Is the Becker Extreme worth nearly 5 Becker BK-7s?

B

Blackhearted

Joined
Jul 6, 2005
Messages
307
im looking at this thing with a price tag of $225, and trying to determine if its worth it. i love my BK-7, BK-9 and BK-1... theyre excellent IMO for hard camp use.

basically the way i see it, the only difference between the $225 BK-77 (Extreme) and the $50 BK-7 is this:
-Blade made of S30V instead of 0170-6C Carbon tool steel.
-Handle made of Micarta as opposed to GV6H.
-sheath is black instead of olive drab, handle tan instead of coal.

im by no means a 'steel expert', but i am not 100% sure that S30V would be that much better at chopping/durability/shock resistance than the standard carbon blade - in fact ive heard that S30V can be more brittle. as for the handle, the original GV6H might not be as grippy without modification as the micarta, but it is definitely more durable... and some modification with a dremel could fix that.

so unless i am using the thing around saltwater or in a highly corrosive environment, i am unsure about spending nearly 5x as much on the Extreme. are the advantages worth the much higher price tag?

perhaps the reason it is a hard decision is because, IMO, they are selling the BK-7 for half as much as they should be (not that im complaining. in fact i picked one up for $50 canadian, which is around $40 US). if the BK-7 had a retail price tag of, say, $99-125, then the 'upgrade' decision would be far more logical, IMO. but now, you can get nearly 5 Beckers for the price of an Extreme... and that makes it a difficult decision.

cheers,
-gabriel
 
Really hard for me to answer as I but what I like. I have a Tim Britton "jimbo" on order as I can't afford a Grey Ghost and it the same price you quoted and same steel you mentioned, S30V @225.00. I have never had S30V but I hear the it is real good. With three knives on order, my wad is blown right now. I knew that they would hit the market at lower than MSRP and I posted in another thread, michiganknives.com has it marked even less. If I had the cash I'd but it so I could test them side by side :D

Cerberus
 
IMHO the "extreme" is not worth 5X the price of a standard BK-7. Also, although I like the micarta handles, I think that the S30V is probably not the best choice for a hard use woodsy sort of knife.
They say that if you are in doubt, always go with your first answer. In this case, the first answer was "carbon steel", not stainless.
 
IMO a knife such as those of becker line is made for 'use', not display. its not something you buy, marvel at and put in a display case - its definitely designed, made and priced for hard everyday camp use.
so if S30V isnt a more ideal steel for hard use, i dont understand the 'point', really', of the BK-77. if i wanted something for display, then my $225 could be better spent. if i want something for hard everyday use, then $225 is a bit steep, especially if the $40-50 BK-7 performs nearly as well (or, perhaps, even better).

but i really love the becker line. so.. im still actually considering it, hehe. although if i can buy 4-5 regular beckers for the price, think of all the modification possibilities :)

i truly think the standard becker line is underpriced.. i mean geez, what do you get for $50 these days? in canada: two movie tickets, some popcorn and a meal at mcdonalds. usually all this entails is sitting through a horrible movie and indigestion.
 
Compared to the BK-7, the Becker Extreme is definitely going to look worse in terms of what you get per dollar. That said, I think it's fair to compare them in performance but not in value.

Better comparisons for the value of the Becker Extreme would be other 7" S30V knives built for a similar purpose. Consider the Simonich Mid-tech Raven ($300+), TOPS DART ($329), or similar models by Strider ($325+). The Becker Extreme is much cheaper at $225 than any of these. The best deal I could find is the Buck 819SS, which has a 6" S30V blade, walnut handle, and leather sheath at about $140. Is the Buck 819SS worth 3X the Buck 119 ($44)?

My point is that the Extreme is reasonably priced compared to its equivalents on the market. It's really not designed to compete with the BK-7.
 
In my opinion the answer is no. One BK-77 knife is not worth the equivalent of five BK-7 knives (either in money or usefulness).

With that said, the BK-77 is a well thought out, solid performer and worthy of some consideration if rusting is a major concern. I think, though, that if rust is an issue, one would be better off with a less costly but properly heat treated blade of 420HC (e.g., Buck/Strider collaboration).
 
its widely regarded that S30V is a great steel for pocket knives. but the steel requirements for a pocket knife are much different than that of a 7-9" blade camp/utility knife.

for example, primary concerns for a folding EDC blade are toughness, edge retention, etc.

but for a larger blade thats going to be used for chopping, prying, etc how does S30V fare? i have read many reviews of S30V for pocket knives, however i have not read any reviewing it on a large fixed blade knife during hard use... and i am worried that someone just took a popular 'super steel' that is used in small folders and assumed it would be great for a large chopper.

if i had money to burn i guess id buy one of each (carbon and S30V) and torture test the hell out of them :) but as it is, $225 USD is a significant investment for me so i would tend to not want to destroy the knife on the first day. at $40-60 though, i have absolutely no hesitation to use the hell out of my BK-7, brute, etc. if i break it, oh well, ill call and order another one. i think that for the average user to whom money is a factor, a camp knife around the $50 price point is much more 'useful' in the end, since the user is far more likely to actually use it.

i think this is also why knives like, for example, the cold steel bushman, get such great hard use reviews - its because they are so affordable and replaceable that very few people hesitate to put them in situations they would cringe at putting a $300 knife in.
**edit: to clarify, i dont mean to say that more expensive knives cannot stand up to such punishment. but i think the average person is unaware of the limits that a well-made knife can achieve, and therefore with an expensive knife will usually be very careful. they wont be nearly as cautious with a $15-50 knife, however, and hence have many more 'hard use achievements' to list with them. a more expensive knife can often stand up to more punishment, but the likelihood that it will actually be put under such punishment by the owner is much lower... unless the owner has money to burn.

cheers,
-gabriel
 
I've had pretty good luck (actually...luck probably has little to do with it) with S30V steel in a variety of fixed blade designs (mosly higher end blades), but I have a special place in my heart for high carbon tool steels. My opinions are probably colored by this admitted prejudice.

