Making Replacement Knife Scales

Chris*33

Chris*33

Gold Member
Joined
Jan 16, 2017
Messages
349
Hello,

I have ran into a problem so any insight here would be really appreciated.

As the title says, i want to start making replacement handles for knives (fixed and folders).
The work will be done by power tools to get the approximate shape and then finished by hand, so no CNC Machine in play here.

If i try to shape the handle while attached on the knife then i will be sanding on the actual metal. Obviously, this gets worse when it comes to folders without a steel frame, since the material is much softer and will definitely lose the initial shape from sanding.

Do you think a hardened steel template (at a high rockwell) would be a good solution here? That way i would only use the actual knife once.

Something I'm missing, maybe? How would you approach this?

Thank you,
Christos
 
I would say 99% of new handles are shaped on the knife. Try it once and see if it is easier than you think.

Obviously, you need to take your time as you get right down to the tang, but it will work.
Otherwise, you will need CNC equipment of other close tolerance methods.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
I would say 99% of new handles are shaped on the knife. Try it once and see if it is easier than you think.
Click to expand...

First of all, thank you for your input.
My problem is not the difficulty of the task but the fact that the knife will wear down after a few handles (am i right on this?) and will cause the scales not to be flush with a new knife. Maybe i wasn't as clear as i thought i was on that.

I know the steel is hardened but wouldn't some stock loss occur after a few handles? The flushing of the scales will be done on hand and not on the grinder but it still worries me a bit. A higher grit, say 180, would still get the job done without removing much material? Just more time consuming i guess?
 
Maybe you can make a set up where, after band-sawing the rough profile, you can finish profiling the scales flush by using a router where the tang template could be on the bottom (laying on the router table) and the two scales temporarily pinned on top of it, and just use a router with a bearing guide on the bottom that the tang itself will ride against it and not be affected and only the scales on top of it will be cut by the teeth of the router bit itself. Not sure if that makes sense, but if you know what I'm taking about with router bits and bearing guides used with them I'm sure you'll know sort of what I'm talking about. If the bearing is on top of the router bit, just have the tang template on top of both scales.

~Paul
My Youtube Channel
... (Just some older videos of some knives I've made in the past)
 
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Here's what I'm talking about. Just do the same but with the router mounted upside down, and then just figure out a way to do it safely ;)


~Paul
My Youtube Channel
... (Just some older videos of some knives I've made in the past)
 
coldsteelburns said:
Maybe you can make a set up where, after band-sawing the rough profile, you can finish profiling the scales flush by using a router where the tang template could be on the bottom (laying on the router table) and the two scales temporarily pinned on top of it, and just use a router with a bearing guide on the bottom that the tang itself will ride against it and not be affected and only the scales on top of it will be cut by the teeth of the router bit itself. Not sure if that makes sense, but if you know what I'm taking about with router bits and bearing guides used with them I'm sure you'll know sort of what I'm talking about. If the bearing in on top of the router bit, just have the tang template on top of both scales.

~Paul
My Youtube Channel
... (Just some older videos of some knives I've made in the past)
Click to expand...


That's an excellent idea that didn't and wouldn't cross my mind.
That's really helpful, i really appreciate it Paul!

Edit: thanks for the video as well
 
Are you replacing a set of handles on a knife you have, or making replacement handles to sell?
 
Router table would do the trick, they use a bearing to run against your template so even wood could work.I made one from a $10 chunk of 6061 Aluminum and a $30 router.

Hardened steel does not stand a chance against a grinder.

I know you said no cnc but a cnc router would do a lot on the cheap. I'm working on setting up a cnc6040 to rough cut scale profiles/spot holes that I will hand finish.

Getting a clean fit on others knives will be nearly impossible, I plan on shadowboxing mine along with a rounded/chamfered knife perimeter for comfort.
 
Daniel Fairly Knives said:
Router table would do the trick, they use a bearing to run against your template so even wood could work.I made one from a $10 chunk of 6061 Aluminum and a $30 router.

Hardened steel does not stand a chance against a grinder.

I know you said no cnc but a cnc router would do a lot on the cheap. I'm working on setting up a cnc6040 to rough cut scale profiles/spot holes that I will hand finish.

Getting a clean fit on others knives will be nearly impossible, I plan on shadowboxing mine along with a rounded/chamfered knife perimeter for comfort.
Click to expand...


Hello Daniel.

I was asking for hardened steel templates considering that the finishing fit (flashing of scale & tang) would be done by hand so it wouldn't be affected by the grinder.

I understand what a big help and boost for sales a CNC machine is, but the point, for now at least, is that i'll make the scales with my hands. If it does turn to something that brings in or could bring in some significant income, maybe i'll consider it then.

I am a beginner in these kind of things so you have to consider my enthusiasm of making something by myself and hopefully bringing some money in the bank!
 
I believe he is talking about offering replacement scales for popular mass produced knives. So like replacement scales for a Benchmade something or other.
 
OK, now I understand your project.
Equipment is everything in production knifemaking ( and handle making). A good router table, carbide cutters, a milling machine, rock solid drill press, etc. Any tool with slop or hand held will cause problems. Replacement handles made to fit a knife you don't have in your hand will have to be of very tight tolerance ... probably a few thousandths of an inch.

