I've got it narrowed down to three knives.

I

ian_j

Joined
Mar 3, 2002
Messages
203
I'm about to purchase my first knife(besides the $7 shrade I usually carry, which i find completely worthless in most situations not to mention being very stiff to open and prone to unlocking when I least expect it.), and since I suck at sharpening, I'm ordering an inexpensive knife to practice on. I have it narrowed down to three diffrent ~40 dollar knives, and I would like your advice as to which is the most sturdily built model.

The knives are:

-Kershaw Ken Onion Scallion
this knife looks really fragile, but I'm intrigue by the speed-safe opening mechanism. Is the 420 steel hardened to 55-57 HRC as bad as AUS 6M? Most inexpensive knife on the list at a measely 30 dollars and probably the neatest in terms of features. Probably a little bit small for an EDC.

-CRKT M16-03
This knife also has a unique opening method found in the carson flipper. Also it has AUS 8 steel which I think is the best steel of the three knives I am looking at.

-CRKT Marizetti Prowler
Looks very unique and encorporates the LAWKS safety system. Only AUS 6M steel though which I've read is pretty poor quality. Looks a little thick to comfortably carry in my pocket.

Any insights into my decision would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for any help you can offer.
 
Only AUS 6M steel though which I've read is pretty poor quality. Looks a little thick to comfortably carry in my pocket.
Click to expand...

You cant believe everything you read. Many will tell you that aus6 is bad, just as any others can tell you that the steel has performed well for them. Personally, when its done right, I like it just fine.

Anyways, the CRKT M16 you mention is a fine knife of good quality. I have not used or owned the other 2 you mention.

If you dont mind, I will mention a few others that should be near your price range that are worth looking at. Spyderco makes a few models in your range, and the Endura and Delica models are worth checking out. SOG knives also makes great knives. The Air-Sog one of my favorite models that they make. Also, Outdoor Edge makes a very stout high quality knife called the Magna.

Good luck in your search.
 
I would go with the CRKT M16.
I like the Prowler but the blade is too thick for my taste.
One thing is for sure, CRKT has excellent fit and finish and attention to detail.
The LAWKS system really works too.

Concerning AUS-6 steel: Don't let the "steel snobs" mislead you, there's nothing wrong with AUS-6.
It's very resistant to corrosion and rust and you can get a razor-sharp edge on AUS-6. The only real downside to it is that the edge retention is'nt as great as some of the super-steels. It's a great steel to learn sharpening skills too because all you need is a good Arkansas stone.
I can't get my ATS-34 knives and ATS-55 knives quite as sharp as I can my AUS-6 knives.
I have learned that the knife and blade design matters much more than the steel used.
If AUS-6 was a lousy steel then Spyderco and Al Mar Knives would'nt use it, and they do.
Tactical Knives magazine did an article on AUS-6 in the May 2002 issue: they felt that if it was heat treated correctly it was a fine everyday work-knife steel.

Buzzbait once wrote a good thread about how he had always got good performance from his Buck knives, even though Buck uses 420HC (a far cry from a super-steel).

Good luck,
Allen.
 
If you dont mind, I will mention a few others that should be near your price range that are worth looking at. Spyderco makes a few models in your range, and the Endura and Delica models are worth checking out. SOG knives also makes great knives. The Air-Sog one of my favorite models that they make. Also, Outdoor Edge makes a very stout high quality knife called the Magna.

Thanks for the suggestions. I guess on top of wanting a inexpensive knife, I want one that has a "gimmick" with it as well. That way when I replace this knife with something of higher quality down the road some time, I will have my old beater which will still be neat to me because of its uniqueness. I don't know if that makes any sense or not...
 
If you want a good solid knife, that does'nt cost a fortune, and has a little "gadget factor" going for it, then check out the CRKT Bladelock.
The lock is an engineering marvel designed by Michael Walker.
There's no other production knife using this type of lock that I'm aware of.

Check it out at www.crkt.com

Good luck,
Allen.
 
