Is H-1 steel something they could use for handgun frames and slides?

[peacefuljeffrey]

If H-1 is good for knife blades and will "never rust," why haven't I heard of any gun manufacturers using it in their products?

Is there any reason why H-1 would not be appropriate for use as a slide or frame for a handgun?


It seems to me that if H-1 were suitable for guns, it would be a boon to use that. Many people have gone in the direction of polymer frames because they are impervious to the elements and to most chemicals (I am no exception there). If H-1 were used as gun steel, and eliminated the fear of rust, I bet many would head back toward metal-framed guns... That, and we wouldn't need the tenifer or other coatings on the guns' slides...


What do you say?


-Jeffrey

 

[Cougar Allen]

Gun steels are chosen primarily for ease of machining to keep costs down. In general anything that makes a good knife steel is too hard to machine for gun manufacturers to be interested. That's also the reason for going to polymer frames -- injection molding polymer is cheaper than machining metal.

 

[peacefuljeffrey]

Thanks for moving the thread to a more appropriate venue, Cougar. (Wish I'd thought of that!)


I don't know anything about the cost of machining knives, guns, etc. I really thought that the polymer trend had a lot to do with durability and ease of maintenance, not just costs, although I can see cost reduction being one reason for it. I think that many people really want the polymer nowadays, now that it is trusted and proven. (I know I am in that category.)

But what if some manufacturer decided he did want to go out on a limb and make an H-1 gun. Can it be done? Is there any real impediment to accomplishing it? I would have thought the stainless steel of gun slides was pretty hard, but then I've not seen figures on it. Is it that much less hard than knife steels?

And, do you have any idea just how much more expensive an H-1 gun would have to be to cover the costs and provide the manufacturer a profit commensurate with what it would make on a "normal" gun?

-Jeffrey

 

[beefangusbeef]

Hmmm I don't think it'd work very well. From what I've been told materials used in gun slides, barrels, and actions are soft steels that are extremely tough. The Stainless they use in gun barrels isn't very hard at all, but it is quite a bit more than straight carbon. Tikka had a problem with a batch (too hard) and a few .300wm barrels ruptured. I'm sure you could make a .22lr, or something of that nature out of H-1. Titanium has been used in different actions and is much better suited to gunmaking then H-1.

 

[tirod3]

What cougar said - manufacturing costs vs. marketablility. IF H-1 is machinable, cheaper, and as durable within its targeted price range, and IF the public cares enough to make it an issue, then maybe someone will buy them.

So it has to survive engineering scrutiny, liability, manufacturing, and marketing to even bother. Their have been scandium revolvers released recently, maybe H-1 could be, if it's dead soft annealed properties are ok.
The real question is what it's better at - especially when its used in firearms, which have no heat treating.

 

[symphonyincminor]

The real question is what it's better at - especially when its used in firearms, which have no heat treating.

I may be wrong (someone please correct me if I am), but I thought H-1 was "precipitation hardened" (i.e. rolled) from the factory at 57-58 RC. No further heat-treatment is needed before the blades are stamped/laser cut/whatever. It is further "work hardened" through use, so you end up with the edge of a blade in H1 at 65-67 RC (for a plain edge) and the spine is at 57-58 RC. Very odd stuff. So I don't know how well the steel would translate into gun frame manufacturing. I would love to get my hands on a piece of bar stock. I think Sal has mentioned the name of the Japanese manufacturer of the steel on the forums somewhere.

 

[tirod3]

Googling brought up a 16% increase in Chinese production . . . .

As for it precipitation hardening it would mean the machining would be higher cost as it would not be annealed. For knives it would be offset by no further expense in heat treatment. Perhaps the mill could anneal before shipping for gun makers, but that would add to costs.

But if it does work harden, then will it make the grade in firearms? How deep would it harden in chambers and cylinders before the loss in ductility creates fracturing? If it's shallow, it would be much like case hardening, which has been done for about a century will little negative effect. That has been largely cosmetic, though, and on stainless, of no regard.