Knifemaker's Guild Show

S

Sidehill Gouger

Joined
Dec 29, 2007
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Anyone going to the Knifemaker's Guild Show next weekend? Last chance for Florida. Hopefully Louisville won't be another New Orleans.
 
Charlie and I are going. We have a table and will be on the collecting side of the table too. I am presenting knives to be judged for voting status on Thursday and am looking forward to this Friday more than any Friday I can remember since college.:D
 
Sidehill Gouger said:
I'm getting the impression no one cares about the Guild Show anymore?
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Your comments may be a little strong, though it's not the show it once was.
Perhaps that will change next year with it's new location in Louisville KY.

I plan to attend next year.
 
There are a lot of people that are working very hard to make this a good Show. There are going to be a bunch of good makers behind the tables and some fantastic knives on top of them. I hope, if you can be there, you will stop by our table and introduce yourself. This is a great show to meet and spend some time talking with the makers.
 
It's still a good show, with a lot of the best knifemakers, and draws a good crowd of collectors.

I had a table last year and did pretty well even though it was my first show. I decided to skip this year primarily because of the travel expenses. You can bet I will be there next year. I think the move will be great for the show and the new venue is fantastic.
 
Hi Sidehill,

Actually the Guild Show was much larger than it is now when it was in New Orleans. Attendance wise its best shows were in Las Vegas. Many, including myself thought returning to Florida (instead of continuing to rotate the show between different locations) was the way to go. This has not proven to be the case.

Everyone works very hard behind the scenes of any knife show. As Mister Sat pointed out he had a good show...but is not willing to return due to travel expenses. If a show is really good, extra travel expenses will be made up by additional sales.

However, he does make a good point. Travel expenses cannot be ignored. The home of the "Magic Kingdom" is also home to very high prices in the summer. I live in east central Georgia. It is 6 1/2 hours for me to drive to the show.

I think Louisville will be as good of a show if not better. More centrally located, cheaper airfare, cheaper rooms, not as hot and less traffic.
 
Les Robertson said:
Travel expenses cannot be ignored. The home of the "Magic Kingdom" is also home to very high prices in the summer.
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I went last year and the venue and surroundings were crazy expensive. Louisville sounds much better.

I also thought they were doing a good job trying to resurrect the show.

Coop
 
There are always two major sides to any knife show, buyers and sellers. So far, the replies to my question seem to be coming from makers and other sellers. What I was more interested in was how many buyers intended to go? There was a time when the month before the Guild show seemed to generate a lot of chatter on this website. Those days seem to be past.

Las Vegas did have pretty good foot traffic. The last New Orleans show was really dead. Orlando wasn't much better so I quit going several years ago. I was just wondering if anything had changed.
 
Hi Sidehill

There was a time when the month before the Guild show seemed to generate a lot of chatter on this website. Those days seem to be past.
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You have answered your own question.


IMHO, the Guild shot itself in the foot when they changed the rules and eliminated most of the very well known tactical folder makers. Those very well known and very "Hot" makers just went to the Blade Show. Most, even though they were called to join the Guild again and they would be "Grandfathered" in, declined.

The ABS started its show, so many of the MS makers who attended the Guild Show stopped going. Next year the ABS Show and the Guild Show will be within 3 weeks of each other. a

Then every other year when the AKI was happening. Most of those makers had to pass on the Guild show to have enough or very special knives for the AKI. The AKI will be happening again in October 2009.

Then there is the internet......
 
Les Robertson said:
Hi Sidehill



You have answered your own question.


IMHO, the Guild shot itself in the foot when they changed the rules and eliminated most of the very well known tactical folder makers. Those very well known and very "Hot" makers just went to the Blade Show. Most, even though they were called to join the Guild again and they would be "Grandfathered" in, declined.

