Limitations of a 2" Blade (from a survival prospective)

B

Brian6244

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Aug 25, 2004
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Okay first of all lets assume that for the purposes of this conversation we are talking about fixed blade knives . The pros and cons of folder vs fixed blade have been discussed enough as it is already IMHO so lets keep it simple and assume all knives in question (for the purposes of this thread) are fixed blade. Besides, the reason I'm asking is because I recently purchased and am waiting on shipment of a full tang 2" fixed blade right now.

Just a little background info. This August I will be taking on a new job where I can have absolutely no knife on my person that is longer than 2" in the blade. Actually this is pushing it as it is. It would be best if I have no knife at all but I'm not about to concede to that degree. However an extremely well concealed 2" knife is the absolute most I can carry. Since I prefer strong knives I ruled out small 2" folders immediately (I love my BM310 but it's still not all that durable IMHO). Not to mention that a recent post by a forumite over at ETS got me interested in finding a knife and fire starter that I can truely carry 24/7... even in the shower.

Okay so there's the background info, now here's the question.

Aside from chopping and/or battoning wood what do you feel are the limitations of a 2" fixed blade when compared to a 4" fixed blade of relatively the same thickness and general durability? Other than chopping and battoning (because those are obvious) does the 4" blade have any advantages over the 2" blade strictly due to its length?

I proposed this question over at ETS too so hopefully between you guys and the folks over there I can get some good opinions.

- Brian

"The more you know, the less you need." Cody Lundin
 
Gotta think a bit about this one... out of curiosity can I ask what job would enforce that policy ?
 
If it's a well built knife, it should still be able to handle batoning and things like that. The length doesn't mean it has to be flimsy. Ever see the Street Scalpel from TOPS? It's 1/4" thich, with a 2" blade, they're only about $50 bucks too. Or the Mikro. There are durable options out there.
 
It's hard to imagine a work-related survival scenario in which you couldn't just leave to go to your car where you have a more capable knife. Will you have no way to get to better gear? Mac
 
What you lose with the smaller knife is leverage and efficiency. What would you rather carve wood or clean game and fish with? Personally I like very small fixed blades. When I don’t carry a 4” fixed blade, I compensate. For example, I can make fire by friction and with the larger knife is it not difficult to make a fire board and spindle. When I don’t have that knife I make sure I have flint and steel.

Therefore, my suggestion is to balance your overall survival kit around your skill level. Take the flint and steel, maybe a survival saw for example. You know you better than anyone. Make yourself comfortable.

Also, being able to make an edge from stone would be a tremendous asset and give you "freedom." Making discoidal stone knives is easy. You can easily chop, carve, skin and do a whole slough of tasks with one, and the efficiency of doing larger tasks would be greater than a >2” blade. Not to mention it saves your steel blade from abuse. Your signature says it, "The moe you know, the less you need."

Best of luck
 
Whether a small 2" blade could perform as well as a 4+" blade depends on the robustness of the smaller knife. It would certainly take more time to do heavier chores and would require different techniques to get the job done, but practice and experience would make up for whatever blade length it's lacking.

For instance, I had the opportunity to handle and use BRKTs Micro Canadian, which is 5" overall with a 1.75" blade and after doing some carving, whittling and bataning with the little knife, I found that it's the real deal. Yeah, I'd prefer a larger blade like it's bigger brother the NorthStar, but for a small and liteweight conceal blade, the little Micro Canadian can get the work done.
 
pict said:
It's hard to imagine a work-related survival scenario in which you couldn't just leave to go to your car where you have a more capable knife. Will you have no way to get to better gear? Mac
Click to expand...
Unfortunately there would be no reasonable way to get to my car or otherwise to more effective gear.
 
Quiet Bear said:
What you lose with the smaller knife is leverage and efficiency. What would you rather carve wood or clean game and fish with? Personally I like very small fixed blades. When I don’t carry a 4” fixed blade, I compensate. For example, I can make fire by friction and with the larger knife is it not difficult to make a fire board and spindle. When I don’t have that knife I make sure I have flint and steel.

Therefore, my suggestion is to balance your overall survival kit around your skill level. Take the flint and steel, maybe a survival saw for example. You know you better than anyone. Make yourself comfortable.

Also, being able to make an edge from stone would be a tremendous asset and give you "freedom." Making discoidal stone knives is easy. You can easily chop, carve, skin and do a whole slough of tasks with one, and the efficiency of doing larger tasks would be greater than a >2” blade. Not to mention it saves your steel blade from abuse. Your signature says it, "The moe you know, the less you need."

Best of luck
Click to expand...
Constructing ston blades is something I have worked on for a while and have yet to master but I couldnt agree more about the freedom and usefullness of mastering that skill.
 
pict said:
It's hard to imagine a work-related survival scenario in which you couldn't just leave to go to your car where you have a more capable knife. Will you have no way to get to better gear? Mac
Click to expand...

