Just a quick Newbie Question - Materials Required

H

Happy Face

Joined
Jul 4, 2010
Messages
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What are the basic materials required to make a knife?

I see some people use more than one belt grinder. Is this necessary?
Is it necessary to press your knife against a grinding wheel, or can you just grind in a "free area", where the belt is not coming in contact with anything but your knife?
 
even the grinder isn't necessary, and you can make a knife with a hacksaw and a file and a torch. power tools are time-saving tools which make the process bearable.

on a grinder, different needs dictate whether you are grinding flat against a platen, free against a slack belt or directly against a contact wheel. some tasks even dictate jigs.

for a basic shop; i do a lot of work as follows:

profiling on a second hand bench grinder,
belt and disk grinding on a cheap ryobi belt/disk sander,
draw filing with a mill file.

for heat treatment of simple steels, you can get by with a torch, you could go all out and get a digitally controlled electric kiln, or anywhere in between. i have built a couple of charcoal miniforges out of coffee cans and a mud/sand mixture. it should also be noted that different steels require different heat treatments, and some specialty steels require complicated heat ones. all steels will benefit from the most controlled and consistent job you can do.

fancy equipment used right [not my strong suit] makes the job quicker, easier or more reliable.
 
So then, given that, I could make a semi-decent blade with, say, this belt sander:
Click

a profile of a knife cut out from a bar of steel, and a heat-treating process?
 
of course while my shop is pretty simple, there are a hundred or more things i don't have and would like to put in there.
 
more or less, yes.

that's not the best grinder, but i've thought about buying it myself, and wouldn't hesitate to use one.

you do of course need to settle on suitable steel stock, as the stock you start with will determine how you need to proceed.
 
no, but it could go a long way towards telling you how many belts you'll wear out.

it will also dictate how you need to heat treat.

you'll find a lot of people recommending AISI/SAE 1085 for learning (not that it's not a great steel for any level), and you'll find the stuff that's already cleaned up and annealed easiest to grind, and requiring less work. you'll want a stock at or near your desired maximum dimensions (e.g. you wouldn't want to go grinding a fillet knife out of a 2" wide, 1/4" thick bar).

a lot of people use salvaged steel from various sources, and i'm happy to be one of them, but the best bet is to use new steel of known composition. that way you know exactly what you have, how to treat it and get consistent results.
 
Have you seen this ?

The Standard Reply to Newbies v6

The answer to a 13 year old student is different than to a 40 year old engineer, and you may have a helpful neighbour.
We can often recommend a local supplier, but that depends on where you are.
Fill out your profile with your location (Country and State at least), age, education, employment.

Look at the stickies at the top, many are expired, but not all.

The basic process in the simplest terms

Absolute Cheapskate Way to Start Making Knives-Printable PDF
Absolute Cheapskate Way to Start Making Knives-Website

This is a very detailed set of instructions by Stacy E.Apelt.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=694673


Books

A list of books and videos on the KnifeDogs Forum
http://www.knifedogs.com/showthread.php?t=5285

BladeForums - E-books or book previews Google books
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=603203

I like:
David Boye-Step by Step Knifemaking
Tim McCreight-Custom Knifemaking: 10 Projects from a Master Craftsman
These are clear, well organized, widely available and inexpensive too.

Knife Design:
On the Google books thread, you can find
Lloyd Harding drawings
and
the Loveless book with large variety of proven classic styles.

Forging Books:
Lorelei Sims-The Backyard Blacksmith
A modern book with great photos for forging in general - no knifemaking.

Jim Hrisoulas- has 3 books on forging knives. Check for the cheaper paperback editions.
The Complete Bladesmith: Forging Your Way To Perfection
The Pattern-Welded Blade: Artistry in Iron
The Master Bladesmith: Advanced Studies in Steel


The $50 knife shop
It is popular, but it confused me for a long time.
Forging is NOT necessary, you can just file and grind everything away to create a knife (stock removal)

The goop quench is total Bull, commercially made quench oils are cheap and easily available, even grocery store canola oil works much better.

