Malayasian Khukuris & more.

Yvsa

Yvsa

Joined
May 18, 1999
Messages
15,395

:
Hi Mohd.
First let me apologize for any thing I may mention or ask about out of ignorance for your culture and country.
I sure don't mean to or want to offend.I have had much interet in your country,the jungles and your peoples since I was a young boy.
The Keris still fascinates me as well as many of the other edged weapons and tools used there.

I noticed where you had mentioned some things about diferent weapons in Malay and how guns are NOT to be HAD!!
I know you have a love for the H.I. Khukuri and wonder about the import of them and other similar things you might buy.I started to write you a letter and knowing how some governments are decided that I had better ask any questions here in the forum.

You have several Khukuris and I wonder if you ar allowed to carry them openly like it is done in Nepal.

Do you have to pay excess import duty to get them into your country?

I have seen where you talk about your young children and I know you are a loving caring father who dotes on his children and very much wishes them to grow up in a good way.I like the idea of you letting your sons hold the Khukuris and admire them.If it wouldn't be offensive may I ask thier ages?
What are thier opinions of the Khukuri?

Do you also teach them about your own country's edged weapons and tools?
I have see it mentioned many times where the Keris is considered one of the best fighting knives in the world.That it was designed for just such a task in a country where materials seems to be hard to come by.
Can you tell us anything about that?

I have many more questions and I would dearly love to sit and talk with you and many others that hang out in this forum.
smile.gif

I guess this means will have to do.

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>>>>---¥vsa---->®
Cornbread ain't s'possed ta be sweet!....Dagnabit gurl,whut did they teach you way up north in....;) hehehe.

Khukuri FAQ


 
Yvsa, what a nice post!

Mohd and I email one another on a personal basis and he is a true gentleman of the highest order. I am very proud to be able to call him nephew and am honored that he calls me "Pakcik" Bill.

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Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
 
Yvsa, we can talk some kris stuff offline. Indo or Filipino.

gsmoke@hotmail.com
 
Yvsa.

Thank you for your interest about Malaysia - no offence at all - I'll try my best to explain it in my Malaysian Englist (lact of vocabs, wrong spellings, wrong grammers and the worst is that sometimes what I wrote were not what I really meant! Please apologize me if it happens in this forums).

Malaysia is a small neighboring country to Thailand, Filipine, Indonesia & Singapore. We share a lot of similarities. Malaysian population is about 18 mil only - 50% Malays, 40% Chinese, 5% Indian and Others another 5%. Punjabis are considered Indian and few Gorkhas are considered in that 5% Others. Malays are Moslems - Chinese are Taoists, Buddhists & Christians - Indian are Hindus, Moslems & Christians - Others are Moslems, Christians, Sikhs, Shamans. So far we don't have any "holy killings"! - mainly because Malays are shy type of people with agricultural & fishing background! Come to visit Malaysia (+ Nepal of course - Nepal is not that far from Malaysia) - you won't be kill just because you are from different religions! BUT DO NOT BRING YOUR GUNS WITHOUT LISCENCE - PLEASEEEEE!

Kuala Lumpur is our capital city - small city! We do have what we called as virgin jungle kept as reservation & becoming popular as a tourist spot to see tropical flora & fauna! Maybe you like to climb mountain - Mount Kinabalu (not as high as Everest)! AT THIS POINT I FEEL LIKE ADVERTISING TOURISM!! Sorry!! (I am not as good as Cobalt & the rest of you in writing).

Keris is our traditional weapon - purely a killing weapon! (I never heard anybody in Malaysia cut birthday cake with Keris!). Keris are common weapon in South East Asian countries. Normally Malaysian don't like to collect Keris - it is very ritualistic! We believe traditional Keris has a sort of spirit connections! I think Portuguese also has a type of blade that being adopted from the shape of Keris. Forthermore Keris is a poisoneous weapon, it's blade is normally applied with a type of arscenic or other type of poison. The blade is made of Damascus steel - I think it is beautiful but very dangerous! Limited functions so I personally prefer Khukuris!

Other Malaysian traditional blades are Pedang, Golok, Parang, Mandau, Badik ... few more. Insya-Allah! I'll talk about this type of this traditional blades in the next posting. I have to go for late lunch now! NEPAL HO!


[This message has been edited by mohd (edited 16 October 1999).]
 
