Laminated steel Q's and observations

Runs With Scissors

Runs With Scissors

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Dec 3, 2000
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I now own a whoppin' total of TWO knives with laminated steel blades. One is a Helle Fjellmann and the other is an Eriksson Mora S-2. They both display the same character trait....the blades bend very easily, and need to be manually restraightened. Both blades are easily bent by medium to heavy hand pressure. Has anyone else observed these idiosyncracies?

I don't know if it's a really a bad thing...I'd rather have a soft blade that bends than a brittle one that breaks when it comes down to it, but...it does make me uneasy all the same. Both knives hold an edge well enough, but neither one seems significantly better than plain old Sandvik 127 or plain old 1095.
 
Laminates often run very soft wrappers, these are really weak and take a set almost immediaely and once they start to bend keep bending with little increase in force, this is not the optimal way to make a knife. See threads on Sowrd Forums which discuss this in *great* detail, complete with stress strain curves and a full analysis of the difference between steels drawn to different hardness values.

-Cliff
 
I’ve done some fairly serious prying with my Fallkniven A2, and it held up without any problems. I guess it depends on blade design, thickness of the layers, and the steels used.
 
I was kinda wondering about that....I'm definitely turned off of Helle and Mora laminated blades. I didn't think Fallkniven would have those issues, considering how well spoken of they are around here.
 
Check out the Fallkniven website: there is a section on the testing they put their laminated blades through, and it makes reassuring reading.
 
Fallkniven uses AISI 420 as its side laminate which depending on who makes it can harden up to the low fifties, some of the japanese blades use laminates which are <20 hrc and which have no flexibility.

-Cliff
 
Since I have a Frosts & Eriksson Mora laminates I am curious as to what you were using them for when they bent? I use mine on camping trips & never had one bend even when cutting the tough stuff. They do have limitations such as not good for prying or heavy batoning. :confused:
 
Cliff, I recently got a pc of laminate with ZDP 189 in the center and ATS34 on the outside. I cut off a small piece and ground it down to the center on my surface grinder so I could check hardness on both the core and the wraps. I heat treated it and took hardness tests through the process. The inside ZDP finished at 66 and the ATS was 60. I made a blade out of the rest but do not have a handle on it yet so haven't cut with it yet. It's ground thin and does flex some. It's neat stuff and I especially like the line formed between the two steels at the edge. I will report more as I have more information. I am writing up this little experiment and hope to get the full report in Blade.. Phil
 
One of my ..infamous... posts was the experience of cutting a cereal box with my Fallkniven U-2. The blade went through it like it didn't exist, but the "wrap" scratched up like I had rubbed it on concrete. Still have it. I quit carrying it because I like a longer blade.

But I get more out of my Delica and Mcusta VG-10 without surface scratching as badly.

I would rather sharpen more frequently than have a blade all gouged up from cutting cake frosting or sumpin.

Depends on your preference.
:)
 
pogo said:
Since I have a Frosts & Eriksson Mora laminates I am curious as to what you were using them for when they bent? I use mine on camping trips & never had one bend even when cutting the tough stuff. They do have limitations such as not good for prying or heavy batoning. :confused:
Click to expand...


I bent it between my thumb and forefinger after the Helle laminated bent while cutting a partially frozen mutant chicken breast. It bent while my regular carbon Mora as well as an Opinel withstood approximately three times the pressure. Granted, Moras are slicers and not prybars, but I like to have a little more sturdiness in a blade. Still in love with them carbon steel ones though.


Phil Wilson...THAT sounds like a laminate I could fall in love with. Please, please, post pics when done. sounds awesome!

Lavan...yeah..that's something I noticed with time also, the Helle scratched like crazy. It looked like it had seen years of use, even though it was just rattling around the kitchen knife drawer for a month or so. some 1500 grit sandpaper, flitz, and a dremel polishing wheel bring it right back up to a high state of purtiness though. Over all though...no more Helles for me.
 
Thanks for the feedback! I have used mine in below 32 degrees but, never have used it on frozen meat. This would explain your different experience than mine. I am suprised the Helle bent as they are expensive & this usually equates with quality. Thanks for the info!:eek:
 
Phil Wilson said:
I am writing up this little experiment and hope to get the full report in Blade.
Click to expand...

That sounds like an interesting read. I don't see why they are using ATS-34 though compared to something like 420HC, unless they are recommending really high tempers for ZDP-189.

-Cliff
 
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