Laminated Zdp-189 vs Zdp-189

Allen R.

Allen R.

Joined
Nov 1, 2011
Messages
2,908
I really want to try this steel , I've tried other great steels s90v, m390, cts-204p, cpm-m4 etc... Well now I want to try a ZDP-189 knife, It will probably be a spyderco since you can actually try the steel without breaking the bank, So heres the question, is the laminate Zdp-189 say on the caly 3 or 3.5 have the same edge holding abilities and performance as say a full blown Zdp-189 endura delica or stretch?? Another question, On the Caly 3 and 3.5 models they have that fusion line, Is the only part of that knife that is Zdp-189 the steel below the fusion line ??? Thanks to all in advance.
 
That's not a fusion line. It's nothing like Kershaws composite blade. It's just laminated steel, it's a core of zdp with 420 stainless on the outside. It mainly depends on what size and shap blade you want. Yes the edge holding should be the same.
 
Most laminates are made like a sandwich. ZDP-189 is like the meat and the other steel is the bread. I don't have one of the laminate knives *YET* so I can't say for 100%. I am so impressed by the dragonfly2 in ZDP-189 that I'll be getting one of Spyderco's laminate blades. I'm not seeing what the HRC is supposed to be, But I've come to trust Spyderco so I'm in.
 
It's a toss up between a full blown zdp-189 stretch and a caly 3.5 420/zdp-189 I know how a stretch can cut , but have heard great things about the caly 3.5 so I dunno, If all factors are the same I'll probably get the caly 3.5....
 
Since ZDP-189 is typically treated to a crazy high RC (I believe it's 65 in Spyderco knives), there were some concerns about its durability, which is why the Caly 3/3.5 have laminated blades, to increase the durability of the blade so it doesn't snap in half. Apparently, that wasn't a real issue with ZDP-189 so the models produced since aren't laminated. For the most part, they should be the same. I'm personally saving up for the Caly 3 because I like the look of the laminated blade (and CF handle).
 
I have heard that the flats of the sandwich blade will scratch easier than the flats of a pure ZDP blade, but it should hold an edge just as well.
 
Fancier said:
I have heard that the flats of the sandwich blade will scratch easier than the flats of a pure ZDP blade, but it should hold an edge just as well.
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I heard that as well, but I'm not concerned about that, you should see some of the knives I have, I'm a no safe queens kind of guy....Also I too like the look of the carbon fiber and wire clip vs, FRN. don't get me wrong I have Frn knives and they are good , But IMO the Caly 3.5 or Caly 3 is just a better looking, possiibly better built knife, these are all opinions now , don't want to ruffle any feathers.:rolleyes: The Caly 3 , 3.5 and stretch are all 3mm thick stock, So i assume they are all going to perform the same. out of the box, I can't wait I believe I'm going to go with the 3.5 and take it down to a ridiculously low angle on the edge pro and see what shell do , I've got my s30v milli at 24 degrees inclusive polished to 3,000 grit:D When I get the 3.5 I believe 20 degrees inclusive is gonna be in it's future, same as my gayle bradley:cool:
 
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Fancier said:
I have heard that the flats of the sandwich blade will scratch easier than the flats of a pure ZDP blade, but it should hold an edge just as well.
Click to expand...

Most likely true, But that is okay. I use the crap out of my dragonfly but it still looks like a safe queen! (use, not abuse)
 
Fancier said:
I have heard that the flats of the sandwich blade will scratch easier than the flats of a pure ZDP blade, but it should hold an edge just as well.
Click to expand...
That's because the 420 steel is treated to be softer than the ZDP-189, which makes it easier to scratch. Basically, lamination works by having softer, more durable steel on the outside and the harder steel on the inside.

Allen R. said:
I heard that as well, but I'm not concerned about that, you should see some of the knives I have, I'm a no safe queens kind of guy....Also I too like the look of the carbon fiber and wire clip vs, FRN. don't get me wrong I have Frn knives and they are good , But IMO the Caly 3.5 or Caly 3 is just a better looking, possiibly better built knife, these are all opinions now , don't want to ruffle any feathers.:rolleyes:
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The Caly 3 is made in Spyderco's Taiwanese factories, which Spyderco makes many of their higher end knives in.
 
The laminated steel scratches easier than pure zdp 189 if that is a factor for you. On the other hand you do get the toughness and rust resistance. Either way it will not make much difference. In this case shop for good ergonomics not steel. I really love my caly 3. It is made in japan, not taiwan.
 
XiaolongJackson said:
That's because the 420 steel is treated to be softer than the ZDP-189, which makes it easier to scratch. Basically, lamination works by having softer, more durable steel on the outside and the harder steel on the inside.



