Klotzli - Help me understand

DaveH

DaveH

Joined
Dec 2, 1999
Messages
12,249
OK, I'm trying to understand but seem not to get it. All the Klotzli knives I've seen look really nice.

But the ones I've picked up and examined really do not seem to be better put together that a spydeco for example. Further they don't use the newest steel types, yet they cost 2-3 times more.

Am I missing something?
 
I think the price stems from the fact that Klotzlis are made in Switzerland instead of Japan or Golden, Colorado. In the knife world, lots of knives cost a according to who made them, prestige comes with a price tag.
 
I have visited Hans Peter Klötzli’s workshop in Burgdorf (Switzerland, some minutes with train from Bern) about year ago. I can’t consider their knives as high technology production ones, rather they are handmades manufactured in small runs. There were only five people employed at that moment. Entire workshop looked rather as a bit too big watchmaker’s one than as knife manufacture. The only CNC machine I saw they use for titanium handle milling, entire blade work is hand labor with traditional methods. In fact the only operation what could be considered as hi-tech on the blades is laser cutting to shape.

I’m just wondering how many times more expensive is labor in Switzerland comparing with Taiwan or even Japan...
And of course the name is counted into the bill. Chris Reeve’s knives also are 3-4 times more expensive than BM’s or SPYDERCO’s made of the same materials...
 
What BM (or Spyderco) is made of the same materials as CRK? The Pinnacle? Not close to a match on the tolerances, or even the blade steel.
 
They have some nice, sleek designs. I have one of the first versions of the wimpff-designed warncliff in 440C/G10 thats just about the lightest 4" bladed folder i've ever handled. But they are a bit pricey though...

Andrew Limsk
 
Sergiusz,

OK, that makes sense, so in other words a significant amount of the cost is because it's handmade.
 
Esav,
What BM (or Spyderco) is made of the same materials as CRK? The Pinnacle? Not close to a match on the tolerances, or even the blade steel
Click to expand...
BM have made their Pinnacle with titanium handle and ATS-34 blade at about 30% or less of Sebenza street price. Even skipping the fact that it is no real life difference in performance between BG-42 and ATS-34 I certainly can state that they are the same grade materials. BTW, if I remember well first Sebenzas came with ATS-34 blades at the same price range... CRKT makes their S-2 of the same grade materials and SPYDERCO Ti Salsa also...
Probably it would be possible to keep within even tighter tolerances for even higher price. I usually compare the execution quality (including tolerances) with real life requirements for knife efficient and safe use but not with the level what manufacturer theoretically could rise them on.

Dave,
Yes, especially taking into consideration that they are Swiss handmades. Switzerland is fairly expensive country on average European background. It would be quite unnaturally if this wouldn’t touch their labor also.
 
DaveH, I have owned a number of Klotzli knives.

They are all very well made. Their pivot action and resistance induced by the ball detent are almost always smoother and less almost any Spyderco knife I have ever handled (and I have owned or handled virtually every model they have produced).

They use 440C and ATS-34 steel. These blade steels are still used by makers such as Bob Terzuola. They use titanium clips, not stainless steel, so again, more cost.

The blades are handground. I can't say that makes a hill of beans difference in cutting performance, but certain adds to the cost.

I happend to very much dislike their water-jet cut carbon fiber scales. Beautiful to look at, but I just hate scratching them.

They are producing some really nice true Wharncliff blade designs, which sets them apart from other "semi-production" shops.

Unfortunately, they are in an uncomfortable price-point middle-ground between Spyderco/Benchmade and Chris Reeves Knives. I gather that this is why they are not terribly popular amongst BF members, or sell very well over the internet.
 
Thanks for the link, but after having handled them at a recent show, I wouldn't even consider them until they where around $60. Because, for me, that's what I would expect to pay for a knife of the quality of the ones I handled.
 
You are kidding, right?

I take it that this thread is related to the "I love my Sebenza thread".

The CRK folders are plenty nice, but very expensive. In fact, I sold my Small Classic Sebenza (here on the forum) after carrying it side by side with a Klotzli Sailor knife.

Side by side, the Klotzli Sailor is an excellent design, more fitting for my EDC. At $170, the Sailor is $135 less expensive than a Small Sebbie.

I am carrying the Sailor right now in fact. Smoother opening than any Sebenza, decorative (without paying more), much thinner profile and a modified Wharncliff blade shape, something CRK doesn't offer.

I still have a Mnandi, and when a good deal comes along, I like the CRK Large Classic, but I have a Blackwood framelock folder on order for $400, just $55 more than a large classic. The Sebenza is quite frankly, overpriced IMO. However, I am certain that the market will decide.
 
I guess we will have to disagree.

I examined a small slip joint, opened rough and seemed kinda flimsy.

I examined the ACC1 (I think), it was well done but better done than a benchmade or spyderco? I didn't think so. (around $200)

I examined the one that like is supposed to look like a space ship, again it was nice, but I think it was supposed to be around $300.
 
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