Is This Okay?

[Trout Hound]

All right, so I've been learning my way around my new set of DMT plates lately, and so far I really like them a lot. Based on a few posts I had read from Jason and OWE, I've been spending a lot of time in particular with the coarse plate. I now really understand what you guys had said all along, that the knife gets sharp on the coarse stone. I spent a good bit of time with the clip blade on my new Case 6318, and after refining the reprofiled edge with very light passes, I was quite impressed with the edge. It went through newsprint quite easily, and shaved arm hair aggressively! I decided to just put it in my pocket and try it with that finish, and so far, for everyday cutting tasks, it is kicking butt and taking names.

The only thing I'm wondering is this: if I decided to maintain this blade using only DMT coarse, giving it just a few light passes per side occasionally to restore sharpness, am I going to remove too much metal from a steel like CV and prematurely turn my lovely clip blade into a glorified toothpick? Should I use the fine stone instead, or am I ok where I am?

Thanks guys, I appreciate the benefit of your experience very much!

 

[jackknife]

All right, so I've been learning my way around my new set of DMT plates lately, and so far I really like them a lot. Based on a few posts I had read from Jason and OWE, I've been spending a lot of time in particular with the coarse plate. I now really understand what you guys had said all along, that the knife gets sharp on the coarse stone. I spent a good bit of time with the clip blade on my new Case 6318, and after refining the reprofiled edge with very light passes, I was quite impressed with the edge. It went through newsprint quite easily, and shaved arm hair aggressively! I decided to just put it in my pocket and try it with that finish, and so far, for everyday cutting tasks, it is kicking butt and taking names.

The only thing I'm wondering is this: if I decided to maintain this blade using only DMT coarse, giving it just a few light passes per side occasionally to restore sharpness, am I going to remove too much metal from a steel like CV and prematurely turn my lovely clip blade into a glorified toothpick? Should I use the fine stone instead, or am I ok where I am?

Thanks guys, I appreciate the benefit of your experience very much!

A knife is a finite perishable tool by nature. Every time you sharpen it, you are taking off a tiny bit of blade. In enough years, the blade will be worn down to a toothpick. But that should take many years of steady everyday use of cutting stuff that is hard on the blade. If you strop more, you should need to sharpen less. Also don't obsess over hair popping sharp. Your knife will keep a cutting edge far longer than you think without obsessive over sharpening. More knives are 'worn out' by over sharpening than actually real world use. I'd say, just keep using your knife and when it won't open your mail easy, or slice open that plastic blister package with ease, then give it a few strokes on the bottom of a coffee mug and keep on going. I watched my father use the same Case peanut for 40 years that way. Yes, the main blade was a semi toothpick by the 1970's, but it had been used since the late 1930's. The knife had been given him by his mother before WW2, and he retired it n the late 70's. He rarely used a sharpening stone, just once in a while. But he stropped it every night. Sometimes he'd give it a light honing on a coffee mug bottom. The stone was for when it really needed a sharpening, not a light touch up.

It's okay for a blade to loose a little steel over time. It's just age like we all do in time. Nothing is forever, and a knife by nature is an expendable tool that gets used up.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

All right, so I've been learning my way around my new set of DMT plates lately, and so far I really like them a lot. Based on a few posts I had read from Jason and OWE, I've been spending a lot of time in particular with the coarse plate. I now really understand what you guys had said all along, that the knife gets sharp on the coarse stone. I spent a good bit of time with the clip blade on my new Case 6318, and after refining the reprofiled edge with very light passes, I was quite impressed with the edge. It went through newsprint quite easily, and shaved arm hair aggressively! I decided to just put it in my pocket and try it with that finish, and so far, for everyday cutting tasks, it is kicking butt and taking names.

The only thing I'm wondering is this: if I decided to maintain this blade using only DMT coarse, giving it just a few light passes per side occasionally to restore sharpness, am I going to remove too much metal from a steel like CV and prematurely turn my lovely clip blade into a glorified toothpick? Should I use the fine stone instead, or am I ok where I am?

Thanks guys, I appreciate the benefit of your experience very much!

I'd say, "It depends..."

