Maintaining or improving factory sharpness

[LutzSpearo]

Hi everyone. I'm new to pocket knives pretty much. I'm just a regular guy with one old Camillus pen knife I bought about 20 years ago, and just use it for day to day stuff like opening a package or removing an irish pennant. I do however have a few more knives in the mail, mostly small Case XX knives.

Years ago I tried my hand at sharpening my little pocket knife with a stone I got at a hardware store. I got it decently sharp, sharp enough for what I need, but I can see the bevel is not a consistent angle, and the angle tends to flatten out near the tip of the blade. From time to time I've touched it up, but its been a few years. It still cuts though. My point is I'm not a pro with a stone.

Like I mentioned, I have several small Case XX knives on the way, and should receive them soon. Most of them will be gifts to in-laws, as we are moving away and I want them to have something to remember me by. As they are new knives, I expect them to be decently sharp, but I have no prior experience with Case and I don't know how sharp they come from the factory. So I'm thinking of picking up a fine stone just to touch them up if they need it. I'd hate to give a knife as a gift, and for it to be dull. I plan on practicing with the new stone on one of the new knives (Case Peanut) that is for me, so I don't ruin one that is meant for a gift. Once I feel confident, I'll sharpen the gift knives.

So all that said, what kind of grit level should I be looking for? I'm assuming 1000 grit or something like that, but really have no idea. Do Case knives come pretty sharp out of the factory? If they don't, will I need more than one grit level? I live in South Korea, so don't have access to most of the brands available back home in the States, FYI.

I don't want to spend too much, because I do plan on getting into sharpening more in the future. I'd like to pick up a Lansky 4-stone diamond set plus an ultra fine hone, and maybe a strop, and get my personal (growing) collection razor sharp. I'll be home for Christmas next month and plan on getting that kit then. But for now, I just want something to ensure I don't give a dull knife out as a gift.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Squashfan]

My suggestion would be to strop the blade with black compound. That is assuming that the factory edges are in pretty good shape. Most factory edges will not be as good/sharp as a truly well sharpened edge that you do. You might be able to replace the factory scratch pattern with a stone though. I have a Case stockman and the edges on it are sharp. But it has a very coarse scratch pattern from the factory. Do you have home improvement stores like Lowe's in South Korea? In the states Lowe's has black buffing compound for about $3 US dollars. Wood working stores (Woodcraft in the USA) might also carry the green compound which would work too.

BTW, I have a Lansky and I was advised to pick up one of the standard stone to use between the fine diamond and the ultra fine hone. On regular blade steels, diamond tends to leave deep scratches in the blade that needs to be replaced before you move one to the ultra fine stone.

I hope this helps,
Charles

 

[LutzSpearo]

Thanks for the reply. My wife is Korean, maybe she can help me locate some stropping compound, and a strop. There is nothing like Home Depot here, but maybe some smaller shop or online store will have them.

Thanks for the tip on the Lansky system. For the types of steels typical on Case, GEC and Boker pocket knives, would the stone system be better than diamond? I'm not sure exactly what types of steel they use. I certainly won't be needing to reprofile anything, except maybe my old Camillus, as any other knife I sharpen will be a new one. And I may just leave the Camillus alone anyway, as I'm retiring it since I learned that company went out of business. I don't want to lose this knife, I love it, so it's going to a safe place.

In any case, I won't have a Lansky system before I gift these knives, so I'll try to find or make a strop if I can find the compound. Thanks again!

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Case uses 420HC for their 'Tru-Sharp' stainless, and their CV steel (non-stainless 'Chrome Vanadium') is very similar to 1095, in terms of how easily it sharpens up. Both are very easy to sharpen with simple tools, and they both respond very well to silicon carbide or aluminum oxide abrasives for finishing (wet/dry sandpaper is great for them). For small pocketknives, a pocket diamond hone in a medium or fine grit works fast for setting new bevels, though it's not essential. If going with the Lansky system, adding a medium diamond hone to supplement the kit can prove very useful.

Most recent-vintage Case knives seem to come with decent factory edges, and they're pretty toothy; Case uses a low-grit belt to put the edges on them. They can sometimes be wickedly-sharp at that coarse grit (I've shed some blood in proof of that), assuming the factory burrs were decently cleaned up.

As mentioned, black compound works well, and especially so for cleaning up the burrs produced on Case's stainless. Their CV won't be as stubborn in burrs formed; they clean up quite easily on that steel, with green compound on leather or on bare leather alone. Green compound on a simple leather belt is a great finishing touch on both steels.


David

 

[LutzSpearo]

Case uses 420HC for their 'Tru-Sharp' stainless, and their CV steel (non-stainless 'Chrome Vanadium') is very similar to 1095, in terms of how easily it sharpens up. Both are very easy to sharpen with simple tools, and they both respond very well to silicon carbide or aluminum oxide abrasives for finishing (wet/dry sandpaper is great for them). For small pocketknives, a pocket diamond hone in a medium or fine grit works fast for setting new bevels, though it's not essential. If going with the Lansky system, adding a medium diamond hone to supplement the kit can prove very useful.

