m-42 good or bad

M

magnum .44

Joined
Jun 12, 1999
Messages
1,110
i plan on buying some m-42, but the stuff is very expensivem the reason i posted this is becuase i want to see if any of you have had good or bad experiences with it. i don't mean one of your drill bits snapped that was made from it. becuase in knifemaking the rockwell is lower than in drill bits.
 
I just tested one of my M-10 Tantos (Composition is almost identical to M-42)with what I consider pretty good reults. I heat treated it to Rc62, cryo treated, triple draw. I am going to try to include a picture but not sure if I can or not. If it doesnt show up I'll email you a couple pics.

Anyway Blade is 5" long and 1/4" thick at the spine. Very thin edge geometry. I chopped in half a 1"x2" piece of Lacewood and it still shaved hair and sliced paper cleanly, drove the point through a quarter and didn't even leave a mark. It wil still pick splinters easily. Then I drove the point into my workbench 1/2" and jerked it out sideways with no bend, crack or hesitation at all. It just ripped a chunk of wood out. High speed steel like this will not do an ABS 90 degree bend without breaking, but with this kind of strength I don't think it really has to.

All in all I would say the M-42 would make you an excellent knife if you get it heat treated right.

Good Luck...GaryB
<img src=http://members.aol.com/finder4541/tantest2.jpg>



[This message has been edited by GARY B (edited 13 November 1999).]
 
wow, i am impressed, i'm gonna make alot of knives from it. who heat treated it for you? i can't wait to get the stuff in.
 
I do my own heat treating and that's probably the biggest drawback to high speed steel. Temp. control is critical and it is higher temp than most knife steels.

I pre-heat at 1500 F until equalized, then ramp up the heat to 2150 F and soak for 25 minutes. Then temper at 950 F for two hours, freeze for 18 hours +/-, then temper twice more at 1025 F. I'm still using dry ice and alcohol for a -110 F freeze. Liquid nitro is both expensive and dangerous and I am not convinced yet that the added benefit of -300 is worth the added problems.

Good luck and take care,

GaryB
 
what would it cost me if i was gonna send my blade up there, after i finish it. if you're interested that is, but your the only one i know of that hea treats cobalt steels, and is heat treating for m-42 the same as m-10?
 
Gary B, what do you keep your dry ice and alcohol mixture in? Do you just mix enough for one knife at a time, or have a big batch of it made up? Thanks! Michael

------------------
"Always think of your fellow knife makers as partners in the search for the perfect blade, not as people trying to compete with you and your work!"
 
L6STEEL,

I try to have at least 5 or 6 blades ready to freeze at one time and put approx a 8 or 9 lb. block of dry ice in a styrofoam cooler with about a gallon of de-natured alcohol. Leave the ice in a solid block and put in at one end of the cooler, submerge blades in the alcohol on floor of cooler.(if you have a bunch of blades you can stack them but keep all the steel submerged in alcohol. They should stay in this mix a minimum of 12 hrs. and preferably 18 to 24 hours. Then remove blades to rack on your workbench and allow to warm slowly in air. Dry off the alcohol first to prevent rust from forming while they warm.

A few words of warning to all who want to try this!!! Do not use a plastic cooler. It will freeze and split. Don't use a metal container as it will not hold the cold and dry ice will evaporate too fast. Do everything wearing leather gloves and safety glasses!!! If you get -110 F liquid or dry ice on you or in your eyes you can be blinded or severely injured. also, do not seal the cooler lid. Either drill a 1/8" hole in the lid or leave it sitting cocked on the cooler. As dry ice evaporates it expands at an incredible rate. Sealing it in could have explosive effects.

As far as how much to make up at one time is concerned, Just make as much as you need for the number of blades you have to treat. The idea is to have enough dry ice so that it does not evaporate in less than 18 hours. The alcohol is simply a transfer medium for the cold. It is not advisable to place your blades directly on the dry ice.

Sorry about the long winded post. Hope this helps, and please take care,

GaryB
 
VERY NICE grind on the knife pictured above. I have also started using the dry ice treatment on my blades. I am still figuring out all of the properties of dry ice. I have found that alcohol will freeze into a slurry. I added some acetone to lower the freezing point.

