. I have used S30V cutting throught copper wire in fact, 4 legs of 16 gage and it cut through them. Have NOT used INFI on copper yet, and most likely NOT. I like my knives to much to blow out an edge. I kinda follow the old rule of thumb and use the proper tool for the job. Drives me nuts seeing people use knife tips as a screw driver....
 
dunno about the edge, but if you'd taken a bigger knife to it i'm sure it would have cut through with ease.
 
I would not consider 25 per side to be too shallow an angle. And it is not too difficult for a hardened steel blade to cut through a mild steel nail. So I am a little surprised at the edge roll.

Those rolls should be easy to steel out.
 
suttond said:
It's a knife, not a wire cutter. Go to the hardware and invest $10.00 dollars on a pair of side cuts.
Click to expand...

I addressed that already, thanks though.

I don't have a problem with having to fix an edge I had intentionally messed up, which that photo represents. My question was, what should the steel be able to take, because the damage to the blade against a 1mm thick piece of wire vs the lack of damage to a thinned fbm against a nail seems inconsistant.
 
Mate I really wouldn't worry about it. Steel on steel will probably almost always dent a little, especially if the cutting edge is so thin. I reckon the wire didn't cut because it's hard up against the wood and you more or less pushed it into the wood a bit. Just steel the dents out or stone them or strop them or whatever. Beat the crap out of the knife, it will handle it, and you'll be a happier man when the knife is looking like it's loved :)
 
I was expecting some real chips or rolls. Can't hardly see those.

But yes, round wire will damage the edge. The edge looks a bit thinner than .25 per side, just judging on what I can eyeball. May have thinned it out more when convexing. Just sharpen her on up, and keep using.


Yes, infi will roll and dent then it cuts harder stuff. It is odd, some times I will do something that should cause major damage (Accidentally chopped a round stone about the size of a black bean in half, not too much edge roll). Pried some floor tacks/plastic shoe's off some furniture, and did some decent damage to the edge.

I have harder steel than Infi, and I have still damaged it, or chipped or snapped some.

Infi is more prone to deform at the edge, rather than actually chip out. But after a good steeling, I am always surprised how well the edge comes back into shape, and how little actually sharpening I normally have to do to fix damage.

But I don't intentionally chop rocks or bricks or steel chains like some on here. I just don't want the extra work it takes to fix.


There are harder steels, or Infi can be hardened to higher levels. What you get when you start focusing on that area, IE, can I chop this wire without deforming, is more performance in that specific area, and less in lateral strength, shock resistance, impact etc. Especially the unintended strikes on rocks etc when chopping. Instead of a large chip, you will get a roll/dent.

Also, when comparing the damage to the edge on a Boss street from chopping chicken wire, and a BM hitting a nail, you are not getting near the amount of force and speed with a Boss street chopper than with a BM, that may have something to do with it. Also, nails are not typically hardened either.

Another thing to think about, some one said that the layer of galvanization will be harder, but also if the wire is old, and oxidized, that layer will be much harder than the layer beneath.

Looking at the photo I don't see chips, but maybe I need a bigger photo etc. I just see a tiny bit of edge deformation .


We could give you a knife with harder steel, but you might not like the result if you applied any real shock or lateral stress to the steel.

Look at knifetests.com to see what am talking about. There are some expensive knives on there, with "super steels" that shatter and break before any real heavy abuse starts, simply because the steel won't take shock or lateral stress at all before failing. The infi does remarkably well with this kind of abuse.
 
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RobStanley said:
Mate I really wouldn't worry about it. Steel on steel will probably almost always dent a little, especially if the cutting edge is so thin. I reckon the wire didn't cut because it's hard up against the wood and you more or less pushed it into the wood a bit. Just steel the dents out or stone them or strop them or whatever. Beat the crap out of the knife, it will handle it, and you'll be a happier man when the knife is looking like it's loved :)
Click to expand...

True, I hit a nail with my NMSFNO when it was brand new. Damn was I pissed. Since then, I've beat the crap out of it and haven't regretted anything. It adds character to the knife.
 
M67 said:
True, I hit a nail with my NMSFNO when it was brand new. Damn was I pissed. Since then, I've beat the crap out of it and haven't regretted anything. It adds character to the knife.
Click to expand...

Knives are meant to be used. They scratch, dent, chip roll, break and in just about all infi cases, survive extreme abuse that a knife was not designed to do.

USE THEM!!!! GIVE THEM PURPOSE!!!! :thumbup::thumbup: :D

ASHFSHTEE03.jpg
 
Sounds fair. I need to get better at sharpening anyway, so I might as well stfu and get on with it huh :) (after work anyway). My results are, comparatively, not that good. I need to get a bigger bit of leather for the strops, and practice the hand movement more.

Thanks for the info, guys.
 
Just looking at the edge, I honestly did not see much rolling even. Just looked like you blunted the very edge in a few spots.

When I hear "chips" I am thinking pieces missing clear up to the primary grind out of the edge.

The photo of your edge does look like you have taken the edge out a bit thinner than I would expect a 25 per side to look from a Lansky (used one for 2 decades). I found on most knives, if I went from 25 to 20 per side, I started noticing much easier edge damage (with all steel types I had). Also, that 25 number is really a ball park. Depending on how deep you clamp the knife, you might actually closer to 20 if you clamp right at the spine, and the edge to spine height of the knife really affects the actual angle. With my bigger knives, using the lansky, I actually would move down an angle because that is where it really seemed to become the "right" angle. For example, the almost 2 inch edge to spine height on a big chopper means if you are using the 30 degree setting, you are actually not at 30 degrees, but much shallower.

Use the bevel you have some more, and see if it holds up ok. If not, just go a bit steeper on the sandpaper, and you will get a stronger edge.

It takes a little bit of practice with the strop method, before there is an Aha moment. I had some one tell me their Convex edge was "scary" sharp. It would not even shave hair with harp pressure. Same angle, with some time on the strop, and bingo, hairs jumping off. Not a shallow angle, so you can get pretty steep bevels hair popping sharp.

I would not mess with trying to regrind that bevel. If it is a bit thinner than will support the steel reasonably, just increase your angle a bit on the sand paper and you will still have the better shoulder profile for slicing, with a more robust angle at the very edge. Sort of a convex, with a convex micro bevel.

Have you ever tried steeling infi?

I just use a large round smooth round screw driver. A real butcher's steel would be even more convenient, but it is getting hard to find one that is actually smooth, and designed for aligning the edge, and not rough for actually removing steel.

Take the steel, and smooth the rolls out a bit first, before doing sharpening, and it takes much much less work to get them back in shape. That is one of the neat properties about infi, is for the most part, even when you thing it looks like a chip, it may be a bit of deformation and you can actually get the steel to move back into place with some time on a steel. Then the actual "sharpening" takes less time, and more importantly, removes much less metal than if you skip this step. Makes your knife last much much longer than if you grind more away every time.

After splitting a pebble on accident with my FBMLE I figured I was going to have hours of sharpening to fix it. Steeled the edge first, and it only took about 3 -4 passes on a medium stone to fix the rest, then a bit of stropping and good as new.
 
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