M2 over ATS-34, how come?

A

anewguy

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May 8, 2003
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In response to a recent post, I have been looking at the BM 710. I noticed that there is an option to have M-2 steel instead of ATS-34. After reading the “blade steel” FAQ, I am still a bit confused as to why one would opt for M-2 over ATS-34, let alone pay 20 more bucks for it. Maybe you guys could help me out (once again:D ). thanks
 
It has higher toughness and wear resistance (that's the big one) than 154cm, and with the coating, rust isn't really a concern. Higher wear resistance translates into better edge retention.
 
It takes an edge like nothing I been able to duplicate, including CPMS30V. My 710HSS is the sharpest knife I own & it was easy to do. Just lightly used the sharpmaker ultrafine hones to get a crisp edge, then stropped it. It now easily shaves hair without touching the skin. If it holds that edge like I've read about around here, it's number 1 in my book. Definatly worth the xtra $.
 
M2 is high speed steel (HSS), though both M2 and D2 are tool steels.

M2 holds an edge better than ATS-34 or 154CM as done by Benchmade and is less likely to chip out than ATS-34 or 154CM when the going gets tough (it still can, but it's less likely). I compared my Benchmade 730 in 154CM to a 730CFHS in M2 by hacking wildly into a box of cardboard boxes practicing a 9-angle arnis drill (picture cutting a pizza into 8 slices and poking out the center). The 730CFHS's M2 blade stayed hair-popping sharp, but the other one with 154CM (which is like ATS-34 on paper, at least) dulled quiet a bit. Of course, that's just one example using a single knife of each steel, so there may be others in 154CM that held an edge better and others in M2 that dulled faster. Another user who had snapped the tip off of his 154CM Benchmade 730 from digging in the dirt repeated the same feat with his M2 703CFHS and the tip didn't break, but it can be argued that dirt is too random and maybe he was more careful because this was back when the Benchmade 730 sold for $170 and wasn't available online for less than $85.

Now is the 710HS $20 more edge-retentive or $20 tougher than 154CM? Probably not. It's just more fun to have M2 in your life.
 
HS = M2
HSS(R?) = M2 w/ serrations
D2 = D2

I don't know why HS in the model number is M2, while D2 is simply D2. Perhaps they didn't plan on using other high-speed steels at the time.
 
Benchmade lists their M2 at 60-62 HRC vs. 58-60 for their 154CM, so the M2 should be more resistant to edge roll. M2 is also more wear resistant than 154CM, so you should see better edge holding. 154CM is of course much more corrosion resistant than M2. Toughness (impact resistance) should be roughly the same at the nominal hardness levels.

The choice essentially boils down to rust resistance or edge retention.





- Frank
 
What amazes me is that Benchmade Strykers with M2 are relitavely cheap in price, and, IMO, better quality knives than 95% of the stuff higher priced than them.

Sidebar question: If one was to place order of which steels dull how fast, from slowest to fastest, how would one rank M2 with S30V, 154CM, D2 and BG 42?

I'm guessing M2 is first, dulling the slowest, then D2, then....BG 42? Not sure after the first two, never owned a knife with the other 3 steels (oddly enough) for long enough to judge the other 3.
 
The usual ways that a knife blade dull include:

- Plastic deformation (edge roll and compaction are examples of this) which is best predicted by the hardness number.

- Wear.

- Impact damage.

- Corrosion.


If we leave out impact and corrosion, edge holding is basically going to depend on the combination of hardness and wear resistance. The material being cut plays a big role in what balance of hardness and wear resistance is best (blade/ edge geometry, the method of sharpening and how the knife is used will also play a role).

In general, I would expect the steels edge holding order to be something like this:

M2, S30V, D2, BG42, and 154CM. The first 4 should be very close; the order could easily change based on the materials being cut, exact heat treatment and hardness.






- Frank
 
FWIW, I found that the Paul Bos treated S30V in buck mayo did not noticeably perform better than the VG10 in my spyderco. both were given 30 degree included edge bevels for comparison.
 
I placed a BM 710 on lay away before you guys started posting all of this. I liked my previous BM in ATS34 a lot, so I just figured to upgrade the handle and locking mechanisms. When I got my last benchmade, (I have had it for a year and a half), I got a serious case of buyers regret. I remember how I would have been better off with a Spyderco, them being more ambidextrous and I being left handed. I worried about the plastic handle, it was almost too flexible for comfort. So one night I decided to sit down, beat the crap out of it, and get my $60 bucks worth of fun.

I smacked it spine first on tables, cut up cardboard into strips, rope into tiny pieces, stuck the blade 1/2 way in the door jam when the door was closed and flexed the knife... and it survived. The plastic handels absorb shock and returned true, the flexing done with a prying motion is also in the handel... so you know when you are going too far. And even with smacking the spine, I think that the plastic absorbs alot of the abuse so that the locking mechanism dosent have to take it... (You know what... I need some pics of this knife..)

It has gone everywhere and done everything. Like any knife, although you should still treat it like a knife. (None of this digging in dirt stuff, get a friggen shovel.):p
(BTW, I dont know the model # of my last BM, the design has been discontinued although they replaced it with a simalar one, bottom line it is still holding strong and shaves.) I eventually reground the edge to a thinner profile, these big wide grinds on these plastic tactical knives dont do what I want.

I still like their ATS34. I just wish I read about this M2 stuff earlier, I would have payed the exta $20 just to see what the deal was. (Although I think they only had it in a 1/2 serrated version.)

Anyways, I got my 710 Saturday, and it is so friggn cool. I am not going to put this one through a torture test though. (This one sat on lay-away for 3 months, I cant afford another.) We will see how it holds up over the next couple of years.
:) :)
 
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