Just need to talk something through.

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Oct 18, 2001
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I believe that I did the right thing, but it is still tearing me up. I feel a need to lay it out and get some opinions.

My 28 year old son is all in all a great kid. Adopted at 2 months old, he has always been a joy to be around. Even in the teenage years we never lost communications and I never got "stupid." He still calls me almost every day, to talk sports, the grandchild, and anything else on his mind. Although not asking for advice outright, he is always feeling out my opinion about various subjects and situations.

Married with a 13 month old son, he recently took a contract on his house. It is a starter house in a neighborhood in transition that is becoming a not so desirable place to live. I am delighted to see them getting out of there. He is making $12,000 on this house and is using this as a down payment on another, higher priced house he has signed a contract on, in a better school district. The new house will be a financial stretch for him and his wife, but I think they can do it.

All was well until he called me today and told me that his buyer has backed out because the lender has raised his quoted finance rate. My son's wife "really has her heart set" on the new house, according to him. He told me that his first payment on the new house would not be until November, so he wants to go ahead and buy it and move in, counting on selling his old house before then. All he needs is $8,000 from me for the minimum down payment, which he will pay back to me once his old house sells.

Now, I grew up in a Southern cotton mill family where we kept the Great Depression going as a tradition long after it was over everywhere else. Financially, the experience made me ultra-conservative. My son, who has never known any real financial hardship, is a "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead" kind of person. I proceeded to explain to him that although we both knew that I had the $8,000, I forsaw trouble here. If he was still setting on his old house next January of February, knowing that he couldn't carry two payments for long, he could be faced with either defaulting and ruining his credit rating or having to reduce his price for a quick sale, perhaps losing the $12,000 he is counting on, or even more. He really didn't want to hear this advice, but I told him that when he asked someone for that kind of money, their advice and involvement came as part of the package.

I finally told him that, bottom line, I would not feel right about helping him put himself into such a precarious situation, that he probably should cancel his new house contract (the earnest money received and forfeited would be a wash) or try to get a contingency contract on it.

In reality, I would never feel the loss of $8,000. I have the resources to bail him out even if my worst-case scenario came about. But, dang it, sooner or later he has to stand on his own two feet, make some responsible decisions, and even learn to live with deferred expectations if necessary. I am a firm believer that the fastest way to ruin anyone is to try to give them anything they want and that a little struggle is not necessarily a bad thing. I love this kid more than life itself, and if push came to shove and he really had his back to the wall, everything I have is his, but not to do foolish things with.

So, am I just being a hard-headed old fart? Or am I doing right by him?
 
Honestly I think you are making a mistake not helping him now. I know you mean well and are just being cautious, but sometimes you have to do the right thing by him. If you are not there for him now it might haunt you for years to come. He sounds like a good person with a good head on his shoulders. Things always have a way of working out and your relationship will be better for it.
Good luck with your decision.
Larry B.
 
MikeH,

"In reality, I would never feel the loss of $8,000. I have the resources to bail him out even if my worst-case scenario came about."

Those are your words. Do it. The guy (your adopted son) is trying to make a better life for him and his family. He might be able to "stand on his own two feet", but with your two feet there to help him, he will be stronger for it, as 4 is stronger than 2.
 
it's a house, right, not some "investment" scheme? Float him, especially if you can afford to. If you want him to take it seriously, get a contract.
 
My kids are just a bit older (32, 35, 37) so I know where you're coming from. However, in this case, as put forth here, I would give him the money. I've helped all my kids buy homes, cars, etc. and never regretted a dime of it. Now that I'm disabled and can't do it anymore I'm glad I did it when I could. Help him out, you won't regret it!
 
I have to side with the crew here. Give him the $8000. Call it a gift.

Your son needs to talk to a mortgage broker. Right now, he can get an interest-only ARM loan on the new house at like 2% with very little money down. It's a terrible loan. It's very, very unhealthy for the buyer. But when the first house sells, and it will maybe not this month or the next, but within a few anyway, he'll refinance out of that horrible loan and into a healthy loan. This is the sort of situation these horrible, interest-only ARM loans are actually made for. Use 'em for a few months and get out.

But the same thing is true of a deteriorating neighborhood. Use it and get out as quick as you can. Remember, we're not only talking about your son, but your grandkids too. Think of the eight grand as gift to all of them. Tell him it's Christmas in August.
 
Here's another option. You buy the second house yourself. Lease it to him for a dollar a month on a three-month lease.

If the first house sells, then when the lease is up, he'll buy that second house from you and it'll be done. If the first house doesn't sell, then he'll have to move back into the first because you'll want to lease the second one at market rate on a one-year lease. Your son will either have to figure out how he can make the payment on the first house and market-rate rent on the second, or move back into the first until it sells. If he moves back to the first and you lease the second, then the first sells, well he'll just have to move into an appartment for the remainder of the year until the one-year lease on the second house is up and then he can buy it from you and move into it.

