M43??? [pics]

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Carried over from the id & handle-repair questions thread (which is a rather opaque name for my particular question) -
does this one qualify as a M43? JP said it looked like a late war khuk made in (Dehra Doon?) India-

what exactly makes a khukuri an M43?

...more pics back on the id & handle-repair questions thread.

cheers all, B.

Bill Martino · Dec 23, 2001

As usual, I think John is right but it doesn't look like an issue M43.

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by Bill Martino
As usual, I think John is right but it doesn't look like an issue M43.

What sorts of properties distinguish a WWII khukuri as an M43? This one looks about the same shape (to my amatuer-eyes) as the M43s on the FAQ page page and since John Powell said it was made during the late part of WWII I was thinking...

thanks for the info, B.

Walosi · Dec 23, 2001

From another beginner's aspect: The military models that were accepted by the Gorkhas (some weren't, and got "lost") quickly became popular with the public. The British Army Service is often seen among the villagers Gelbu and Pala bring in, and is still popular with the village kamis. The WWII is another issue model. The M43 is a re-design (more forward-curving) of an issue blade, and I assume, in 1943. I'm just barely able to identify them without going back and forth to the FAQ, but I have the WWII, a villager BAS, and am waiting for the M43. I finally decided that "hands on" was the best way to arrive at a conclusion.

John Powell · Dec 23, 2001

The M43 is very obvious because it has absolutely no shoulder. It has a sweeping, uninterupted curve and a distinctive grip shape plus the bolster is usually integrated. If I could have saved my pix from that #@*&^%%$@!!*"+! PhotoPoint you would be seeing examples of both.

How does one post photos here w/o PP?

There is nothing that would make this piece unique to Dehra Dun except the obvious: it's stamped on the blade.

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by John Powell
The M43 is very obvious because it has absolutely no shoulder. It has a sweeping, uninterupted curve and a distinctive grip shape plus the bolster is usually integrated. If I could have saved my pix from that #@*&^%%$@!!*"+! PhotoPoint you would be seeing examples of both.

How does one post photos here w/o PP?

There is nothing that would make this piece unique to Dehra Dun except the obvious: it's stamped on the blade.

Thanks John. As to posting without PhotoPoint (unless you're a premium member), you have to have the file online somewhere. But a lot of your khukuris are on Howards FAQ page so one can link to there, like so:

are these the M43s you're looking for?

[the 'code' I used is "http://www.tx3.net/~howardw/Khukuris/Powell/M43s.jpg" (without the quotes) in IMG brackets]

and here's five officer's khukuris:

I don't know if this is the comparison you wanted to make or not though....

Nothing is stamped on the blade - but you said it looked like an Indian-manufactured khuk from the end of the war...for some reason I was thinking that Dehra Doon was where such khukuris were made.

many thanks again for the info (this particular khukuri, as I said before, has a great feel to it

in any case)

cheers, B.

John Powell · Dec 23, 2001

My mistake. I thought this was the knife stamped Dehra Dun.

I can see where your confusion came in since the ivory handled M43 was included with the 'officer's kukris' pix. And yes, those are exactly the pictures I was hoping to use. Thanks.

Now I have to find a quick and easy way to post new pix for everyone right here on Uncle Bill's hotsy-totsy ultimate kukri cantina...

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by John Powell
I thought this was the knife stamped Dehra Dun.

So would you still appraise it as being of Indian manufacture, near the end of WWII? Or....?

Thanks, B.

Mike L. · Dec 23, 2001

Beo, yours looks a lot more like a "K-45" than it does an M43.

--Mike L.

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by Mike L.
Beo, yours looks a lot more like a "K-45" than it does an M43.

--Mike L.

Thanks Mike - but what is a 'K-45'? Not familiar with that term - can you direct me? cheers, B.

Yvsa · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by beoram

So would you still appraise it as being of Indian manufacture, near the end of WWII? Or....?

Thanks, B.

Ben I'm just trying to help and I could be mistaken, but I think you and John may be having a comm problem although it may only be my comm problem.

John wrote:
"I can see where your confusion came in since the ivory handled M43 was included with the 'officer's kukris' pix."

I think that may be one of the key phrases. Look at the pic with all the M-43's and note how they are all rounded or fully curved and without the shoulder your knife definitely has.....
The pic of the officers khuks all have a shoulder Except for the ivory handled one.
That is a favorite khukuri of several of us.

I don't believe your knife is an M-43 either, but I wouldn't know how to designate it either.

Bill Martino · Dec 23, 2001

John, you might try Ofoto. That's what I'm using now that that Photopoint has dropped out of sight again. Great customer concern on Photopoint's part.

beoram · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by Yvsa

Ben I'm just trying to help and I could be mistaken, but I think you and John may be having a comm problem although it may only be my comm problem.

John wrote:
"I can see where your confusion came in since the ivory handled M43 was included with the 'officer's kukris' pix."

I know I'm a bit confused

. Not about M43s - I've got that now, I definitely see (at least some of) the defining characteristics of the M43 - at least the lack of a shoulder.