Most recent-vintage Case knives seem to come with decent factory edges, and they're pretty toothy; Case uses a low-grit belt to put the edges on them. They can sometimes be wickedly-sharp at that coarse grit (I've shed some blood in proof of that), assuming the factory burrs were decently cleaned up.

As mentioned, black compound works well, and especially so for cleaning up the burrs produced on Case's stainless. Their CV won't be as stubborn in burrs formed; they clean up quite easily on that steel, with green compound on leather or on bare leather alone. Green compound on a simple leather belt is a great finishing touch on both steels.


David

Thanks for the reply, I'll be searching for stropping stuff this weekend.

To clarify, you think the stone kit would be best, with a medium diamond hone to supplement it?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Thanks for the reply, I'll be searching for stropping stuff this weekend.

To clarify, you think the stone kit would be best, with a medium diamond hone to supplement it?

The stone kit would work fine with the Case knives you're referencing here. The medium diamond hone is handy for speeding things up, such as for more wear-resistant steels or large/thick blades (and a coarse/XC diamond would be all the better, for those). I mentioned the medium diamond because I've found it to be very handy for very quick re-bevelling on smaller blades in simpler steels, such as for traditional pocketknives; even a fine diamond could work quickly for these. Not necessary, but useful. For the small pocketknives you want to sharpen now, I think the stock stones will be fine for you.


David

 

[R15K]

If you go with the Lansky system I'd second the buying of a medium diamond hone as you'll find yourself going from medium to fine to ultra (if you choose) most times while skipping the heaviest stone unless you need serious reprofiling.

Make sure you read about sharpening and burrs as well, the Lansky (at least for me) tends to very easily work up a nice sharp feeling false edge that folds over in a week or so if you aren't careful (you can see it if you have bright light and good eyes) so your very sharp knife gets very dull very quickly.

Oh and I stroop on non-coragated cardboard with a polishing compound from a car care kit. While I'm sure there's better alternatives it works.

 

[LutzSpearo]

That's great information, thank you! Also, while I am still on the lookout for stropping stuff over here, I think I'd like to order that field stropping kit from Knives Ship Free to pick up when I'm in the States next month. I watched a YouTube video of a cool older Japanese guy using it, and it looks like it'd be perfect for stropping the small knives that I like. And will fit neatly in a desk drawer. I still need to find an old belt or something for using here in Korea, and some sort of compound. No luck yet with finding proper stopping kit in Korea yet.

 

[HeavyHanded]

That's great information, thank you! Also, while I am still on the lookout for stropping stuff over here, I think I'd like to order that field stropping kit from Knives Ship Free to pick up when I'm in the States next month. I watched a YouTube video of a cool older Japanese guy using it, and it looks like it'd be perfect for stropping the small knives that I like. And will fit neatly in a desk drawer. I still need to find an old belt or something for using here in Korea, and some sort of compound. No luck yet with finding proper stopping kit in Korea yet.

You don't mention what hardware store stone you have. If its one that sheds a bit of grit as you work, you could use it with oil and create some mud to use as a stropping compound. I've done this with cheaper aluminum oxide stones, and all silicon carbide stones. Go easy on the oil, just enough to create a bit of slurry, wipe it up with a sheet of paper and wrap that around the stone muddy side up. Works great for a strop, especially for a toothier edge. I keep a small piece of hacksaw blade with my silicon carbide stones so I can whip up some "compound" without having to do a bunch of grinding with cutlery first.

Martin

 

[LutzSpearo]

You don't mention what hardware store stone you have. If its one that sheds a bit of grit as you work, you could use it with oil and create some mud to use as a stropping compound. I've done this with cheaper aluminum oxide stones, and all silicon carbide stones. Go easy on the oil, just enough to create a bit of slurry, wipe it up with a sheet of paper and wrap that around the stone muddy side up. Works great for a strop, especially for a toothier edge. I keep a small piece of hacksaw blade with my silicon carbide stones so I can whip up some "compound" without having to do a bunch of grinding with cutlery first.

Martin

Great tip, I didn't know you could do that. Do you use a fine stone for this?

I still need to find a hardware store that carries this stuff, this week I plan to pop into a few. I visited a couple kitchen knife stores over the weekend, they only carried the steel rods you see in kitchens. You should have seen me trying to describe a sharpening stone with hand motions lol. They didn't have any though.

 

[HeavyHanded]

Great tip, I didn't know you could do that. Do you use a fine stone for this?

I still need to find a hardware store that carries this stuff, this week I plan to pop into a few. I visited a couple kitchen knife stores over the weekend, they only carried the steel rods you see in kitchens. You should have seen me trying to describe a sharpening stone with hand motions lol. They didn't have any though.

