Kershaw using Chinese steel on USA made models

3Guardsmen

3Guardsmen

Joined
Mar 16, 2005
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Does anybody know why Kershaw is using 8Cr13MoV on several of their new, USA made pieces? I just came from browsing their 09 catalog, on their website, and noticed that several of their new, USA made models have this steel listed as the blade steel. The reason I ask is that I thought the main reasons Kershaw started using its new, proprietary, Sandvik 14C28N steel (13C26 before that, and 440A and 420HC before that), was that it was a high-quality steel, yet it was able to be easily stamped, and it allowed them to make very affordable knives right here in the USA.:confused: I don't understand reason/s for the switch to the Chinese steel on the new, made in USA pieces?

Here are some of the new, made in the USA models, with 8Cr13MoV listed as the blade steel:
OD-2
Select Fire
Scamp
Chill
Blitz



Regards,
3G
 
I'm pretty sure that all the models you list are actually made in China. I think their web guy just used the same template for all the new listings.

None of those models have made in the USA next to them in the print catalog.
 
And the goal of all those knives you listed are to make them affordable, to open up the market a little, so it makes more since to use that steel and keep the prices low.
 
kneedeep said:
I'm pretty sure that all the models you list are actually made in China. I think their web guy just used the same template for all the new listings.

None of those models have made in the USA next to them in the print catalog.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that info, Kneedeep! I was really having trouble grasping why any company, let alone a company as innovative as Kershaw, would want to import Chinese steel for use in USA made knives, especially since they have some really neat steels already at their disposal!

I saw the online catalog and did one of these.....:eek:.......:confused:

Thanks!:thumbup:

Regards,
3G
 
hwpaintballer said:
And the goal of all those knives you listed are to make them affordable, to open up the market a little, so it makes more since to use that steel and keep the prices low.
Click to expand...

So Kneedeep was wrong? They are made in the USA with Chinese steel?:confused:

Regards,
3G
 
I fully understand they are value priced models, with the main goal being to 'open up the market' so to speak, but are they made here or in China?

Regards,
3G

Edit: Well, Knifecenter has the OD-2 listed as being made in China, so I'm going to go with what KneeDeep said, that it's a website/online catalog error.
 
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Hwpaintballer was just adding to Kneedeep's post. They are indeed China made but I'm sure that they are still of great quality, so it shouldn't be an issue.
 
IMHO it's Chinese, as both Benchmade and Spyderco offer models clearly marked Made in China using that steel.

And it's good stuff - handles and cuts every bit as well as AUS8. CRKT should use it too. Makers importing knives with it tend to offer G10 grips - which gets you a folder with two medium quality materials at half the price of a US made knife.

The Chinese labor rate and lack of onerous bureaucratic government mandates on overhead allow the Chinese to offer equivalent - equal - goods at half price. That's why we don't export knives so much, among many other consumer goods. Heck, we won't even buy our own stuff, it's so overpriced.

I recently bought a vacuum pump for A/C use for about $90. It has an electric motor, crankshaft, rod and piston, seals, and a reed valve head for producing vacuum down to 27"hg. Compare that to a forged aluminum AR lower CNC finished and anodized for the same price. The vacuum pump has a lot more labor, machining, parts, and assembly.

Basically, the whole problem of imports would be seriously reduced if we'd quit rehiring the same people to pass more onerous laws against our own production.

The guy who said we get the Congress we deserve was right.
 
tirod3 said:
The Chinese labor rate and lack of onerous bureaucratic government mandates on overhead allow the Chinese to offer equivalent - equal - goods at half price. That's why we don't export knives so much, among many other consumer goods. Heck, we won't even buy our own stuff, it's so overpriced.

Basically, the whole problem of imports would be seriously reduced if we'd quit rehiring the same people to pass more onerous laws against our own production.

The guy who said we get the Congress we deserve was right.
Click to expand...

You do raise a legitimate point with the American goods being overpriced. However, I do not think it is just "onerous laws against our own production." You have to take into account the benefits that American workers have (health, dental and other insurances, as well as 401k's). If you compare the living standard of an American worker to that of a Chinese worker you will be startled.

Do I think the labor unions have become bloated and are not what they used to be? The answer is yes. Do I think we should do away with unions all together to level our competitive potential with China? No, I do not. American workers have worked hard for decent benefits and a good standard of living. Chinese workers see that and although it doesn't get much press over here, there are rumblings in China for greater worker/farmer rights and more democratic government.

I personally have no problem with Chinese-made products. As long as a company has good quality control (ie. Spyderco) then the consumer will be fine with his or her purchase.
 