My confusion now is that originally John had said:

Originally posted by John Powell
Ivory would make more sense on this than bone. Looks like it was made in India just as the war was closing and this probably wouldn't have had a c&k. Check it all out when it arrives and let us know.
YVSA?

but then he said

Originally posted by John Powell
My mistake. I thought this was the knife stamped Dehra Dun.

-------------
My main question is whether his assessment is still that it was made in India as the war was closing or not? I've been hoping to lay my hands on a nice well-made Indian-crafted khuk....

And, out of curiosity, were khukuris manufactured all over India during WWII or just in certain places (like Dehra Dun)?

Originally posted by Yvsa

I don't believe your knife is an M-43 either, but I wouldn't know how to designate it either.

Mike suggested K45 - but I'm unfamiliar with that type - can anyone direct me?

cheers again all, B.

Yvsa · Dec 23, 2001

Originally posted by beoram

Mike suggested K45 - but I'm unfamiliar with that type - can anyone direct me?

cheers again all, B.

Hang in Ben. With the attention brought to a possible comm problem it will get sorted out now.
I think the K-45 may be more of a general run of issue knifes, but I dunno about I dunno, so I dunno.

There's been very few times when something couldn't be identified here.

"Check it all out when it arrives and let us know.
YVSA?"
When John wrote the above he was most graciously commenting on my ability as a craftsman.

When I 1st came on the forum I was in pretty fair shape, but as time has passed my health has went way downhill so I don't take in any extra outside work in anymore. It took me a really long time to get the Bowie model finished I promised a long time ago........
Doesn't stop me from trying to help match someone up with some material though.
I have always been a proponent that great care and patience would do a great deal in overcoming lack of skill or knowledge.
And with that almost anyone can do almost anything. One just has to be careful is all.

beoram · Dec 24, 2001

Originally posted by Yvsa

Hang in Ben. With the attention brought to a possible comm problem it will get sorted out now.
I think the K-45 may be more of a general run of issue knifes, but I dunno about I dunno, so I dunno.
There's been very few times when something couldn't be identified here.

I've noticed that

Originally posted by Yvsa

"Check it all out when it arrives and let us know.
YVSA?"
When John wrote the above he was most graciously commenting on my ability as a craftsman.

I was actually referring more to the 'Looks like it was made in India just as the war was closing' bit of the quote - I didn't know if John thought that this was one that was stamped 'Dehra Doon' when he wrote that, or if he made that assessment based purely on the shape of the blade, handle, scabbard, &c.

Originally posted by Yvsa
When John wrote the above he was most graciously commenting on my ability as a craftsman.[/B]

I certainly believe it from the photos of the YCS!

Originally posted by Yvsa
Doesn't stop me from trying to help match someone up with some material though.
I have always been a proponent that great care and patience would do a great deal in overcoming lack of skill or knowledge.
And with that almost anyone can do almost anything. One just has to be careful is all. [/B]

I'm quite enthused to attempt to replace the ivory/bone bit myself--because it's sort of, well, not quite adding myself into the history of the khukuri, but something a bit like that.

But, of course, I do rely on and am very grateful for the generous expert advice I receive on this forum

.

cheers again, Ben.

Mike L. · Dec 24, 2001

Beo, I think there is a picture of a K-45 somewhere in the Khukuri FAQ. It's late here, been another "interesting" day, and I am just too fatigued to look for it.

--Mike L.

beoram · Dec 24, 2001

Originally posted by Mike L.
Beo, I think there is a picture of a K-45 somewhere in the Khukuri FAQ. It's late here, been another "interesting" day, and I am just too fatigued to look for it.

--Mike L.

Thanks Mike. Hope it hasn't been too 'interesting' of a day for you

. And that everything is going as well as one could hope....

I looked for the pic of the K-45, and indeed there is a place where it should be, but it's gone--presumably since the Photopoint albums have ceased to function....

best wishes, Ben.

Mike L. · Dec 24, 2001

May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the beards and pubic regions of those responsible for PhotoPoint!

--Mike L.

Bill Martino · Dec 24, 2001

I'll drink to that.

John Powell · Dec 24, 2001

Thanks Mike, that's a nice way of saying what I was thinking for those swell folks at PhotoPoint. Wonder if they're related to the kindly execs from Enron?

Ben, the kukri that we're all miscommunicating about is indeed a well made piece from India and probably produced in 1945-48. It well could have been made in Dehra Dun or one of a dozen other depots. The ivory on the grip is well worth restoring and if YVSA was taking outside projects he would be the man I would go to. The scabbard is also worth restoration with the correct buckles and straps. As for use it probably didn't see any 'action' since these knives were made for the officers in Indian Gurkha regiments as symbols of pride. It was probably used by someone years later to whack away at a piece of wood or some such mundane thing.

I hope that gives you some of the info you're seeking. As to the K45 I will try to get the kindly old gent who runs this forum to post a picture so you can see what one looks like. They are not in the same style as this kukri, but are fairly crude and real working knives.