The ABS started its show, so many of the MS makers who attended the Guild Show stopped going. Next year the ABS Show and the Guild Show will be within 3 weeks of each other. a

Then every other year when the AKI was happening. Most of those makers had to pass on the Guild show to have enough or very special knives for the AKI. The AKI will be happening again in October 2009.

Then there is the internet......
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The Knifemakers Guild is, and always has been, for makers of handmade knives. The whole rules thing was over outsourcing work. The bylaws have been clarified.
 
HI Mister,

Curious about the "Outsourcing" thing. I know of a very prominent Guild Member who was having blades laser cut in 1989. He wasn't asked to leave. Yes the Guild knew he was doing this.

As well, in lieu of "Grandfathering" the very well known tactical folder makers. You would have thought the Guild would have thought that through. I mean if they were just going to turn around and let them back (guess there was a "loop hole" in the bylaws) in. Shouldn't they done that in the first place?

Lastly, curious how you cant outsource blades being cut....but no one takes issue with blades being heat treated by someone else. Im not a knife maker, but Im pretty sure the heat treating is what allows the blade to be able to hold an edge. I understand why knife makers outsource the heat treat. If they send enough blades they can get them done relatively cheaply (Compared to actually doing it by themselves in the shop a few at a time), by professionals, makes good business sense. Sort of like having the blades laser cut. You can have them done relatively cheaply (Compared to actually doing it by themselves in the shop), by professionals, makes good business sense.

So why is it again that outsourcing heat treating is ok, but not having your blades laser cut? No answer necessary...it was a Rhetorical Question. :D

You are right, the Guild is for the knife makers....which is exactly why it has become the show it is today.
 
Les Robertson said:
HI Mister,

Curious about the "Outsourcing" thing. I know of a very prominent Guild Member who was having blades laser cut in 1989. He wasn't asked to leave. Yes the Guild knew he was doing this.

As well, in lieu of "Grandfathering" the very well known tactical folder makers. You would have thought the Guild would have thought that through. I mean if they were just going to turn around and let them back (guess there was a "loop hole" in the bylaws) in. Shouldn't they done that in the first place?

Lastly, curious how you cant outsource blades being cut....but no one takes issue with blades being heat treated by someone else. Im not a knife maker, but Im pretty sure the heat treating is what allows the blade to be able to hold an edge. I understand why knife makers outsource the heat treat. If they send enough blades they can get them done relatively cheaply (Compared to actually doing it by themselves in the shop a few at a time), by professionals, makes good business sense. Sort of like having the blades laser cut. You can have them done relatively cheaply (Compared to actually doing it by themselves in the shop), by professionals, makes good business sense.

So why is it again that outsourcing heat treating is ok, but not having your blades laser cut? No answer necessary...it was a Rhetorical Question. :D

You are right, the Guild is for the knife makers....which is exactly why it has become the show it is today.
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Great point, show promoters shouldn't forget about the collector/buyer.
 
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The Knifemakers Guild bylaws are pretty clear and can found at http://www.knifemakersguild.com/bylaws.shtml

I will beg to differ on the last comment. The Guild is for the makers AND the collectors. In fact, they very much appreciate and cater to the many collectors who travel to the show from around the world including staging a banquet each year specifically for the Honorary Members (collectors).
 
Hi Mister,

The Banquet only became a reality after the Guild Hired Bruce Voyles.

Bruce brought to the makers attention, that it was the collectors not the makers who buy the knives and make the show successful.

Bruce introduced the Banquet, Seminars, Guild Awards for Knife makers and a cutting competition.

As well Bruce asked myself and Bob Neal to both judge the first Guild Awards and do our collector seminar. I was then asked to help Pat Crawford with his seminar on the business of custom knives.

Bruce thanked me each time...as did Pat.

Guess how many members of the Board said "Thank You"???

You guess it not one. Not one single knife maker could take 30 seconds to say thank you.

Don't think that they are completely rude...when Steve Johnson called me up about renewing my membership. I told him I wouldn't be and explained why. He then said he apologized and thanked me for helping the Guild.

