Making my first knife, bowie with hidden tang, need some guidance.(now with picture)

L

Lasse Eskildsen

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Feb 19, 2010
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75
Hello there :)

I am going to make my first knife handle as a summer project with a friend of mine.
I will be using this blade: http://www.thegoodstuffshop.dk/product.asp?product=13513
I am thinking that I'll be making it from a piece of some kind of wood on the top and bottom and a larger piece of buffallo horn in the middle.
Now I am wondering how you mount the knife into the handle, I want the tang to be hidden (except for the screw in the buttom) I am thinking that you stack the handle pieces ontop of each other in a approximate shape and then drill all the way through it, but the tang is flat and i dont know if it will be stable for batoning and such if you push it through a round hole where there is air in the sides?
Then what i was thinking is that when it is flush at the end of the handle you drill inwards with a larger drill a bit so the end screw can fit on and be lowered into the handle so that it is flush, if that makes any sense?

I am hoping you will give some suggestions on a good way to do it, I'll greatly prefere not cutting the wood blocks in half and mounting them on each side.
also, will a knife of this kind hold up to batoning?

Thanks :)
 
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Glue and clamp your handle pieces. After they have cured, drill them.
When you permanently install the semi-finished handle, you can pour epoxy into the gaps. Then tighten your butt cap.
 
I've never successfully done this so feel free to ignore my comments.

Rather than drilling a single LARGE hole that the tang fits into, use a drill that is the same width (side-to-side) and drill multiple holes beside each other. This is easier said than done. It might not be too bad if the pieces aren't too long. My holes seem to wander into the adjacent hole and screws up my plans for two parallel holes.

There was a thread that discussed making a handle broach, a tool to reach into this hole and scrape out wood to elongate and enlarge the hole. Do a search for "broach" and you'll find information.

Not much help but I wish you luck.

- Paul Meske, Wisconsin
 
Lasse Eskildsen said:
Hello there :)

I am going to make my first knife handle as a summer project with a friend of mine.
I will be using this blade: http://www.thegoodstuffshop.dk/product.asp?product=13513
I am thinking that I'll be making it from a piece of some kind of wood on the top and bottom and a larger piece of buffallo horn in the middle.
Now I am wondering how you mount the knife into the handle, I want the tang to be hidden (except for the screw in the buttom) I am thinking that you stack the handle pieces ontop of each other in a approximate shape and then drill all the way through it, but the tang is flat and i dont know if it will be stable for batoning and such if you push it through a round hole where there is air in the sides?
Then what i was thinking is that when it is flush at the end of the handle you drill inwards with a larger drill a bit so the end screw can fit on and be lowered into the handle so that it is flush, if that makes any sense?

I am hoping you will give some suggestions on a good way to do it, I'll greatly prefere not cutting the wood blocks in half and mounting them on each side.
also, will a knife of this kind hold up to batoning?

Thanks :)
Click to expand...

I am NOT trying to counter what others have said that know more than me, but I'd proceed this way... My favorite knife to make is the puukko, and a stacked handle is the norm... This is how I do it most of the time...

Take all pieces that are to be used for the handle and sand the mating edges FLAT to each other making certain that each piece is marked so as to mate with its corresponding piece.

Next, I would find the center of each piece and drill a hole in it that is just a bit larger than the tang will be at that location. The exception of course is the front piece that will mate up with the blade. That piece needs to be very close in size so as to not have a gap.

After all of the above are done, I'd place the blade, point down, into a vise and "put each piece in place to double check the fit. Once satisfied that my sanding of the mating surfaces were good I'd go to the next step.

time to get a bit messy....

Check 3, 4, 5, or 27 times to make sure that the 1st piece of handle that meets the blade is drilled and filed out to EXACTLY where you want it in relation to the blade. This piece will take you a LOT more time than any other. Once you are happy with the fit, slide it into place.

Then, coat the top surface of that with epoxy, slide on the next piece and coat with epoxy making sure you dribble some into the hole of the one below, continue this until you have used all you want for your handle. You did drill out the final piece for the nut didn't you?

Do a DRY run of this several; times until you are sure you have exactly what you want. Then it's time for the epoxy. BTW, use the 24 hours cure stuff, not the 5 minute... Trust me.

once you have all pieces in place, screw the nut into position and get it tight... Then you wait at least 24 hours. Once the time is up you can then profile the handle to your liking with a grinder, files, and/or sandpaper... have fun! I love this style of handle!

Now, about batoning with this knife.... Since the HT and such are unknown I wouldn't bet my life on it.... It may be fine, but........

Charlie
 
I'd add that unless your using stabilized handle material that I'd avoid the screw on pommel. It's the strongest type handle with mycarta or other synthetic, but with natural material that likes to move a little it can cause cracking. The only antler handle I've ever had to crack the pommel was constructed this way. Other than that the sky's the limit. Also I'd suggest trying to get an oval shaped slot instead of one big hole for the tang, it'll be stronger, but leave some wiggle room for the epoxy.
 
Okay, now that'd you've had a lot of good advice, it's time you got some bad advice.