Yeah,use the fine side, and if there's a lot of oil on the paper just let it sit for a few. Can also blot with another sheet of paper. Helps to have a fair amount of loose material built up before wiping it off. A heavily dosed sheet of paper can last for a loong time.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

That's great information, thank you! Also, while I am still on the lookout for stropping stuff over here, I think I'd like to order that field stropping kit from Knives Ship Free to pick up when I'm in the States next month. I watched a YouTube video of a cool older Japanese guy using it, and it looks like it'd be perfect for stropping the small knives that I like. And will fit neatly in a desk drawer. I still need to find an old belt or something for using here in Korea, and some sort of compound. No luck yet with finding proper stopping kit in Korea yet.

One of the things I've come to like about using the Case blades, in 'Tru-Sharp' stainless or CV, is that either steel is very easily maintained with very simple tools. Green compound is great, but even fine sand/siltstone dust can also work. I've actually used a piece of southwestern red sandstone like a waterstone (it makes it's own slurry/mud when used with water) to re-bevel and work up a burr on a Case stainless blade, and then used some of the stone's mud on a simple veg-tanned leather strop to remove the burr. Produced a great edge with lots of bite to it, and really made me appreciate the simplicity of Case's steel choices.

Virtually any polishing compound made for steel can also work (read the labels on it for their applications), or some automotive polishes (not wax, but buffing/polishing compounds). You might seek out any businesses that specialize in jewelry-making (look for compounds used to tumble/polish gemstones or other rocks/minerals), or auto refinishing/polishing supplies. You could also use high-grit wet/dry sandpaper in silicon carbide (black) or aluminum oxide (may be black/dark grey, white, pink, blue) as a stropping material, followed by simple bare-leather stropping or stropping on denim/canvas/paper.


David

 

[LutzSpearo]

All great tips, thanks! I just got the knives in that I ordered, 7 Case's and 2 Boker's. They are all more sharp than I anticipated (slice a piece of quality printer paper easily), so I think I may just skip the hassle of making a stopping kit here. When I get home in a few weeks, my KSF Field Stropping Kit will be waiting for me, which I plan to use on my knives just to see how it improves their already sharp edges.

5 knives are going to family, 4 are for me. When I ordered them, I didn't pick which ones would go to who (except for one Boker Evergreen pen that I knew was for me), I just chose a bunch I thought looked good and were on the smaller side. Going through them all and deciding which 5 I would give was hard, because they are all wonderful knives. Even the stag scales on the Case knives are pretty good, with fairly well-matched handles and not overly bulging. I would happily own all of them, so I am pretty sure they will love them too!

Thanks to everyone for taking the time to help me learn more about stropping, and what I can use when I don't have a proper kit. These are all very good things to know in case I need to make up some compound etc. in the future. Thanks again!

 

[LutzSpearo]

The stone kit would work fine with the Case knives you're referencing here. The medium diamond hone is handy for speeding things up, such as for more wear-resistant steels or large/thick blades (and a coarse/XC diamond would be all the better, for those). I mentioned the medium diamond because I've found it to be very handy for very quick re-bevelling on smaller blades in simpler steels, such as for traditional pocketknives; even a fine diamond could work quickly for these. Not necessary, but useful. For the small pocketknives you want to sharpen now, I think the stock stones will be fine for you.


David

If I get the Lansky stone set, plus a medium diamond hone and an ultra-fine stone hone, and wanted to put a new bevel on my old Camillus... what order would I use the stones in? From what I have read, I think I should use them in this order:

1. Medium Diamond Hone
2. Medium Stone Hone
3. Fine Stone Hone
4. Ultra Fine Stone Hone
5. Strop with black or green compound. If I wanted to strop with both, I'd use black first, then green.

Is my understanding correct?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

That's virtually identical to the setup I used (the hone sequence) with my original Lansky kit, so I'm confident it'll work for you. :thumbup:

You're also correct in assuming you'd use the black compound prior to the green. You don't necessarily have to use the black; especially after finishing on the Fine/UF hones (bevels should be polished/near-mirror off the Fine/UF Lansky hones). With the steels you're sharpening (basic carbon and/or simple stainless), you might find the black compound to be unnecessary. In some cases, it might even be overkill. BUT, it's handy to have on hand, and can be useful for finishing coarser edges (de-burring & such), as if straight off the medium diamond or the medium (standard stone) Lansky hones.


David

If I get the Lansky stone set, plus a medium diamond hone and an ultra-fine stone hone, and wanted to put a new bevel on my old Camillus... what order would I use the stones in? From what I have read, I think I should use them in this order:

1. Medium Diamond Hone
2. Medium Stone Hone
3. Fine Stone Hone
4. Ultra Fine Stone Hone
5. Strop with black or green compound. If I wanted to strop with both, I'd use black first, then green.

Is my understanding correct?

 

[LutzSpearo]

Thanks for the reply and advice! I'm looking forward getting into this.