Kamisori shaving razor work in progress, with some general questions along the way

Rsq

Joined
Aug 7, 2011
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I have cut the blank so far out of 3/16" 1095 bar stock. It measures 5 3/4" tip to tip, with a blade length of 2 inches and and width of 1". I want to grind the blade down to 6/8-7/8, but I have heard that the traditional ratio of width to spine thickness is 3.5:1. I am wondering whether this ratio holds for kamisori type razors?

If it does, I will want to plate it with something semi-precious like silver, but I will need to apply a plating that is thicker than a typical electroplate, as it will be both functional and decorative. (3.5:1, with a small tolerance, is the ratio that allows optimal bevel maintenance, as I understand it)

I also have stock of m390, but it is .144". I would pose the question to my very knowledgeable audience here whether this type of steel, which has superior edge retension and toughness, and also optimally ht'd comes out at the rather impressive 62rc, would allow for a slightly larger tolerance, like a ratio of 4:1 or even 4.5:1?

3.5:1 gives a bevel angle of about 11' approaching what Ive heard is the optimal 25 inclusive. On a kamisori, the geometry is quite diffent. It's going to be 1/4 hollow on the bottom and fully hollow over 2/3 the blade on top, if Im successful. Likely it will be more like 1/2 hollow, but the bevel angles will come out the same. I repeat this project with a traditional western style straight, will the lower bevel angle on the m390 be a substantial problem?

This was a pretty ambitious project for me to choose as my first blade, but the more I challenge myself, the faster I will improve. Plus, its small size suits itself to my equipment, which include a dremel, files, and a worksharp 1/2" belt grinder that I am tasking with far more than it is indended for.

I'm very curious to hear people's opinions and experiences. If I cant find any definitive answers, I will likely just do it all my way and see how it comes out. I like experimenting, and the steel isnt that expensive.

Btw, ht plans are Peters HT
 
I would shoot for about 16 degree total angle +- 1 maybe 2. With the heat treatment and 1095 RC62 sounds good I would not only dwell on RC hardness, but also make sure you do some grain refinement cycles. It is just not the hardness but the grain of the steel matters a lot with razors.

Charlie
 
well you beat me to it charlie
thats the info i was going to post (tho i bet i woudl have had lots of spelling problems:)
 
I would shoot for about 16 degree total angle +- 1 maybe 2. With the heat treatment and 1095 RC62 sounds good I would not only dwell on RC hardness, but also make sure you do some grain refinement cycles. It is just not the hardness but the grain of the steel matters a lot with razors.

Charlie

What about with m390? Ive calculated the angles for this one, it will be .8" wide, ground along the full width on one side, then the other side will be flat for .2" along the width, and ground along the other .6", ending up with a 3+13 angle, yielding a perfect 16. I may shoot for a hair over .8, since this is actually a 16.35 angle, but now we're just splitting hairs (pun intended)

Im considering a grind for the next kamisori that leaves the edge perfectly centered, meaning about .07"x2 for the spine. This yields a 5+6.65=11 degree bevel. (I am holding constant a .8" blade width, with 3/4 of one side incorporated in the grind and the full width of the reverse). Will an 11 degree edge be too ambitious for even an m390 razor?
 
I do not have any experience with m390, I would just be guessing. I would try and see how it works if I were you. I have tried plenty of things that did not work, it is part of the process. It all boils down to proper heat treat for the steel you use and geometry.

Butch,
I always get the meaning of you post, I had rather have good content than good spelling any day.
 
i have found that when working with SS or higher alloy its better to have a bit more angle 17+ total cause of the way the carbides can fall out of the edge

these are after all about as extreme a use for knife steel as i can think of due to the hardness and the edge geometry (also the fineness of the honning )

in razors i woudl much rather have a lower ally that i could keep a super fine grain (cant wait to try CTS XHP in a razor to see how it is vs the cpm154 blades i have made )
 
Shouldnt the particle metallurgy keep the grain reasonably fine? Part of the reason i chose m390 is that it is 4% vanadium, which ordinarily forms the largest carbides, and I am curious to find out the answer this question. I guess I'll know soon enough

Which steels would you consider ideal for a razor?
I know the answer sill probably not be m390, i chose it to test the steel's performance for this application
 
Progress so far
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Slightly hollow
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Left thick at edge to withstand ht
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Thoughts?
 
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