3Guardsmen said:
I fully understand they are value priced models, with the main goal being to 'open up the market' so to speak, but are they made here or in China?

Regards,
3G

Edit: Well, Knifecenter has the OD-2 listed as being made in China, so I'm going to go with what KneeDeep said, that it's a website/online catalog error.
Click to expand...

3G, I agree with Kneedeep as well. Those knives are made in China, it would be crazy to import Chinese steel for US made knives. Plus, I have the same print catalog as Kneedeep and they are not listed as being made in the USA. :thumbup:
 
Regardless, this is a negative trend from a knife nut standpoint.
I'm sure the quality will be there, the knives will be an awesome value for the price, and it's a good step from a corporate standpoint... The problem is, this is the path to the dark side (not that dark side, the one that darksiders hate).
 
Joshua J. said:
Regardless, this is a negative trend from a knife nut standpoint.
I'm sure the quality will be there, the knives will be an awesome value for the price, and it's a good step from a corporate standpoint... The problem is, this is the path to the dark side (not that dark side, the one that darksiders hate).
Click to expand...

This is an understandable concern, but Kershaw is committed to manufacturing knives here in the US. As has been mentioned the goal with these knives is to provide and affordable entry into the Kershaw brand. There are many US made Kershaws that most of the knife nuts here would consider very affordable and a great value. These Chinese manufactured models come in at an even lower price point and will introduce people to quality knives that might otherwise only have ever purchased one of those pretty much disposable $5 or $10 knives in the plastic jar at cashwrap.

Hopefully people will buy them and think, "this is a pretty good knife, I wonder what the more expensive ones are like?". With any luck they'll end up being knife enthusiasts too.
 
It is easy to see that this will turn into another "why we hate Chinese knives thread".

In an attempt to derail it back to topic, I think it was Thomas that explained it (maybe several times...) when he said that they want to <paraphrasing here>:

1) expand their market by supplying a quality knife at a good price
2) gain more name recognition
3) respond to the market desire to have a quality name attached to a quality, affordable knife. These make great "introduction to Kershaw" knives

This also has the ancillary effect of putting more money into the Kershaw USA coffers. With more money, they can continue to experiment with upper end knife steels, new patterns and innovative production techniques.

That steel seems to fill the void for a lot of Taiwanese made knives these days, and as subcontractors to Spyderco, KAI, CRKT, etc., I wouldn't be surprised if the knives were all made in just a few factories.

The steel itself is pretty good and I have a couple of knives that have it. It makes a great utility work knife and is really easy to sharpen. I use my Tenacious as a slicer and it holds the edge very well. I have a CKRT drifter that I use as a work knife and it is called on to cut all manner of things, chip out old caulk and sealers, flake off paint, light prying, etc. It hasn't rusted in my sweaty pocket all summer.

I don't consider these knives to be the best of my collection by any means (no, they don't hold an edge as well as my S110V Shallot). But they are certainly good working knives and at the price point, this steel is a good bargain. If I chipped my Shallot at work, I would be really pissed off. If I chipped my CRKT Drifter at work, I would think - well, that's what it's for and then go sharpen it.

Unless a knife is junk, there is a place for it. And even without seeing them, I would say that anything that Kershaw brands wouldn't be a bad knife to own.

Robert

Oh yeah.... Don't forget the Half Ton on the list of new Taiwanese offerings from Kershaw...
 
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Nothing wrong with 8cr13MoV...Easy to maintain and holds an edge ok

granted its not VG 10 but its pretty good for the cheddar

No hateraid drinking here :)
 
Many of my family will be getting an Od-2 this Christmas, many people who would regularly not buy a quality knife, and I have perfect confidence that they will be more than happy with them.
 
Thanks to all of the knowledgeable Kershaw guys who responded and clarified where the new models are being made.:thumbup:

I want to make sure there are no misunderstandings regarding the intention of my thread. This is not a 'rag on knives being made in China' thread. In fact, I may end up getting several of the new Kershaw models made there! I was just trying to find out why, from the information on the website, it appeared as though Kershaw was importing Chinese steel for USA made knives. Now that we know that is not the case, my question has been answered.

Please do not let this turn into a 'rag on knives being made in China' thread!

Regards,
3G
 
No problem, intent was understood. :D

I just got confirmation of the error on the site, it should get fixed soon.
 
I have two folders made of Chinese steel, and they seem to be as good, or better, than the knife I have made of Sandvik steel.

It's not Crucible, or Hitachi, but it's very decent steel. :thumbup:
 
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