Knife construction question....

Brasso3

Brasso3

Joined
Apr 28, 2008
Messages
293
I guess this is a two part question. Regarding knives that are made like the Randall knives, with the hidden tang and butt cap:

1. Is there a name for this type of construction?

2. How does it compare strength wise to a knife like a Becker that is one piece construction where the blade becomes the handle itself?

I like the looks of these knives, including the knock offs like the Blackjacks, but I'm just not sure how strong they would be for a camping knife. I have a Ka-Bar that has similar construction and I can literally bend this knife in half at the hilt with my bare hands. I'm sure the Randalls and Blackjacks are probably heat treated better, etc., but this has always made me leery of this type of construction.

Can anyone set my mind at ease? I'm really liking the look of the Blackjack model 125's. :)

Thanks,

Rob
 
If you need a sharpened prybar, full tang construction will do it (IE Becker, Spyderco Mule etc) for cutting chores, rat tang/stick tang/hidden tang construction will do what you need.
 
I've always gone by hidden tang or stick tang to describe this design.

You can bend them with your bare hands? Sounds like a circus strongman act!

Actually, how would that ever happen in real use? Contrary to YouTube, people don't bend their knives sideways or in vises.

The hidden tang design has been used for millenia, for hard labor and in war and has always been sufficient. Your own example of a Randall Made knife is a good example of a excellent forged knife which uses a hidden/stick tang and which has been carried & used in war for seventy years. KABARs are another example of tested combat knives. Scandinavian Puukkos would be another example of this knife design which has survived some of the harshest environments & temperatures and kept on performing.

Yes, there are sharpened prybars, but that is really an answer that is looking for a problem.
 
CWL said:
I've always gone by hidden tang or stick tang to describe this design.

You can bend them with your bare hands? Sounds like a circus strongman act!

Actually, how would that ever happen in real use? Contrary to YouTube, people don't bend their knives sideways or in vises.

The hidden tang design has been used for millenia, for hard labor and in war and has always been sufficient. Your own example of a Randall Made knife is a good example of a excellent forged knife which uses a hidden/stick tang and which has been carried & used in war for seventy years. KABARs are another example of tested combat knives. Scandinavian Puukkos would be another example of this knife design which has survived some of the harshest environments & temperatures and kept on performing.

Yes, there are sharpened prybars, but that is really an answer that is looking for a problem.
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Good answer, CWL.
 
Valuable thoughts and advices. I read your topic with great interest.
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You can bend them with your bare hands? Sounds like a circus strongman act!
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No. That's why I asked. Just grab hold and bend. It's not hard to do. I'm guessing that the KaBar isn't the best heat treated steel around as it shouldn't hold a bend like mine does. It's supposed to spring back isn't it? Any who, that's why I asked.

I'm sure the other makers probably have better steal or maybe I have a particularly bad example of a KaBar. I really like the feel of the knife with the compressed leather washers. Grippy and comfortable.
 
A hidden tang knife can be every bit as strong as full-tang one of similar size and materials.

People very often forget or ignore the fact that nearly every "full tang" knife on the market has various holes in it to reduce weight and improve balance, and generally don't have any more steel left in them than a well-designed hidden tang anyway.

Brasso3 said:
... maybe I have a particularly bad example of a KaBar.
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You most certainly do. Even fully annealed 1095 isn't that easy to bend. Pics or it didn't happen ;)
 
If you can bend it with your hands it isn't a true kabar. It may be one of the copies from China that all of the manufactures are having issues with right now. You can Baton wood with any Kabar, including the hidden tang designs. The have a sub-forum on this site, stop by and have a look.
 
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