Is S60V (440V) better than Talonite?

[marty123]

Is CPM S60V (440V) better than Talonite? I've read alot of the posts about the two metals and I'm thinking that maybe S60V is better. I have two S60V knives, a Spyderco Native FRN and a Starmate, both plain-edge. No Talonite, haven't ever seen one, just read about it. I know there are other, perhaps better, CPM metals, such as S90V(420V), 3V, etc. My reasoning is as follows, as gathered from all that I've read, most of it here on BF.

Talonite is a cobalt/chromium matrix embedded with carbides, mainly tungsten, perhaps also molybdenum and chromium. Talonite hardness is around 45C.

S60V is a ferrite matrix, with more carbon than Talonite, embedded with harder vanadium carbides, and with the grain stucture optimized by the CPM process to give a fine grain and an even distribution of small carbides. I can't recall the grain structure of Talonite being mentioned in my readings. S60V hardness from Spyderco, after heat treatnment, is around 56C.

I guess Talonite wins in rust-resistance, but S60V is supposed to be quite good in that area also.

So, why use Talonite instead of S60V, or one of the other CPM metals? Talonite knives sure cost way more than CPM knives, partly because of the cost of the raw material, and partly because of the difficulty in working the Talonite at a hardness of 45C. And, other than rust-resistance, S60V would seem to beat Talonite, at least on paper.

Now, some people might say " You have to try Talonite to see how good it is". Well, I can't. So I'm asking my question here : Is S60V (or the other CPM metals) better than Talonite? Why use Talonite?

 

[Burke]

I don't really have any experience with the cobalt-based alloys either, but here's what I've gathered from reading the forums:

The structure of Talonite is really soft, relatively speaking, with really hard carbides. This means that RC tests are misleading, with respects to edge-holding qualities.

Many proponents of Talonite say "You have to try it to believe it." I actually understand what they're getting at; Talonite is different than steel. I don't think you can make a direct comparison.

Rust-resistance of Talonite is total. You can use it around salt water, you can gut fish or clean a deer, and it will not ever rust. No maintenance, no coatings, nothing. Depending on what you use a knife for, and the conditions under which you will use it, this might be a bigger bonus for you than anything else.

Talonite, I understand is different. Why use CPM440V, CPM3V, 1095, 5160, ATS-34, 440C? Different blade materials are suited for different tasks; if your need in a knife is for something stainless, that holds an edge well under low-stress cutting, Talonite would seem to fit the bill.

 

[chad234]

Better for what???
A high quality steel will keep a thin, keen, crisp edge far longer than Talonite, Steel is stronger (less likey to deform) so is better for abusive tasks like hard chopping.
Talonite can not rust, that is huge if you live, work or play near or in salt water, cut lots of citrus fruit, or are lazy and don't take care of you knives.
Tom Mayo, and many others with lots of miles under their belts write that cobalt rulz..... can't ignore that. IF you can take advantage of Talonites stregths it is a great material. If you want the thinnest possible edges or conversly use a knife for hard tasks, steel will probably be better.
Only you can tell what is right for you.
Chad