High carbon steel and fixed powered rifle scopes.. I guess I'm getting old.....
 
Blackhearted said:
...i am not 100% sure that S30V would be that much better at chopping/durability/shock resistance than the standard carbon blade
Click to expand...

It is worse. That isn't an upgrade performance wise.

-Cliff
 
Cliff Re: S30V
It is worse. That isn't an upgrade performance wise.
Click to expand...

Yes, for my uses as well. In this type of knife I want as much toughness as possible, and the 0176C is likely much tougher than S30V.



However, my uses are not like everyone elses. What is better or worse really depends on what it will be used for. I place almost no importance on corrosion resistance and little on wear resistance in this type of blade. Others may really have a different take. For example, a hull scraper (works underwater and gets the baranacles and stuff off boats) may select this knife as a utility knife to cut heavy line with some mild prying, a little pounding etc. He would place a much higher emphasis on corrosion resistance and probably wants more wear resistance than I do.


I think the micarta is a great improvement, as it is decently easy to shape to fit your hand, allowing some ELU mods to be done. My concern would be that micarta is pretty dense and the swiss glass stuff is pretty light, so I wonder how it effects balance. On the BK7 which is fairly neuteral all ready,a bit oif a rearwars shift would be acceptable for me, but on the BK9 I want it as balde heavy as possible,so I would not want a balance shift at all.
 
The Extreme isn't priced based on production cost. Camillus has determined that it fits in a category of knives and is comparable to other knives in that price range. Busse, TOPS, you know the drill. They've priced it based on the perceived competition, not based on its own product line. That doesn't say anything about the value of other Beckers. It says something about the pricing in that military fixed blade arena.

I think if they had priced it to compete against the Ontario Randall's Adventure series, they would have hit a home run.

Incidentally, I was impressed enough with the knife when I first handled it that I almost added one to my personal collection. I'm not into big military fixed blades so that's saying something. The feel and balance alone show what a good design it is. It is a nice product. Value, of course, is in the eye of the prospective customer.
 
I think if they had priced it to compete against the Ontario Randall's Adventure series, they would have hit a home run.
Click to expand...

Even if they were priced the same, I would prefer a 1095 Rat-7 over the S30V Becker.

The Extreme isn't priced based on production cost. Camillus has determined that it fits in a category of knives and is comparable to other knives in that price range. Busse, TOPS, you know the drill. They've priced it based on the perceived competition, not based on its own product line. That doesn't say anything about the value of other Beckers. It says something about the pricing in that military fixed blade arena.
Click to expand...

That is an interesting insider's perspective, thanks Fred.

Personally, I could never run a production knife company. My focus is on what works best, not what is cool, flashy or would sell best.

From my view, if I wanted a knife for this application (good corrosion resistance, decent wear resistance a good degree of toughness) I would go with an "inferior" steel, which I think would be better for this use. Specifically, I would use 12C27, good toughness for stainless, great corrosion resistance (left my Mora 2K covered in lemon juice for hours with no spotting, same in dishwasher), and holds an edge decently well. Infact, I would prefer 420HC or even 440A with a solid heat treat over S30V here, even though they are not "premium" steels and the knife would probably not sell well becuase it lacked that sex appela of having "the latest and greatest" steel.
 
As well, consider a knife like the Camp Tramp compared to the Becker. Cliff Stamp Camp Tramp review The CT offers higher perfromance on most tasks (Significantly tougher and thus a significantly broader scope of work) than the Becker at a lower price. I'd imagine the new SRKW line with micarta will be even better.
 
knifetester said:
What is better or worse really depends on what it will be used for.
Click to expand...

Yes, in the above I was referring to the optimal scope of work of such blades in general and specifically how that one is promoted :

The Becker Extreme has been designed specifically for soldiers and adventurers requiring a [size=+1]sturdy[/size] but lightweight combat knife that can stand up to [size=+1]hard use[/size]. The inspiration for the Becker Extreme is the timeless MK-2 FIGHTING KNIFE that CAMILLUS CUTLERY helped develop during the second world war.

The Becker Extreme has a 7" S30V blade that is [size=+1]tough enough for any field task[/size] and is flat ground to the BECKER shaving sharp edge.

The [size=+1]brawny[/size] .188" thick clip point blade is the perfect complement for a knife that may be used for piercing as well as [size=+1]prying[/size]. An integral inline [size=+1]hammering pommel[/size] has been engineered into the blade tang and is useful for a variety of military and survival uses.​
Consider for a moment a customer with little to no experience with steels what type of use does that ad imply the blade is designed for, and from that point of view which steel would tend to be more optimal.

In general any steel has advantages over any other steel in some areas, but when considering scope of work, some advantages are hard pressed to actually be functional.

What I will be interested to see when these knives come out, is how the steel reacts. Considering the problems reported with S30V in various small folders, it will be interesting to see how how a large blade behaves.

-Cliff
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top