Junkyard steels require the skills of an experienced smith to identify the steel and heat treat it properly.
You can buy proper steel like 1084 very cheaply.
(Mentioned in the new edition)

I like cable damascus, but that is an advanced project for an experienced smith and has no place in a beginners book.

The home built grinders are the best thing about the book, but there is now a huge amount of info on home built 2x72 belt grinders on the web.
The revised edition of this book should have included this.


Videos

Heat Treating Basics Video-downloadable
http://www.archive.org/download/gov.ntis.ava08799vnb1/ava08799vnb1_512kb.mp4

Many specific how to knifemaking videos are available.
Some are better than others, but all better than nothing.

The best overall Knifemaking video I have seen is
“Steve Johnson-Making a Sub-Hilt Fighter”

The best video on leather sheath making I have seen is
“Custom Knife Sheaths -Chuck Burrows - Wild Rose”

You can see a list of some older videos and their reviews at this rental company.
They are not the quickest on getting new titles, but some videos are worth buying, some are worth renting…
Rental wait times are measured in months, buying is MUCH faster, but more costly.
http://smartflix.com/store/category/9/Knifemaking

Green Pete's Free Video
Making a Mora bushcraft knife, -stock removal, hand tools, and neo tribal / unplugged heat treat.
"Green Pete" posted it free for those who can use torrent files.

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4995247/Greenpete_s__Knifemaking_Basics_-_Make_a_Mora_Bushcraft_Knife
You can also find it on YouTube broken into 4 parts.


Steel
The “welding steel” at Home Depot/Lowes… is useless for knives.
If you want to ship out for heat treating, you can use ATS34, 440C, plus many others.

If you want to heat treat yourself, find some 1070, 1080, 1084,
1084 FG sold by Aldo Bruno is formulated just for knifemaking.

You can find lists of suppliers here
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=699736

Aldo’s website inventory is unreliable, call instead.
http://njsteelbaron.com/


Heat Treating
You do not have to buy a lot of equipment to start with.
You can send out for heat treating, 10 or 15 $ per blade

This is a PDF brochure which gives good general info
http://www.buckknives.com/resources/pdf/Paul_Bos_Brochure.pdf

http://www.petersheattreat.com/
http://www.texasknife.com/vcom/about_us.php
http://www.knifemaker.ca/ (Canadian)
and others


Grinder / Tools

Hand Tools
You can do it all by hand with files and abrasive paper.
The Green Pete video does it this way.

Photo of a nice bevel filing jig .
http://www.flemingknives.com/imagesPrime/FileStation/KPicB007.jpg

Entry Level Grinders
Many makers start with the Sears Craftsman 2x42 belt grinder.


DIY 2 x 72” Belt Grinders

KMG Clone
Free Plans
http://www.dfoggknives.com/PDF/GrinderPlans.pdf

NWG No Weld Grinder
http://www.usaknifemaker.com/plans-for-the-no-weld-grinder-sander-nearly-50-pages-p-723.html

EERF Grinder (EERF =“Free” backwards)
Free plans
http://wilmontgrinders.com/EERFGrinder.aspx
http://blindhogg.com/blueprints.html

Buy the kit
http://polarbearforge.com/grinder_kit.html

Mapp arm
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=466024
 
Last edited:
Frank Niro said:
WELL DONE NUMBERS MAN !!! Frank
Click to expand...

Thanks.

I hope it helps a lot of new members, as well as freeing up the experienced makers here by answering some of the more common questions.

If anyone has suggestions for other items to include, I'm constantly making revisions.
 
belt grinders [with appropriate belts] have no trouble at all eating right into steel (well; sometimes considerable trouble, but they are a great tool for the job), and throwing off all the sparks you'd care to see.

my cheapie is one like this, but made by ryobi:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZKJCykJ8iE

it's belt driven, and those drive belts suck a lot, but it gets the job done til i can find or build a nice one. my biggest complain is that it looses a lot of torque in the belt transmission.
 
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