i was wondering just how hard titanium is. Is it harder to aircraft aluminum? is it harder then a 440a steel? 420? of course results may vary due to differnt heat treatments and stuff but in general as in on the average how hard is titanium? also there are different grades of titanium? i read on a scuba gear site there is a alpha beta Ti which is basically 6AL4V titanium and then thers a beta titanium thats stronger? if you had a pipe made of aluminu and a pipe made of 440a which would bend first? thanks
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just how hard is titanium
- Thread starter Manji
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- May 17, 2002
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The aluminum foil would bend first.
Beta Titanium seems to be better than the Al-alloy, but it´s RC hardness is far below the appr. 54 degrees of 420J2. It´s about 47 degrees RC.
Disclaimer: IANAD (I Am Not A Diver
)
Beta Titanium is not only soft, but also very expensive. Except for military diver´s needs (anti-magnetic, rust-free and lightweight), I personally can´t see any use for this material in a knife.
Even professional non-military divers would go better with 420 steel IMO.
But that´s just my two cents.
Beta Titanium seems to be better than the Al-alloy, but it´s RC hardness is far below the appr. 54 degrees of 420J2. It´s about 47 degrees RC.
Disclaimer: IANAD (I Am Not A Diver
)Beta Titanium is not only soft, but also very expensive. Except for military diver´s needs (anti-magnetic, rust-free and lightweight), I personally can´t see any use for this material in a knife.
Even professional non-military divers would go better with 420 steel IMO.
But that´s just my two cents.
Cobalt
Platinum Member
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- Dec 23, 1998
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- 17,721
Man, I have been gone for so long and the first thing I do when I get into a site is answer something about Ti.
First off, the numbers used like 54 and 47 are not in degrees, since there is no unit of measurement, the number is just a relative difference that the detent ball makes on different materials when measured on a Rockwell C scale.
An Rc of 47 for titanium is very good actually and not only myself but many have experienced Beta Ti knives behaving better than POS 420J2.
Here are just some advantages.
--Total Corrosion resistance in normal atmospheric conditions.
--It is a memory metal, meaning it can be bent further than most metals and will come back to true, excellent for prying.
--At the microscopic level it chips when it wears causing it to cut well for longer than a metal with an Rc of 47 should.
--It is extremely lightweight and mostly nonmagnetic, hence the reason buds graduates like it.
But of course what do I know, I have been in a cave for a year
First off, the numbers used like 54 and 47 are not in degrees, since there is no unit of measurement, the number is just a relative difference that the detent ball makes on different materials when measured on a Rockwell C scale.
An Rc of 47 for titanium is very good actually and not only myself but many have experienced Beta Ti knives behaving better than POS 420J2.
Here are just some advantages.
--Total Corrosion resistance in normal atmospheric conditions.
--It is a memory metal, meaning it can be bent further than most metals and will come back to true, excellent for prying.
--At the microscopic level it chips when it wears causing it to cut well for longer than a metal with an Rc of 47 should.
--It is extremely lightweight and mostly nonmagnetic, hence the reason buds graduates like it.
But of course what do I know, I have been in a cave for a year
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2001
- Messages
- 1,218
I've heard the boys at Mission Knives have gotten their Titanium up to the 50s in RC.
But that's the hardest it goes so far...
As Will Fennel so eloquently told me: "Titanium is stronger by WEIGHT, not by SIZE."
But that's the hardest it goes so far...
As Will Fennel so eloquently told me: "Titanium is stronger by WEIGHT, not by SIZE."
guy g
Gold Member
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- Oct 22, 2000
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- 2,461
Iknow this is a little belated... Titanium alloy is naturally very hard. So when you harden it more you run the risk of hardening to the point of not being able to sharpen it.I believe it takes tungsten cutters and laser equipment to cut it. 6AL4V is simply 6% aluminum, 4%vanadium. Both used as fillers to replace a certain quantity of Titanium proper to provide light weight and hardness. Titanium is widely used in aircraft because it lasts longer than aluminum componants it replaces.
guy
guy
- Joined
- May 6, 1999
- Messages
- 321
Aluminum is far less expensive, much easier to work with, and has adequate specific strength and stiffness. The reason titanium is used (an its use is kept to the absolute minimum) is its far superior performance at high temperatures.
guy g
Gold Member
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- Oct 22, 2000
- Messages
- 2,461
BSC, FAR less expensive!!! with the airplanes expected to last 25-30 years, the high temp stress is very important. The company i work for moves product from Nevada to Ohio and PA for manufacturing. By some chance are you in the airline industry or 'building' area.Great comment. Ive been led to believe that Boeing etc is trying to use more Ti to make the planes last longer.(stress related problems)
guy
guy