Jess Horn : ZDP-189

Cliff Stamp · Jul 22, 2006

Very nice design for a lightweight precision knife. The only complaint I would make is that the initial edge angle was a little high, meaning for Spyderco and this type of knife, not in general. It was about 12 per side through the center of the blade but dipped higher towards the tip and choil so it tended to perform similar to the ZDP-189 Delica and this knife really deserves a more acute edge. Hopefully mine was just a abberation. This of course is nothing that the user can't adjust and the hollow grind makes this fairly easy. Work to date :

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/knives/jess_horn_zdp_189.html

I will be repeating the edge retention work with the Delica with this one, or similar to confirm the performance of the steel. I have changed the outline of the reviews significantly and this one reflects where I am with them now. Based on work recently by kel_aa I will be adding a section to the main general work of a more urban survival nature :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413191

-Cliff

kel_aa · Jul 22, 2006

Having pictures on the side makes for a lively presentation. It is visually much more appealing that previous formats. One suggestion might be for any given paragraph keeping the pictures to one side, limit them for the corners of paragraphs or as blocks, or even keep a left and right margin for pictures, as it is bit difficult to read and disorienting when the text wraps around the picture in disorderly ways.

Is the FRN not textured on the clip side? I think this is a very different looking knife. There is some elegance to it, but also very untraditional and a little funky. Spyderco keeps outdoing itself in this fashion.

Vivi · Jul 23, 2006

I thought humans couldn't digest grass?

kel_aa · Jul 23, 2006

I thought humans couldn't digest grass?

Hence you mere humans are slated for extinction! Humans cannot break up the celluose and metabolize the sugar constituents like we can with flour for instance. But I presume you can some as fiber and also get some of the "greenness" from it.

I imagine we could engineer a bacteria to reside in our guts to break down celluose. How do you think about an emergency pill where when you are really need food, you'll pop the pill and grow some of the bacteria in your guts? I guess I would eat grass/wood if that's what it took.

Vivi · Jul 23, 2006

It'd be wonderful being able to digest grass. Takes a lot less skill, time and energy to cut down some growth than it does catching, skinning and cooking an animal.

Kevin Wilkins · Jul 23, 2006

Mixing pills and grass, ah, reminds me of art school...

couldn'r resist writing that... hahahahah

Cliff Stamp · Jul 23, 2006

kel_aa said:
...it is bit difficult to read and disorienting when the text wraps around the picture in disorderly ways.

I typically don't read in a linear fashion, but I see your point. I am still working with the style and may be trimming the amount of pictures. I have resisted extensive formatting overhead for quite some time as I wanted the pages to be LYNX friendly, but pages like this are so much more visually attractive as well being much more easy to navigate :

http://www.zknives.com/knives/custom/index.shtml

I have started using tables for formatting and may be moving to more advancted formating because some of the pages like the main one have too much content now for a simple list structure.

Is the FRN not textured on the clip side?

One side is smooth, the other just has "Jess Horn" lightly raised. It doesn't do much for texture but has some visual appeal / cool factor.

I think this is a very different looking knife. There is some elegance to it, but also very untraditional and a little funky. Spyderco keeps outdoing itself in this fashion.

Yes, it is one of the least "humped" Spyderco knives which makes it more attractive to some than the general leaf shaped blades and the narrow design has its functional uses as well. Personally I would remove all traces of black from the handle to move it far away from the tactical market. I think the clip would look better either matching the handle or just brushed to match the blade.

kel_aa said:
But I presume you can some as fiber and also get some of the "greenness" from it.

Most non-starchy vegetation tends to be mainly roughage and ignores your digestive system for the most part unless you juice it. One of the main reasons for eating grass and other such material is to avoid scurvy, pine needle tea for example.

-Cliff

beefangusbeef · Jul 24, 2006

One of the main reasons for eating grass and other such material is to avoid scurvy, pine needle tea for example.

So you're saying your scurvy then? Arrrrrr.

Cliff Stamp · Jul 24, 2006

The hook speaks for itself.

-Captain Cliff

kel_aa · Jul 25, 2006

One side is smooth, the other just has "Jess Horn" lightly raised. It doesn't do much for texture but has some visual appeal / cool factor.

I understand Jess Horn is the a tradename of a custom maker. Is Jess Horn a type of material?

Somehow the Spyderco is not up to par with the looks on this one:
http://greatlakescustomknives.com/Makers/Horn_Jess/Engraved_Folder.htm

I think a production folder that comes close to that look is the Al Mar Ultralight series- the Eagle for a back grind knife and the Falcon a flat grind, although it is in the dreaded black colour. But in this case it may play to its advantage as being an elegant contrast. There are plenty of nice kitchen knives with black handles and no one complains of them being "tactical".