Also, will placing the dry ice container in a freezer slow down the evaporation of the dry ice?
 
Brian;
The heat treat is not exactly the same but very close. When looking through my heat treat book I missed the fact that M42 has 8% cobalt in the alloy. If tempered at 950 F resulting Rc would be 68. A tad too hard for a knife. In order to get it down into the Rc62 range it needs to temper at 1200 F. It should make an incredible cutter. My M10 is actually closer to M4. Has 10% Moly., 2% vanadium, and no Tungsten. My understanding of the history on M10 is that it was formulated during a time when the political scene made getting Tungsten impossible, so they doubled the Molybdenum content and did without the Tungsten. I don't believe it is commercially available anymore. But I have a friend who bought out a distributor and is selling me his M10 at a much more reasonable price than M2 or M42 sells for now.

Tejas7...I've never had a freezer big enough to try what you mentioned but it should slow evaporation time substantially. I would still be somewhat concerned about sealing in the gas from evaporating dry ice though.

Take Care....GaryB

p.s. THANKS for the compliment on the grinds on my tanto. I liked the blade on that one but not the handle design(which I didn't show)That's why I decided to go ahead and rough it up some to see how it would hold up.

[This message has been edited by GARY B (edited 15 November 1999).]
 
Thanks big time Gary for the information on the dry ice set up. I probably would have sealed it up and gotten into deep trouble with it.
On your tanto, is that a flat grind on one side or are both sides ground?? Beautiful blade!! Take care! Michael

------------------
"Always think of your fellow knife makers as partners in the search for the perfect blade, not as people trying to compete with you and your work!"
 
yeah rc 68 is a bit much, but i was thinking somewhere in the 59-60 range, is this possible for you to do? the cobalt and tungsten are good to have in a blade. is your m-10 tough to grind?
 
Brian,
Yes M10 is real bear to grind. You need at least the Blue Zirconia belts for the 40 grit work. 3M Regalloy would be better.They are kinda pricey but last long enough to be worth it.

I can temper it back to 59-60, but you will probably lose some edge holding with it. Might be wise to do one or two that way to check out the edge holding and toughness. The M10 holds up well at Rc62, but I don't know what effect the cobalt will have on the toughness.
GaryB
 
i should probably stay with rc60, it's a 10" knife 6" blade, what do you suggest. i use only ceramic belts. alox wear out to fast.
 
Magnum, whats the difference in this M-42 and BG-42??? Take care! Michael

------------------
"Always think of your fellow knife makers as partners in the search for the perfect blade, not as people trying to compete with you and your work!"
 
m-42 is a high speed steel with cobalt in it.
the composition is
carbon 1.15
chromium 3.5
cobalt 8.75
iron balance
manganese .4
molybdenum 10
phosphorus .03
silicon .65
sulphur .03
tungsten 1.85
vanadium 1.35
bg42 is a stainless with
carbon 1.15
chromium 14.5
manganese .5
molybdenum 4
silicon .3
vanadium 1.2
 
AND???????????????????????? Is it worht a squat??????????

------------------
"Always think of your fellow knife makers as partners in the search for the perfect blade, not as people trying to compete with you and your work!"
 
what are you looking for l6, an explanation of it? tom it's no more brittle than 440v or 420v, and will hold an edge forever. i'm gonna use it on small knives. i'm currently getting m-2 for blades up to 12", stuff takes and holds a better edge than d-2 little more brittle though. gary b, can you heat treat m-2 too?
 
Yup!

However I don't think we should get into a Pi***ng match over our favorite steels. We all look at things through different eyes and have different expectations of a blade when we build a knife. That's why there is room for so many makers and so many hi-grade steels. If we all thought and felt the same it would be a boring world indeed. And really, your opening question asked for Toms opinion too.

My .02 worth
GaryB

[This message has been edited by GARY B (edited 16 November 1999).]
 
yeah, i didn't mean it as being nasty, sorry if it sounded that way, i was just saying that m-42 is no more brittle than 440v, but we use that in knifemaking too. also i'm just trying out new steels, no harm in that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top