This is where you can further train your hands to go very, very, VERY light on the hone; it'll be great training in general, for anything you sharpen on. If you get that ultralight touch down with good control of your angle, it may take only 2-3 passes per side on your CV blade to keep it in tip-top shape. Your circumstance is very similar to my habits lately; I've been using (& experimenting with) anything from Coarse, Fine & EF DMT hones to tune up edges on many of my knives, including Case blades in both CV and their stainless (420HC). If done in a minimal number of passes with a featherlight touch, the blade loss at the edge will be insignificant. I've also discovered the inside face (sueded side) of my simple leather belt, with some DMT 1µ Dia-Paste applied to it, is a GREAT strop for these steels as well, really taking hair-popping sharpness up another notch, after touching up on my DMT hones. I use it as a free-hanging strop, BTW; that's significant, in minimizing compression of the leather and protecting the crispness of the apex. I've also been keeping similar habits in maintaining a couple of Victorinox paring knives by the same means, and blade loss hasn't been a significant issue with those either.

So, by saying "It depends...", to answer your question, it could be an issue if your sharpening touch is pretty heavy or takes an excess of passes on the hone each time you sharpen up your edges. Developing the touch to go as light as possible and with as few sharpening strokes as possible will make a big difference in the long run.


David

 

[Trout Hound]

I might just stick with the fine stone for touch-ups. Still plenty of tooth without as much risk of taking off too much steel.

 

[Wowbagger]

Is This Okay?

No

Ha, ha, ha ( I just had to say that).
Nah, you're good. Not too may passes though and I would go down the plate blade back first rather than edge on or back and forth.

guys had said all along, that the knife gets sharp on the coarse stone.

it's so nice to hang out with people who understand.

I might just stick with the fine stone for touch-ups. Still plenty of tooth without as much risk of taking off too much steel.

I tend to agree
and would go further than that and say CV on diamond plate is kind of like killing ants with atom bombs.

A nice hard Arkansas stone might be a good maintenance stone and then use the diamond plate(s) if you aren't getting the edge you want if there is some significant edge damage to the knife from hitting a box staple or cutting through onto a hard surface etc.

 

[Trout Hound]

It's my understanding from others here that edge-trailing on diamonds is a bad idea, since it will almost always cause unwanted burr formation.

The diamonds certainly aren't necessary for CV, but I've been careful to go really easy on the pressure, and to minimize the number of necessary strokes. Having tried waterstones, oil stones, sandpaper, and ceramics, this is my favorite medium so far. I think it's most important to know how to use each type of stone to get the results you want.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

It's my understanding from others here that edge-trailing on diamonds is a bad idea, since it will almost always cause unwanted burr formation.

The diamonds certainly aren't necessary for CV, but I've been careful to go really easy on the pressure, and to minimize the number of necessary strokes. Having tried waterstones, oil stones, sandpaper, and ceramics, this is my favorite medium so far. I think it's most important to know how to use each type of stone to get the results you want.

:thumbup:
Edge-leading is ideal on diamond or any other hard hone, save perhaps for waterstones or others on which more loose grit/slurry might be generated; the loose grit might tend to dull the edge a bit with leading strokes. Aside from that exception, edge-leading with a light touch on a cleanly-cutting stone is what makes as close to a burr-free edge as you'll see. The light touch mandated on a diamond hone will pay off in using other hones as well; lighter is always better in refining an edge. A lighter touch will even help to reduce burring on marginal stones that aren't cutting the steel so cleanly with glazed or worn abrasive, or if they're insufficiently hard for the steel. My own results got much better on SiC, AlOx and Arkansas stones after figuring out use of pressure on diamond hones, using those Victorinox paring blades I mentioned earlier as my 'trainers'; that was probably the best lesson I could get, with the biggest payoff.


David

 

[boostdemon]

...slurry might be generated; the loose grit might tend to dull the edge a bit with leading strokes.

Slurry is something straight razor honing folks use all the time, it fills between the blade and stone to create a "faster" cutting hone until the "grit" has been ground down and eventually becomes so fine it does little to nothing. I have used it with 'Japanese natural' finishers up to around 20,000 grit.

 

[Chris "Anagarika"]

If the edge is off the coarse stone, perhaps you can try burnishing technique, using a smooth hard surface with edge leading. Something like smooth pyrex or even smooth glass. Heavy Handed recommended this to prolong life in softer steel finished on coarse grit. He mentioned the hard smooth glass will cause plastic flow to the steel teeth, similar to using trowel.