A lot of people where I work ride either the bus or train. The train stop is only 5 minutes away. almost every thing you would need has to be brough with you and taken away each night I have a locking file cabinet but no one knows where the key is and the company will not pay to have a new key made or the lock replaced they just fix it so it can not be locked by accident. So anything I leave at work can and from time to time has disappered. Parking in large cities can be a pain I have had to walk as far as a mile from my job before so depending on the reason ( we had a toronado go thru town once an it was 3 days before I was able to recover my car with the back window busted out and 2 inches of water in it). It is not only possable but has happened maney time where for one reason or another you can not make it to your car.

jim
 
If the knife is well made and of good materials a 2 inch knife should do just fine. My edc is a sak and its only a little longer than that and I've used it for just about everything, camping, fishing, small game. My sak soldier is my everything knife because I've been in the same boat as you, traveling to a job on public transport, and everything I think I need in the course of the day has to be on my person.

The only thing I carry a fixed blade for on woods trips is food service. The little pocket knife does everything exept slice the bread and sausage and cheese my wife and I take along.
 
If you're simply talknig about woods survival and not urban, the main reasons for having a 4" blade is that you CAN use it with a baton to cut through wood substancial enough to build a shelter or make a decent fire. Other than that a smaller blade is sometimes preferable as it can be used with more precision. I can't think of one reason, other that batoning and defense, for a skilled person to need a blade longer than 2" unless in thick undergrowth. I have a 2.3" blade that can do almost everything I need other than these things. Is it harder to, for example, make feather sticks to start a fire? Yes it is, but far from impossible.

Matt
 
If you are concealing a 2 inch blade then what difference does it make if its 4 inches?

I am only allowed a 2 inch blade but I conceal my 3.6 inch folder every day. Unless they have a warrant to search me they will never know.

Hell, I have carried a 9mm auto when in less than ideal areas and there is no concealed carry permits here. The law is only the law once its discovered that you have broken it, until then its one persons opinion on the way things aught to be. ;)

Skam
 
I suspect Brian is getting a job in someplace with high security. I've worked for such places, and if the place is gov't or associated with a gov't agency then you have to pass through security entering the building. If security says you can't carry over 2 inches of blade, it's not open to debate. You can't leave it in the car because the car is home. You commuted on the metro, subway, whatever.
 
When Brian said "an extremly well concealed knife" I assumed he would not be checked entering his place of employment.

There are covert options to this as well. ;)

Skam
 
I worked in an environment with disadvantaged youth that had a similar policy. I carried a Small Sebenza daily. It was .75" over but never got a second look because of how I used and carried it.

If I couldn't have carried it I would have gone to my Umfaan. At 2.25 inches it is the smallest blade I have that I could carry with confidence.

How about an Emerson LaGriffe? It has a 1.75" blade but is still a hefty knife. The only problem is the "tactical" look and the obvious offensive nature. Maybe the white water version would work.

How about some of the smaller knives from Spyderco? Dragonfly, Cricket, Co Pilot?

There are plenty of options out there. A 2" blade requires you to compromise but that is absolutely doable!
 
G. Sakai Archistrial Fixed Blade. Micarta handles. Leather sheath (I would probably go with a kydex for EDC) and best of all an ergonomically awesome full sized handle. ATS 34 steel and built like a tank. I bought one of these and put it away. Now it appears that they aren't available. It was a bear to find a link but I found one.

http://www.libertydesignsinc.com/j-industrial.html
 
jackknife said:
I suspect Brian is getting a job in someplace with high security. I've worked for such places, and if the place is gov't or associated with a gov't agency then you have to pass through security entering the building. If security says you can't carry over 2 inches of blade, it's not open to debate. You can't leave it in the car because the car is home. You commuted on the metro, subway, whatever.
Click to expand...
Bingo! You hit the nail on the head.
 
At the last gunshow here I met Barry Dawson and bought one of his 2 1/2" fixed blade knives. It has a strong point and a good belly and came in a sheath designed for pocket carry. It has approximately the same dimensions as Benchmade's 210P Snody Activator but with a slightly longer edge. It seems to me that the BM Activator would work well in your situation. The 2.1" blade is pretty close.
 
Unfortunately, most company policies see knives as "illegal weapons," and refusing to allow a search of your person and belongings would be used as cause for termination if they have "reasonable suspicion". :mad: That said, I can see scenarios where I might not be able to get to my kit in my minivan at work (tanker trucks drive by on the freeway all the time; a semi threw a whole wheel, taking out a car a couple of weeks back; there's a couple of small airports nearby, a pilot came in for landing and crashed into a powerline a year ago; even a whackjob driving his car into the store to find his girlfriend and holding folks hostage, as happened at a Target about a month ago).

Pretty much my kit is geared toward city E&E to get my ass home, which is thankfully only 5 miles away, but thru some rough neighborhoods. Even tho my kit's pretty small (a large eyeglass case), it's bulky enough that I don't carry it on my person all the time (it's in my daypack), but I do have a SAK Tinker (w/ LED on ring) in a pocket and a CS Urban Pal on a keyring. There are other Cold Steel fixed knives around 2" or less, but they seem to all have the serrations.

Matt in Texas
 
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