A hardened template is fine, but how will you know it is exact to the knife the scales will be on? The only way is to machine it exact from a disassembled knife of that type. As said earlier, a good grade aluminum template would also work.

Good luck on your quest, but it is a virtual impossibility that you will make any money on it considering the deep investment in the equipment to do the task.
 
Knives manufactured by the larger well known companies will have +/- tolerances that will be addressed on final assembly and inspection to ensure proper fit and function. Trying to Guess that your Aftermarket handles will fit each and every knife even in a specific design like a Spyderco PM2 is praying for a miracle. Doing this type of Handle work really requires that you have the Exact knife in House to make sure it's finish will be as described to the customer. Not trying to discourage your ambition but you should think it through and test your ability on One Specific Model and if you have friends with the same model ask to build a set for them and test your process....Good Measuring Equipment is essential for Repeatability!!
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
OK, now I understand your project.
Equipment is everything in production knifemaking ( and handle making). A good router table, carbide cutters, a milling machine, rock solid drill press, etc. Any tool with slop or hand held will cause problems. Replacement handles made to fit a knife you don't have in your hand will have to be of very tight tolerance ... probably a few thousandths of an inch.

A hardened template is fine, but how will you know it is exact to the knife the scales will be on? The only way is to machine it exact from a disassembled knife of that type. As said earlier, a good grade aluminum template would also work.

Good luck on your quest, but it is a virtual impossibility that you will make any money on it considering the deep investment in the equipment to do the task.
Click to expand...

I do have some equipment already, so, from a beginner's standpoint, i can start as it is. Thanks to Paul's suggestion i have already ordered a flash trim carbide router bit for a router i already have, so i can use the actual knife/scale as a template now without fear of damaging it or altering its factory tolerances. That will get me going i think.

I understand of course the need for very good equipment to get a tight & tidy finished product, but i'm not fooling myself in believing that this on its own will provide me enough money to live on it and even if it does help a bit, i know it will require some time.
For now it's more about the idea and maybe a stepping stone to knife making. My direction is 'producing something by myself and that it relates to knives because i enjoy the knife world'. As for a specific path to that direction i'll have to wait and see where it takes me.



Busto said:
Knives manufactured by the larger well known companies will have +/- tolerances that will be addressed on final assembly and inspection to ensure proper fit and function. Trying to Guess that your Aftermarket handles will fit each and every knife even in a specific design like a Spyderco PM2 is praying for a miracle. Doing this type of Handle work really requires that you have the Exact knife in House to make sure it's finish will be as described to the customer. Not trying to discourage your ambition but you should think it through and test your ability on One Specific Model and if you have friends with the same model ask to build a set for them and test your process....Good Measuring Equipment is essential for Repeatability!!
Click to expand...

100% with you on this, i know i'm placing my hopes on the equipment and tolerances each company sets for itself, here!
The thing is that i know other people are doing it already, so i know before hand that is something that can be done and be successful in it.
I believe that fixed blades will be more of a problem than folders (that's how i understand it at least) since the handle slabs and the tang are in contact and they have to be level (flushed?) especially if they come with coating which certainly differs from blade to blade. I'll give it a go in any case, put my best in it and as i replied to Stacy before i see where it takes me.


**Thank you both for your information and the reality check with this :thumbsup:
 
I would find someone who could cut the handle material as EXACT as possible with water jet, laser, edm, or whatever was the most precise(that didn’t damage the material). It would be like getting blade profiles cut, only with handles. Then all you would have to do would be finishing and final fitting.

If you didn’t go this route I would definitely make some hardened steel templates, that were the exact dimensions of the knife handle you were making them for. I would get a steel that could be hardened to a super high HRC. Then try and grind on the templates as little as possible. No way would I use an actual knife(a “burner knife” of your own, not the customers) to shape the scales. It would lose its shape way too fast.
 
JG Custom Metal Works said:
I would find someone who could cut the handle material as EXACT as possible with water jet, laser, edm, or whatever was the most precise(that didn’t damage the material). It would be like getting blade profiles cut, only with handles. Then all you would have to do would be finishing and final fitting.

If you didn’t go this route I would definitely make some hardened steel templates, that were the exact dimensions of the knife handle you were making them for. I would get a steel that could be hardened to a super high HRC. Then try and grind on the templates as little as possible. No way would I use an actual knife(a “burner knife” of your own, not the customers) to shape the scales. It would lose its shape way too fast.
Click to expand...


I would prefer the template method as i prefer to have control on the whole time and cost of the process. Maybe i could normalize the knife i already own and then heat treat it again at a higher rockwell. Would this work or will it mess up the structure of the steel you think?
 
Chris*33 said:
I would prefer the template method as i prefer to have control on the whole time and cost of the process. Maybe i could normalize the knife i already own and then heat treat it again at a higher rockwell. Would this work or will it mess up the structure of the steel you think?
Click to expand...
If you are talking about a production knife you purchased I would not fool around with any heat treating process. If you make a set of handle scales for that knife cut them as close to tang size and grind/sand to finish you will not be removing much steel from the tang as you shape and finish. Stick with a template method for Mass Production...I've made a lot of knives cut from templates/waterjet cut and no two are exactly identical during the finishing steps always a little fine tuning sanding polishing.

ETA: If you do not have a time and controlled temperature heat treating furnace you can ruin a properly heat treated blade and do you have a Rockwell hardness tester or just guessing based off internet information.....
 
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