Cliff Stamp · Jul 25, 2006

Custom maker :

http://www.knifelegends.com/homepage.htm

-Cliff

Gryffin · Jul 25, 2006

kel_aa said:
the Eagle for a back grind knife and the Falcon a flat grind

Actually, last time I saw an Al Mar catalog, the Eagle was available in two grinds: flat (Eagle) or bayonet (Eagle Talon). I have the latter, and it slices well for such a straight edge; I've always wanted to try the flat-ground version for comparison.

Cliff Stamp · Jul 25, 2006

kel_aa said:
Is Jess Horn a type of material?

As in buffalo horn, not that I am aware of.

Somehow the Spyderco is not up to par with the looks on this one ...

Yes, just a little.

There are plenty of nice kitchen knives with black handles and no one complains of them being "tactical".

Yes, likely due to the lack of promotion of said knives as being tactical for that reason.

-Cliff

kel_aa · Aug 6, 2006

The page is looking nice, Cliff.

Is the food less commerical and more communal/rustic in your area? I pressume the fish is local catch, but what about other animals? You mention an 8 pound chicken. We get chicken with about a 4 or 5 pound upper limit, I pressume because of little consumer demand for larger chicken and/or the profit per pound starts decreasing. Is your chicken running around the farm yard or in indoor pens like most commerical operations?

LHD · Aug 6, 2006

Cliff Stamp in his jess horn review said:
With the origional edge profile and new in box sharpness, the M16 cut 3/8 inch hemp with 9.5 (5) and 14.5 (5) lbs on a slice through two inches of blade and a push cut respectively..

Reusing old reviews?

Like always, it was a great read.

Cliff Stamp · Aug 6, 2006

Yes, basically the last review written of that style of knives tends to be the template for the new one. I just do a global s&r on the name which in this missed as I was calling it M16, M16-Z, M16-Zytel, etc. .

I used to have a blank template with just all the hyperlink code and tables, but I kept changing the framework of the reviews so fast it would constantly go out of date. Now I just take a basic review and hack out the sections as I write them.

Thanks for the catch.

kel_aa said:
The page is looking nice

Yes, too bad you were not around 10 years ago to make the same suggestion.

Is your chicken running around the farm yard ...

Yes, they are all "free range" which is a odd term to invent as it used to be normal but now is a subset. We (friends/family) also have ducks, pig, cow, goat, and of course fish and vegetables (mainly potatos, carrots, turnip and cabbage).

-Cliff

LHD · Aug 7, 2006

I was stricken with insomnia the other night and read almost all of your reviews. You're like some incredible nexus of old world ingenuity and scientific analysis. Despite the syntax errors its a delight to read.

Cliff Stamp · Aug 7, 2006

Some of the old ones are pretty coarse, I do clean them up on a regular basis, but some of them still need a lot of work both in rewriting the language and some of the conclusions. I wish I knew ten years ago what I did now and the early reviews would have been a lot better, but you learn by doing. I will be adding small video's shortly, just to illustrate things like what does "heavy chopping" mean or a "hard" stab into a phonebook, because saying 75 ft.lbs of impact energy doesn't mean a lot to most people.

-Cliff

gunmike1 · Sep 21, 2006

Cliff Stamp said:
The only complaint I would make is that the initial edge angle was a little high, meaning for Spyderco and this type of knife, not in general. It was about 12 per side through the center of the blade but dipped higher towards the tip and choil so it tended to perform similar to the ZDP-189 Delica and this knife really deserves a more acute edge. Hopefully mine was just a abberation. This of course is nothing that the user can't adjust and the hollow grind makes this fairly easy. Work to date :

-Cliff

Mine has the same edge thickness/angle variation, with the tip being way thick because the line where the hollow and swedge grind meet is too low on the clip side of the blade, to the point where you can see the lamination line on the sharpened edge at the tip. I wish the whole edge was as thin and acute as the center of the blade. I will definately reprofile it as soon as I get either a X-coarse SiC stone (none of the hardware stores near me have them) or an X-coarse DMT stone. I think the ZDP would just laugh at the diamond sharpmaker hones, hence the wait. The knife does cut pretty well though, even with the thick tip.

hardheart · Sep 21, 2006

I almost ordered one to have a more wear resistant blade to replace my AMK Falcon, but the swedge and low hollow grind (I assume for the sake of the hole) made me think that the flat ground Falcon would do well enough for the time being.