is all G-10 of same quality?

[SkinnyJoe]

I am guessing that it can't be, the reason being that more and more of the crappier knives coming out with G-10 scales.

 

[2brothers]

I went here http://www.jmjprofile.com/PlasticMaterialSpecs.htm and
clicked on G10. They only list 1 kind, while some of the materials list many.

I dunno if there is more than one or if it can be made really cheap by omitting something.

mike

 

[MORIMOTOM]

like anything i suspect the quality is largely dependent on the company producing it.

 

[markksr]

THIS G10 manufacturer mentions at least two types (G10 and G10 FR4). Very interesting reading ...

 

[shecky]

No. Not only can there be variations in quality, there isn't a "knife grade" spec for G-10. The term is sometimes used interchangeably with micarta outside the knife world, though knife folks would be quick to make a distinction between the two.

 

[PatriotDan]

fr4 is (atleast originally) for circuit boards. Or so I was told years back when I was involved in a horrible military research project... Dunno if G10 could be used for circuit boards.

 

[Sal Glesser]

There are general minimum specs for industrial grade G-10 which is used in industrial grade circuit boards.

G-10 manufactured for knives or other purposes have no minimum spec so they can be anything.

Just because the "chemistry" is the same or close means little. You can cook an egg many ways and many qualities. It's still an "egg".

I can tell you that Spyderco has G-10 custom made with additional glass layers because we often nest liners which removes material. In order to keep the strength, we have to adjust the mfr. I'm sure each manufacturer has their minimum specs for g-10 or any other material from blade steel to screws.

sal

 

[knarfeng]

Here is some background on G10 and sources of variability of the material.

G10 is a designation for epoxy impregnated glass fabric. The term “G10” comes from a NEMA (National Electrical Manufacturers Association) specification, specification L1, “Industrial Laminated Thermosetting Products”. There is no Qualified Producers List for L1, it is a performance specification. Anyone can make G10, but, in order to be called G10, it has to have a specific set of properties. The good part of this is that anything called G10 has to have certain minimum properties. The less good part is that the properties that most interest knife people are either not controlled by the specification or only partly controlled.

I do not have access to NEMA specifications. The charge to buy specification L1 is $190. Too much for me. But the military buys its G10 laminates to its own spec, MIL-I-24768/2. That, I have access to. The properties controlled by the MIL spec are going to be pretty similar to those controlled by the NEMA spec. It’s the same material and it’s going to be used for the same purpose, circuit boards. Here are the properties of G10 flat laminates per MIL-I-2478/2:
Dielectric breakdown voltage
Dielectric constant
Dissipation factor
Impact strength
Flex strength
Water absorption.

As you can see, most of these are electrical parameters. But there are a couple that would interest us. Impact strength of a 1/8” thick section is to be at least 7 ft-lb per inch. Flex strength of a 1/8” thick section is to be a minimum of 55 KSI measured with the fabric. But these two properties are the only ones that define the material for what knife people want it for. And two properties are insufficient to really tie down the performance.

Here is a link to a quick post I made about how G10 is processed: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4132125&postcount=5
There are a number of places that performance variation can creep in to G10.
You start with fabric, with any number of weaves available, any number of fiber diameters, none of them controlled by the G10 spec. One company weaves the fabric. Another company buys the fabric, and impregnates the fabric with an epoxy resin and turns it into “prepreg”. There are thousands of resin combinations from which to choose. Selection is not controlled by the G10 spec. That company sells its “prepreg” to a processor who makes the laminates. The processed laminates are what is sold as G10. It is only the two-variable performance of that finished laminate that is controlled. Specifications that control structural laminates usually control more properties.

And the surface finish, which interests us the most, is not controlled by the G10 spec at all. Check out the surface finish of a circuit board some time. It’s pretty slippery. So the knife maker who wants G10 for his handles has to order special stuff. It’s still made from the same prepreg that makes circuit board G10, so it’s going to have G10 strength properties, such as they are. But, he is going to go to that processor and arrange to buy some special G10 laminate that has a special rough finish to it.

What he ends up with is going to depend on what he asks for, who processes it and how it was done, what epoxy was used, what weave was chosen. And it is all called G10 because it meets the NEMA spec for circuit boards.

 

[knarfeng]

From Sal's comment, I believe that, for knifemakers, G10 has come to be a generic term for epoxy glass laminate.

As I mentioned in the post above, even if the materials bought met the G10 spec, most of the factors that are desirable in a knife handle are not controlled by the spec that defines what G10 is.