I told both Steve and Eugene Shadley that where I raised when someone went out of your way to do something for you. At a minimum you went out of your way to say thank you.

You are correct the Knifemakers Guild is about the knife makers. If I was a knife maker everyone would have been thanking me. Maybe because I was not a "voting" member they didn't think it was necessary.

Eventually I did get a letter and a phone call from Eugene. Very apologetic, very nice guy.

Needless to say I am no longer an associate member of the Guild and have not been back to a show.

This from an Honorary member since 1986.

All that aside, I have been known to buy a few knives now and again. I suspect some of the other members would have liked to see me at the show.

Mister if you really thought the organization was that great, you would be in Orlando next weekend. You would spend the extra money....because the organization is about the knife makers. However, it appears that some of the members don't see that some reciprocation is involved.

Then again, at least in my experience of 22 years as an Honorary Member that is what I have learned.

If you get a chance, you should contact Bruce and ask him how he was "thanked" by the Guild. Interesting story.
 
The common "Guilds" of today rarely last as they are run by individual craftsmen, not business people. Traditionally, a typical guild system is run by businesses that need young, well-trained craftsmen to take up careers in their business every year to stave off attrition. the apprentice process ensures that the new employees meet a quality standard. They have a financial interest in cultivating new craftsmen. An "art" guild like the Knifemakers guild has no vested interest in creating new blood, just a club for the old blood.
 
Mr. Robertson, I don't know you and I don't think you know me. I do support the Guild as I think it is a good long-standing organization made up of excellent knifemakers and others who support the knife industry.

I said travel expenses were the PRIMARY reason that I am not going to Orlando this year but it is not the only reason.

I don't know what happened two decades ago and I don't really think it is relevant. Whoever is holding grudges for 10-20 years really needs to get over it in my humble opinion.

There are two sides to every story. I have heard very different accounts of Bruce Voyles involvement with the Guild. I wasn't there, I didn't see it, so I don't know what really happened. Nor do I really care at this point.

You obviously had your feelings hurt. Officers of the Guild belatedly apologized. What else can they do at this point?

I think the Guild serves a good purpose in mentoring and bringing new custom knifemakers along. They also provide a lot of exposure and good PR for the industry as a whole.

There are now several knife organizations and I see too much sniping among them. It serves no good purpose for any of us to continue bad mouthing each other over things that happened years ago. Club membership changes, directors change, rules change with the times. Knives are under attack enough already. We need to all stand together and promote the industry we love at every opprtunity.
 
Hi Mike,

You are right I don't know you...It would help if you wouldn't use a screen name and used your real name.

That aside, no my feelings weren't hurt. I didn't expect anything from the Guild Board of Directors other than what they did. Even being an "Honorary" Member didn't make a difference. I brought this up as an example of what some would call being "unprofessional".

Ok, you live in Louisville. On your web site you have a picture of the President of the Guild whose knives you have photographed and who has probably taught you how to make knives. Gil is a great guy. I first met him at dinner one night a at the 1986 Blade Show. So I would expect blind devotion on your part. No doubt if I were in your position I would be thinking along your way.

As for Bruce. Well lets just say what you have heard and what you would hear if you, Bruce, I and the Board of Directors (from that time) were in the same room...you would hear a complete different take from the Guild BoD.

You are correct, you weren't there...I was. Im speaking from first hand knowledge...not second, third, fourth hand information as you received.

Im glad you are happy with the Guild. As Blade and Barrel pointed out they need new blood to keep it going.

I like Louisville. When I was stationed at Ft. Campbell I got started in the knife business primarily doing NKCA shows. Two a year were in Louisville and I did a show in Lexington KY every year as well (met Kit Carson there in 87).

There is a good chance I will attend the show in Louisville.

So, who is going to the Guild Show this year? I believe that is what started this thread.
 
Original thread deleted.

Not entirely pleased, but there is always next year.

Best of wishes for 2008!

Coop
 
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