Since you are thinking of using this for batoning, I would not suggest you make a stacked handle. They are quite beautiful, but the joins between the pieces would likely become weak spots if the handle has to absorb much shock.

I think someone suggested making the block by putting two scales together (possibly after cutting the appropriate channel for the tang into them). That's probaby a sound idea, but the "belt and suspenders" mentality I use would then compell me to put "belts" around each end, in the form of caps/ferrules. This adds complexity to the project, and frankly is probably pointless... but that's what "belt and suspenders" usually implies. It would also give you a nice way to integrate the pommel at the butt end.

Again, since batoning is an intended use, I'd steer away from "pretty" handle material like spalted woods or burls, and steer towards more rugged materials. You can still make an attractive handle, just be cognizant of the ability of the material to bear the stresses you'll be placing on it.

This concludes your bad advice. I now return you to people that know what they are talking about.

- Greg
 
Thanks for all the replies :) they have been a great help but open up quite alot more questions :P
I'll drop the several sections and make it of one handle material i think. I am undecided if it should be buffalo horn or some kind of black wood like ebony, will buffalo horn hold up and is it alot harder to work with than wood?
When I am to drill a hole through the handle material how do i make it oval?

I am not sure about using two halves on each side of the tang, will this leave a visible line down the middle?

The only ebony i have found is not stabilized and you said that the end screw could damage it, so do i just take the end screw off and make it normaly? will the tang sit tight enough just with epoxy glue?

I have also been looking into making a small guard at the top and a pommel on made of brass, and i got a few questions there. I'm going to buy some brass pieces and cut them out with a hacksaw, I am thinking I'll just epoxy the lower one on and make it a bit wider than the handle and then bend it 2-3mm up the shaft at the bottom and hammer it on to give it a kind of rough finish.
Another question is how to make the cutout for the guard? Do you drill two small holes and then file the space in the middle out so it get square?

Generally I am going with a kind of rough natural look for the knife, worn looking metals and natural materials inspired by the savanna, I'll be making a rough looking leather sheath with crocodile leather which I have quite a stack of already.

Again, thanks for the responses :)
 
Generally, ebony is not stabilized because the oil content of the wood is so high.
 
I have read many comments that ebony is susceptible to cracking and African Blackwood is a better choice.
 
Antler has a varying amount of pith in the center that is VERY soft. If you plan on using that my advice would be to remove all the pith and fill the gaping hole with epoxy... or stabilize the antler first. Frankly, though, I'm not sure antler is a good choice.
 
I can't answer about buffalo horn as I have not used mine yet. For what you intend, you might consider seeking out a piece of unstabilized Lignum Vitae. It's very hard, very oily, does not take stabilization, and has been used for a long time to make truncheons (which are, by nature, used for batoning... people's heads). ;)

- Greg
 
tryppyr said:
I can't answer about buffalo horn as I have not used mine yet. For what you intend, you might consider seeking out a piece of unstabilized Lignum Vitae. It's very hard, very oily, does not take stabilization, and has been used for a long time to make truncheons (which are, by nature, used for batoning... people's heads). ;)

- Greg
Click to expand...

Not to mention that lignum vitae smells great when you're working it! Like Greg said, TOUGH stuff and decent to look at. Sand to about 600 and buff to a high shine for your application.

Charlie
 
I have used buffalo horn and its is good to work with and tough, for your first knife I would stick with wood. On you question on batoning, I doubt that this blade will hold up, it might but battoning is really tough on blades and this is more of a generic use type of blade. The grind on this blade will make battoning even tougher, a full flat grind is better. One issue you have not addressed is a guard, not too difficult, just a piece of brass with a slot, the web site you are showing may have some available for that blade.

If you look at their knife kit they show a guard, why dont you buy the kit, it looks good an complete, I dont read german but I like the look of the instruction book.
 
Thanks for the replies :) I was in the shop today with my mate and bought the materials, I went for a slightly more expensive blade but i just realy fell in love with it,
Its made by a proffesional danish knife smith named Poul Strande.
Its a bit shorter than the other but has a realy nice hammered finish.
The other one cost 86$ while this one cost 136$. When you are in that price range you might aswell get something you are completely satisfied with than a so-and-so

I also went for buffalo horn as handle material and two pieces of brass for the guard and buttcap. the tang bend a bit forewards at the bottom but I'm going to file that straight.

All suggestions are still welcome though I am also reading alot of guides :)
Pictures will be upcomming in another thread next week as the project begins.
 
The tang may be bent for a reason. If you really want the tang straight you may be able to just bend it instead of filing it. Put pictures of your blade and materials up here before you begin working on them.
 
Here is a picture of the blade, it wont help to file it anyhow i think since eventhough i made the outward bending side straight it would still leave a large gap at the bottom where it curves on the other side. it actually curves so much forewards that if you made a straight handle flush with the knife, the tang would poke out of it.



I cant get a picture of the handle material up before sunday since its at my mate's place. but here is a link to where i bought it,
http://www.thegoodstuffshop.dk/product.asp?product=17916
the measurements are 120x40x23mm
 
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