Using the M16-Zytel, and it not only looks tough, it works tough.
I'd avoid the tanto blade if you're learning to sharpen. Tantos are quite hard to sharpen and after altering the bevel, I've regret what I've done. Since the tip has varying thickness, getting a straight edge on the tanto would mean a really strange bevel. Getting a good grind would probably curve the tip edge. (I found that some are actually made with not a straight edge). But then I do treat my M16 more like a practice grind.
If I can change my mind, then I'd have got the spearpoint instead of the tanto, but I'd still take the M16. Opening is very easy. It still works very tough even after I screwed up the bevel.
I've just tried the Kershaw Scallion. Yes I must admit it's a tad small for EDC, but hell, with the speedsafe opening and the index trigger, I swear that this little knife opens like a switchblade (which happens to be banned in Canada). With some elementary testing (actually more than 45 deg test on most parts of the blade, and then a light draw to test the smoothness), this smaller knife actually has a hell of an edge. I was wonder what steel that was, and when I saw 420HC I didn't believe my eyes. :eek: Apparently Kershaw did an excellent job heat treating the blade and it's pretty much nuts.
I don't know about 420HC, but according to a FAQ in BladeForum's Knowledge Base, AUS6 behaves much like 440A. I've 3 knifes in AUS 6 and I have no problems with it. Sharpens quite easily, and does really well. I actually have cutted oranges with my M16-Z and it didn't seem to stain. The only problem is probably edge-retentability, which isn't an issue for a practice knife for sharpening anyways. (I'd think you want to have frequent practice).
I didn't have the Prowler, but my other folder is the Crawford/Kasper 3", which performs very well and suitable for many tasks. Again sharpens easily, and with a smooth steel you could keep the edge longer.
If you end up choosing the Kershaw, you can probably take the whirlwind if you find the blade is not long enough, but then if you have a limited budget, that might not help.
CRKT makes some good folders in great prices (for me, i'm a student ;) ) and I love my M16 and Crawford/Kasper.
My vote is on M16

PS the zytel handle ones are AUS6, the al handles seems to be AUS8
 
I'm confused about the comparison. You have a tiny little folder, a medium sized one and a bigger heavy one. They don't compare to one another at all. Perhaps you need to get back to what you want the knife to do. If all you want to do is practice sharpening then I guess I'd suggest the smallest blade since that will save you time. But you might as well use what you're going to buy. So I'd suggest getting back to the basics of what you need in a knife. Then you'll have it narrowed down to one. Take care.
 
Of the three mentioned I would go with the Marzetelli.Cool Piece
 
Fred hit the nail on the head. What do you want to cut? How will you use the knife?

Define the function and the choice will be obvious. If you are just looking for a good ~$40 knife, the choices and reasons to pick a specific model are endless.
 
Mate, It's as Fred says ........what do you want it to do?

As a general guideline try this..........

Blade steel for a newby.........
Aus-8 or Aus-6, or 440a. All are very friendly and easy to sharpen.

Handle material........
Zytel is good for everyday to save money as a starter.
Aluminum is good to. Then all the rest of your choice.

Handle shape.......
This is way more important than most folks think. If the knife doesn't
fit your hand well you won't use or like it. Period. Trust me on this one.
Learn what fits YOUR hand the best. Do this with your eyes shut. I know
it sound nuts but your eyes aren't going to be holding the knife. Don't let the
visuals confuse the issue, A knife handle shape YOU like will feel like it belongs
in your hand. Not bulky or in need of constant fidgeting to readjust it. It becomes
part of your hand.

Size of blade......
For everyday stick with around 3" or less. You don't need a big
honking blade to do daily chores. In fact, big blade for small chores
sometimes is a real pain. No penis envy here, Mate. Bigger isn't always
better in knives.

Shape of blade.......
For everyday use it's really hard to beat a sheepsfoot / warncliff or a spearpoint.
Next would be a clip or drop point. If you don't know what these blades are take
the time to learn......before .........you buy anything.

Lock or no lock.......
Don't get all hung up about this lock or that lock. All any lock does
is add a bit of saftey to a folding knife. It's the quality of the knife that
makes all the differance. An awful lot of people get by fine with the
simple slipjoint with no lock. Remember, If you NEED a lock to use
a folding knife you better go back to basics and learn how to use a knife
all over again. Also don't get swayed by the vaunted "spine whack" test
you read about here. For crying out loud, how many people go around
whacking their knife on the spine to see if it will close??? If the knife is
well made it won't matter unless you use it wrong.