I don't like this plan, though. I foresee more hard feelings and more damage to family in this than in just giving him the $8,000.
 
What does he need eight grand for anyway?

People are buying houses and moving in with no down payment these days, nothing. Now, granted, these financing schemes, the 80/20s, the interest-onlys, the ARMs, are not healthy for the buyer. But once the first house sells, he can refinance the second into a healthy 15-fixed.
 
I think you people are nuts, and aren't seeing anything past the $8000.
Mike, you're doing the right thing. Absolutely right.
 
It's not the $8000, it's about the ability to help family when you can. My kids, 21 and 25 are on the top of the list as far as my wife and i are concerned. We have helped them when we could and was glad to do it. If the deal goes sour there is a lesson learned.If it goes well, another lesson learned. Dad loves me and trusts my judgement. Judgement , I assume in no small part, garnered from "the old man' himself.
 
Dijos said:
it's a house, right, not some "investment" scheme? Float him, especially if you can afford to. If you want him to take it seriously, get a contract.

Definitely get something in writing - even if it's just a promissory note scribbled on a napkin. But, if you can well afford it, give him the loan. You won't regret it. (I've been on both sides of that fence - as the father and as the son.)
 
When my daughter bought her place, she was pushing the limits to do it. She didn't ask for help. I asked her about the financing, and she admitted that a better down payment would help a lot, so I gave her the money.

If your son needs money for a venture, question it, loan it under contracted terms, talk him through the idea or out of it.

But paying towards a good home for your family is buying your own peace of mind. A house is not just an investment.
 
Reading all you wrote, my gut instinct is to say "No" because this is not going to financially help you at all and in reality you will loose this money. But I would tell him, without more hesitation, that you can afford to part with the 8K. What ever goes beyond that is entirely up to him and his wife and hopefully will feel they have tapped you for enough money. Good luck!
 
Midwesterners must be as hard as southerners, because I vote "No."

The worst that can happen here is that he doesn't buy the new house. If he harbors some kind of resentment toward you for not helping him finance his life, then he isn't the man you think he is. You're his father, not a lending institution.

If you do decide to loan him the money, I would draw up a contract and charge simple interest (which is what a friend of mine used to do when he borrowed money from his parents-that way everyone was ahead financially).
 
MikeH, with all due respect, give him the money with the proviso that he has to pay it back whether he ends up getting his price for the original house or not. You want him to learn fiscal prudence and responsibility and that lesson can also be learned by making good on your loan (even if it's 80 bucks a month for 100 months) and his family happiness is worth more than money can buy.

You have an opportunity to help them that may not come around again - take it while it's there. When all is said and done, we may be just dust in the wind, but money isn't even worth that much.
 
I like Gollnicks idea of leasing, even if he doesn't like it :D I'm sure there is a way to loan him the $8000.00 under conditions where all parties are in a win/win situation. The other thing to consider is that it's better to see your money working while you're alive then when you're dead and can't enjoy it :thumbup:
 
At first I was going to answer no. But then I remebered all the times my parents helped me out, and it was plenty. You are basically concerened he will be spoiled somehow. I don't hink you have to worry he's well past thae spoiling age.

I'd suggest loaning him the money with some sort of contract, and redouble his efforts to get his old house sold. What will likely happened is about the time you loan him the moeny, his old house will sell anyway.
 
Mike,
I never lend money or sell cars to friends and Relatives..That said I always GIVE money to Friends and relatives ( have not given any cars away) If you are in a financial position to help your son GIVE him the $8,000. I was in the exact same situation as your son when We bought this house. My FIL gave us a sum of money for a down payment. Later when out house sold we also put the proceeds of the house sale into our house and we had instant equity in our home which at a later date allowed us to refinance to a 15 year mortgage at 4%. Because of my FIL generosity in 10 years we will own our home free and clear and I will be able to pay my kids college tuition and again pass the torch.

See how that works??

My advice is give him the money. Tell him it is a gift for him to invest in his house but nothing else. Also tell him that this gift is going to be deducted from your estate at the time of your death if need be. Then when he sells his house and pays off the additional 12k into his home..he has 20k of equity right away. And you gave him something that he still has to work his but off to own but it gives your kid and your grandchildren something they can sink their roots into...a home..

Best of luck..

Ren
 
I never had alot growing up, but I had enough. (A military salary just doesn't go that far with 4 kids.) I always look back on that, and vowed that when I grew up, I would do whatever I could to help my family down the road, to give them the things that I never had. Or at least the opportunity.

I would never accept any money from my parents without expecting to pay it back. Give it or loan it, but help him out. It's not like he's buying a boat or a motorcycle (or custom knife :D ). He's trying to better his life.

If it will not hurt you financially to do this, do it...

Good luck

Glenn
 
Mike:

I grew up in a cotton mill town too..... (Alex City).

I'm gonna side with you on this one.

Robert
 
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