is 1050 quenched in oil, good enough?

[Alan Molstad]

In a topic here I have read that 1050 steel is best quenched in water.

However I just learned that my knife that I just finished an oil quench on was 1050 and not the 5160 steel I had believed.

Now due to the fact that the blade is finished, sanded down to a fine edge, and a big brass guard is soldered in position, I think it's way too late to do a do-over.

I wanted to know if the oil quench worked and so I etched the blade as Ed Fowler does and there is a very strong heat mark that seems to be telling me I have a very good and hard blade.

a ran a file over the sharpenedd edge and there is a sound of glass, thats different than the sound found at the spine.

good enough?

 

[Don Hanson III]

Based on you're info, I would say you're in good shape.

1050 can be quenched in oil but is the one steel that I'll quench in water.

 

[B . Buxton]

This sounds like its your first time experience with this steel. The file is a good way to check hardness but what about blade strength, durability and edge holding, don't you think you should perform several performance tests using this steel and heat treating techniques before you just decide its good to go and finish.
When ever I get a new batch of stock even though it comes from the same supplier and is a steel that I've worked with for years, I still make a couple sacrificial blades to make sure the steel makeup is close to the same as I am use to and that it performs to my standards before I decide its good. Let the knifes performance tell you if its ready to finish.
I don't want to sound mean here and I also know how we can get in a hurry to finish the first bunch of blades, but testing your techniques is half the fun. There's nothing like taking a blade to total destruction and watching it stand up to everything you throw at it to give you confidience a big boost. You'll be glad in the long run.

Just my 2 cents.

Bill

 

[CanDo]

This sounds like its your first time experience with this steel. The file is a good way to check hardness but what about blade strength, durability and edge holding, don't you think you should perform several performance tests using this steel and heat treating techniques before you just decide its good to go and finish.
When ever I get a new batch of stock even though it comes from the same supplier and is a steel that I've worked with for years, I still make a couple sacrificial blades to make sure the steel makeup is close to the same as I am use to and that it performs to my standards before I decide its good. Let the knifes performance tell you if its ready to finish.
I don't want to sound mean here and I also know how we can get in a hurry to finish the first bunch of blades, but testing your techniques is half the fun. There's nothing like taking a blade to total destruction and watching it stand up to everything you throw at it to give you confidience a big boost. You'll be glad in the long run.

Just my 2 cents.

Bill

Hi Bill,
What sorts of abuse do you recommend throwing at the blade? Chopping a bunch of stuff to see how well the edge holds up, how far the blade bends, etc?

 

[B . Buxton]

That really depends on what you want from your knives. The bend test is fun and does show flexibility of your blades but I don't put a lot of stock in it for I think its a rediculous mind set to think a good knife has to perform a 90 degree bend to be top notch quality. A knifes purpose is to cut, slice, dice, chop. So its ability to show strength, not chip and stay sharp for long sessions of this type of work is more important to me. Then when it does need resharpening to have a reasonable ease to it, so anyone with reasonable knowledge in resharpening can do it.
I've been known to stab 55 gal barrels, baton blades through dried oak and dogwood, chop all sorts of woods, cut bunchs of cardboard and rope along with the bend tests. These are all fun to do and have given me great confidence in the performance of my blades and heat treatments and thats whats important to me. But these crazy tests are for my benefit, should a knife be used in some of these ways, heck NO, but these tests do help me determine if my knives will hold up for the simpler intended purposes they are intended for.

The most important thing a maker can do in my opinion is test, test, test his work so his customers are getting the quality they deserve from a hand made working knife. Prove to yourself, your knives are of excellent quality and never assume there just good enough, unless you plan on keeping it for yourself.

Have fun,

Bill

 

[flatgrinder]

Try chopping a 2 x 4 in half and see if it still shaves hair.

 

[Alan Molstad]

I have decided to just keep going with this knife.

At the time I was working on the steel I sure believed that the steel was 5160 and it was only later on that I learned that this was some 1050.

Had I known before hand I would have tried the water quench just for fun.
From what you guys have said and from what I can tell with a file, the steel did get hard.

Hard enough anyway...

 

[Kevin R. Cashen]

...The bend test is fun and does show flexibility of your blades but I don't put a lot of stock in it for I think its a rediculous mind set to think a good knife has to perform a 90 degree bend to be top notch quality. A knifes purpose is to cut, slice, dice, chop. So its ability to show strength, not chip and stay sharp for long sessions of this type of work is more important to me...

Mr. Buxton, this is not the first time I have had to say that I like your way of thinking . It is indeed a ridiculous mindset, and one that has been hurting the potential quality of knives for some time, the only thing saving it is the ease with which a susceptible public will unquestioningly accept all that is in print propounding soft, bendable knives. The only minute detail that I disagree a bit on (well, not really I just would expand upon) is that flexing is not bending and bending is not flexing. Interchangeability of the two can occur in that fuzzy area where accurate terminology can be at odds with being a shrewd salesman. If one is just flexing a blade they really still have no idea as to the heat treat until they actually bend it or break it, since elasticity is entirely unaffected by heat treatment, and as soon as a blade takes the slightest set it is no longer in the elastic realm but has moved on to showing its ductility. Very ductile metal should be most unimpressive in a blade since I believe most of us desire "strength", and high ductility allows for no resistance to deformation which, by definition, is the exact opposite. Even if I wanted to make an edged pry bar, what good is a pry bar that easily bends? Anybody ever owned a pry bar that would easily bend by your arm pressure alone?

The ABS test is for the smith, not the knife; the knife gets tossed in a corner somewhere while the smith gets a stamp. During one of my demos this weekend at an ABS hammer-in, after cutting all kinds of silly things with a knife that I announced was thoroughly 59HRC, I was asked if it would bend to 90 degrees, I proudly said "heck no, this blade would break before bending any significant amount! But it will take some serious trying on a good sized cheater bar to do it!", which is more than I could say about bending one of equal dimensions.