The Caly 3 is made in Spyderco's Taiwanese factories, which Spyderco makes many of their higher end knives in.
Click to expand...

My gayle bradley is possibly the best spyderco I own I have 100% confidence in taichung? not sure about spelling knives, but I thought zdp-189 was a Japanese steel so would that not make the Caly 3.5 a Seki City knife? I'm on a few dealers website and they all say country of origin is japan for the caly, Doesn't matter Country of origin to me, I know spyderco =quality
 
Allen R. said:
My gayle bradley is possibly the best spyderco I own I have 100% confidence in taichung? not sure about spelling knives, but I thought zdp-189 was a Japanese steel so would that not make the Caly 3.5 a Seki City knife? I'm on a few dealers website and they all say country of origin is japan for the caly, Doesn't matter Country of origin to me, I know spyderco =quality
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The CPM-M4 in your GB is American, if you didn't know, but, yes, most of Spyderco's ZDP-189 knives are manufactured in Japan, but the Caly 3/3.5 are made in Taiwan.
 
XiaolongJackson said:
The CPM-M4 in your GB is American, if you didn't know, but, yes, most of Spyderco's ZDP-189 knives are manufactured in Japan, but the Caly 3/3.5 are made in Taiwan.
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I knew tha cpm-m4 was american, Didn't know where the caly 3.5 was made...
 
XiaolongJackson said:
Since ZDP-189 is typically treated to a crazy high RC (I believe it's 65 in Spyderco knives), there were some concerns about its durability, which is why the Caly 3/3.5 have laminated blades, to increase the durability of the blade so it doesn't snap in half. Apparently, that wasn't a real issue with ZDP-189 so the models produced since aren't laminated. For the most part, they should be the same. I'm personally saving up for the Caly 3 because I like the look of the laminated blade (and CF handle).
Click to expand...

False. The maker that does the Calypso series did not have the equipment needed to cut blade blanks from solid ZDP-189, so they used a laminate at first and decided to stick with it. The Delica, Endura and Stretch are made by a different maker with different cutting system, so they elected to go with solid ZDP.

Fancier said:
I have heard that the flats of the sandwich blade will scratch easier than the flats of a pure ZDP blade, but it should hold an edge just as well.
Click to expand...

The flat of the laminated blades are 420J2, which is much more corrosion resistant but scratches much easier.

sideways said:
The laminated steel scratches easier than pure zdp 189 if that is a factor for you. On the other hand you do get the toughness and rust resistance. Either way it will not make much difference. In this case shop for good ergonomics not steel. I really love my caly 3. It is made in japan, not taiwan.
Click to expand...

Correct.
 
Allen R. said:
I heard that as well, but I'm not concerned about that, you should see some of the knives I have, I'm a no safe queens kind of guy....Also I too like the look of the carbon fiber and wire clip vs, FRN. don't get me wrong I have Frn knives and they are good , But IMO the Caly 3.5 or Caly 3 is just a better looking, possiibly better built knife, these are all opinions now , don't want to ruffle any feathers.:rolleyes: The Caly 3 , 3.5 and stretch are all 3mm thick stock, So i assume they are all going to perform the same. out of the box, I can't wait I believe I'm going to go with the 3.5 and take it down to a ridiculously low angle on the edge pro and see what shell do , I've got my s30v milli at 24 degrees inclusive polished to 3,000 grit:D When I get the 3.5 I believe 20 degrees inclusive is gonna be in it's future, same as my gayle bradley:cool:
Click to expand...

There's more to it than just blade thickness at the spine. The Caly 3/3.5 series has a better (i.e. thinner) flat grind than the Stretch. In other words, although both are full flat ground, the Caly 3/3.5 are ground thinner behind the edge than the Stretch.

On the other hand, you could always thin out the bevels on a Stretch if you wanted a better slicer.
 
Cynic2701 said:
There's more to it than just blade thickness at the spine. The Caly 3/3.5 series has a better (i.e. thinner) flat grind than the Stretch. In other words, although both are full flat ground, the Caly 3/3.5 are ground thinner behind the edge than the Stretch.

On the other hand, you could always thin out the bevels on a Stretch if you wanted a better slicer.
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I'm sold on the caly 3.5 and knowing it's thinner behind the edge is even better, Now when i get it and put "my edge" on it , It's gonna be one of the greatest things of all time lol
 
XiaolongJackson said:
Huh. I guess it really is made in Japan. Probably got my info mixed up with some other knife.
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Hey at least we all had a civil discussion with no insults and bashing of other members. That is what it's all about informative discussions , which are getting rarer and rarer on the forums, not just this one BTW...
 
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