knife balence?

[henryblowery]

i was gana try and make a throwing knife and everybody says that a throwing knife has to have proper balence and i was wandering where the balence point should be. in the midle, at the handle were?

 

[Will P.]

It depends on what you want it to do. Make it handle heavy if you throw from the blade and blade heavy if you throw from the handle.

A neutral balance (balance right in the center) is probably best. Balance doesn't matter that much - the thrower simply has to adjust to the different spin. Having all your knives center balanced makes the throws consistent.

I don't practice end-over-end throws, so the idea thrower IMHO is a symmetrical dagger that is neither slender nor fat, has a neutral balance, and is not heavy but has heft. Most people who throw competition style (end-over-end) seem to prefer heavier knives.

 

[Watchful]

...Make it handle heavy if you throw from the blade and blade heavy if you throw from the handle...A neutral balance (balance right in the center) is probably best. Balance doesn't matter that much...a symmetrical dagger that is neither slender nor fat, has a neutral balance, and is not heavy but has heft...

Couldn't have put it better. My thought is that a throwing knife undergoes a lot of driving force. I wouldn't bother putting too sharp of an edge on it: it doesn't need to slice so much as punch its way through.

As evidence, one of the perfect objects to throw either end-over-end or with Will P.'s method is longer screwdriver...or a metal barbecue skewer (haven't tried this one? It'll stick almost every time). These are neither balanced nor sharp, but respond well to almost every throwing method.

 

[henryblowery]

thanks that helped alot and what is wills way of throwing?

 

[Watchful]

thanks that helped alot and what is wills way of throwing?

Sorry to answer for Will P., here, but since I made the comment... and since a lot of people have NOT heard of this method...

Will P. uses a "zero-spin throw" which is not too often seen but is getting some popularity. I'm just getting into the overhand version of it, but have been using the underhand version for 20+ years.

In a traditional forward throw, you hold the knife by the handle or the blade, based on your preference for the knife and how you like to throw, etc. You throw the knife forward, putting a bit of snap into the wrist.

A typical knife will rotate once every three feet (this varies, but it's easy to figure out the exact spin value after a couple of throws)... therefore, you set yourself a set distance from the target. If you hit the target with the handle, you move up or back a half step. Your next throw will either stick or land flat...if flat, you moved up when you should have moved back or vice-versa. On your third throw, it should be sticking point first (you may need to adjust a quarter step to fine-tune the throw). If you stand that exact distance from the target, and throw the same knife the same way, you'll stick it almost every time. You can move up or back by three feet, and it still sticks. Of course, if you grab a different knife, you usually need to readjust your distance.

This is great if you throw for fun or to pass the time--and millions of people do just that, and I don't criticize it. However, if you want to throw knives as a weapon for defense or hunting, the forward throw has a lot of obvious problems. Usually, you don't get to pick your range--you have to throw from where you are, regardless of whether it's divisible by three. Also, you can't guess: you need to be right every time.

As a result, the zero spin throw has emerged as a viable solution. You throw the knive by the handle in such a way that it doesn't spin (or tumble) around its center of gravity. Basically, it travels like a dart: point first, so that it sticks from any range. Hence, zero spin.

There's an underhand version of this which works really well: you simply "chuck" the weapon point first toward your target. By stepping forward, you add a lot of power to it, and the knife can stick pretty deep in from even 5 yards. It's easy to do: I taught two complete newbies this throw and in five minutes they were sticking everything from letter openers to screwdrivers to scissors into flattened cardboard targets.

In the Tactical forum, some of us are trying to coerce Will P. into posting some pictures of him doing it.

There's also a sidearm throw, but I've always had trouble with this one. I've tried this one probably fifty times and stuck it maybe twice or three times. I can't comment on this throw since I clearly don't have it! I hope someone here can tell me what I need to do...but I'm still working on my range with the overhard version.

Hope this helped.

 

[Will P.]

Watchful, I can do a throw across the chest. You are throwing the knife in a long arc, though, so the arc gets more complicated than a straight overhand.

I don't think it is a particularly useful defense skill. But it's a lot of fun. I'll post pictures as soon as my membership upgrade goes through... hopefully tomorrow. If you want, I can email you a couple of video clips.

Can you do underhand throws?

 

[Danzz]

I have seen Will P. throw a variety of knives in person and its pretty scary to watch. I can't say specifically how he did it because I don't know anything about throwing knives and I'll probably get something wrong.

 

[henryblowery]

can you not post pic unless you are a gold member of somthin let me try

 

[Watchful]

Watchful, I can do a throw across the chest. You are throwing the knife in a long arc, though, so the arc gets more complicated than a straight overhand.

I don't think it is a particularly useful defense skill. But it's a lot of fun. I'll post pictures as soon as my membership upgrade goes through... hopefully tomorrow. If you want, I can email you a couple of video clips.

Can you do underhand throws?

Will P., w/r/t underhand throws, did you mean me? I can do that underhand zero-spin throw very well. I've seen some snapping underhand throws, but they seem to put waaaayy too much spin on the knife, and have never tried it.

It sounds like your "throw across the chest" technique is the sidearm throw I was trying to do. If you can't post the clips, I'd be more than happy to receive an email from you with them.

Look forward to learning a lot from you.

 

[Will P.]

I payed for a Gold Membership, so I should be able to post the pics soon. I'll make a clip of a side arm throw as soon as I can scrounge some pizza boxes.

I would love to see the technique for an underhand throw... I've played around with one but with absolutely no success.

Henry to post a pic lined offsite, use an IMG tag:

I just don't have a place to host pics... the firewall doesn't seem to like me upload stuff to unidentified servers.

 

[Watchful]

It almost looks like bowling.

I'll see if I can get some pictures taken the next time I'm throwing.

Will P., thanks!

 

[Will P.]

More like boxing...

Pics are posted.