Finally, Take as much time as YOU need to learn and understand
what it is in a knife that you like. It will be time well spent to find
a life long friend that fits your needs and personality.

Good Hunting , mate.
 
ian_j,

Forget the 3 on your "list", and get yourself a CRKT Crawford/Kasper "Fighting Folder", plain-edge. The blade is AUS-6, but as stated before, AUS-6 really ISN'T a "bad" steel at all, and it IS very easy to re-sharpen.:).
 
Originally posted by glockman99
Forget the 3 on your "list", and get yourself a CRKT Crawford/Kasper "Fighting Folder", plain-edge. The blade is AUS-6, but as stated before, AUS-6 really ISN'T a "bad" steel at all, and it IS very easy to re-sharpen.:).
Click to expand...

I'm with glockman on this one...I'd choose the fighting folder over the three you mentioned--it's a great knife at a great price.
 
Is the scallion pretty sturdy? Its blade size is probably most appropriate for the everyday cutting tasks I do. Opening mail/packages, cutting loose threads off an article of clothing, pulling out splinters, etc. Does it have a tightenable pivot? My brother used to carry a ladybug all the time, but the pivot got lose and now it has quite a bit of horizontal wiggle to it.

The other ones are on the list because they are inexpensive and they look very unique/have a fun little gaget envolved in them:D as far as the prowler goes any other crkt knife which has LAWKS and is ~40 could just as easily have been there. The thumb groove just caught my eye is all.
 
Originally posted by Knife Outlet
I'm confused about the comparison. You have a tiny little folder, a medium sized one and a bigger heavy one. They don't compare to one another at all. Perhaps you need to get back to what you want the knife to do. If all you want to do is practice sharpening then I guess I'd suggest the smallest blade since that will save you time. But you might as well use what you're going to buy. So I'd suggest getting back to the basics of what you need in a knife. Then you'll have it narrowed down to one. Take care.
Click to expand...
If he does get the scallion, sharpening could be a bit of a problem because the blade is recurved, and the blade is like 2 1/4" inch, even with my Gatco set I'd doubt I'd sharpen the recurve well.
that's why I suggested him to stick with the M16 as a practice piece.
 
The Scallion isn't what I'd call sturdy, but it's a cool little knife. The handles are rigid enough not to flex alot under hand pressure, and it has double liners, which are a tad thin to an eye that's used to looking at much more robust folders, but lockup is very positive on mine.
Yes, you can tighten the pivot. Takes a #8 Torx driver.
For the light uses you described in your last post, I can't think of anything I'd rather have:) Cuts great for such a little knife, holds an edge better than I expected from a "cheap" steel, and the assisted opening is sooo much fun to play with.
Crock sticks or a Sharpmaker would help with sharpening the recurve.
So far I've yet to use anything but the corners of the white Sharpmaker stones on this knife.
 
I'd also go with the suggestion of the CRKT Crawford/Kasper. It's available in 2 size ranges--the mega-sized and a neat 3" blade as well. It does alot of things well.:cool:
 
well I am pretty much set on getting a kershaw ken onion now. I really like the idea of the speed-safe mechanism, and after looking around I've found that the blackout and whirlwind are pretty near the 40 dollar target price. What is the diffrence between these two knives? just the all black blade? Do they have the flipper? or do you open with the thumbstud?
 
I think that those knives need to be started with the thumbstud, as they do not have an index trigger.
 
Well thanks to all the clerks in the local House of Knifes, I did tried the blackout along with the scallion. I found that particular blackout was very hard to open, perhaps someone had tempered with the pivot.
I'd say find a nice store that would let you test out the knives before you make any decisions.
The only differences it seems is that the Blackout has a Titanium Nitride (sp?) coating while the whirlwind doesn't.
OwenM: I was surprised at the size of the liner, but I was doing some of the test listed in the FAQs in the knowledge base and it didn't fail. I guess the speedsafe mechanism tries to keep the thing open too.
 
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