Mohd and all. I spent a few weeks in Malaysia years ago and it is a beautiful country. Very green and full of wild plants and animals. The water on the beaches is so warm it feels like bathwater, laping at your heels. It is crystal clear and the most beautiful blue color you can imagine. A color the seas up north in Alaska can only dream of. Sigh I'm really dreaming of it now! Especially with the sun fast disapearing.

The capital city of Kuala Lampur is a real sight as well. Many fine examples of British Imperial buildings including the breath taking railroad building. I found the people of malaysia to be very nice, always willing to talk to a strange foriegner and very many of them speak english due to the schooling system which I believe emphasises it for foriegn owned export business. I miss it.
 
Thanks, Mohd.

Malaysia was on my itinery but a failing kidney put it on hold. Now I don't know if I will ever see the place.

Do it while you are young!

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Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html


[This message has been edited by Bill Martino (edited 16 October 1999).]
 
:
Thanks Mohd.
What an excellent start! You do make me want to visit.
smile.gif
You more know about your country than I do about mine.Now my State may be a different matter although I really don't know how big Oklahoma is.From where I live to woods I can do anything I want to in is about 30 miles.There are wilderness areas much closr,but they have trails through them.I am allowed off the trails because I know the people that work in the parks and they know I have respect and won't take any plants from these places.
There is one place where some Blue Ash Trees are growing.They are almost extinct here and are very precious to us that know where they are.

The Keris is cleaned ritualistic once a year I understand.The handle is removed and it is first brushe and then a very acidic fruit is used on the blade tostart the ceaning process.It is then soaked in Lime juice to remove any rust.It is then saked in a ixture of arsenic and lime juice to bring out the pamor,the pattern of the nickle in the blade.There is actually more of a process that goes into making the Keris.I am fascinated by themm and I do know mine has a Spirit and a good one.Mine isn't cleaned in the traditional way,perhaps sometime.

Uncle has talked about the "jungle men" in Nepal gathering the ingredients for the laha.Are there still any jungle people in Malaysia?

I would also like your description of the other knives and such.Many times the people that know them give a different outlook than other people would.You can do one at a time if it would be helpful.That would certainly help me to absorb things better.I also don't want to take you away from your lunch time.

Smoke,I don't now much about the Keris,but feel free to write.I will tell you what I "think" I have.
smile.gif

I am interested in all sorts of what are sometimes called "primitive" knives.I have one of the old Rodgers knockoffs probably made in India.It is pretty old and well used.I believe that is where the term"double cross" came from.The old Rodgers mark was a Star and a Cross.The knockoffs most times had two Crosses or double cross.
These may be like some of the Khukuris that were made in England.
Close,but no cigar.
smile.gif


------------------
>>>>---¥vsa---->®
Cornbread ain't s'possed ta be sweet!....Dagnabit gurl,whut did they teach you way up north in....;) hehehe.

Khukuri FAQ


 
Heck,I remember triple agent.A double is doable.Now,that takes guts.He was,of course,found out and killed.I wonder what he did with the money?

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What about all those guns that are wrapped in cosmoline and buried from the days of the big commie uprising that the Brits put down?There have been lesser ones since.Don`t tell me there are no guns in private hands.You should have your own.

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As always, Ghost remains the Miss Manners of Political Correctness. ROFLMAO. God I'm glad you're here Ghost.
 
You are also glad that I am on your side.Or,to be more precise,the side of The Constitution of the United States.
yvsa brought up double cross.We just define it differently.

[This message has been edited by ghostsix (edited 17 October 1999).]
 
Yvsa, I've been fortunate to play w/ various blades and read a few books. I even have an ebony kris handle. Shannon Lew is a good source for Filipino krises and text.
 
Yvsa, Ghost, Rusty.

It is illegal to have guns without liscence in Malaysia - those who cought with guns especially any type of automatic pistols or revolvers might be penalise with death sentence! As I told you before Malays are a typical shy race - you may term them as mild type - very little of them brave enough to risk their life by keeping guns except at the remote areas whereby they use guns solely for hunting purpose.

Remember also that we have Chineses and Indians other than Malays. They - especially Chinese are totally from different culture - I just don't want to mention anything bad about them - you should know them well because you have China Town in LA and other big cities in US! They suffer a lot in their prev generations, then maybe it is a bit difficult for them to part themselves from any sort of underground movements or triad society - well - this might give some of them reasons to have guns without liscence!! Furthermore when we talk about commies in Malaysia - normally it will be very closely related to our Malaysian Chinese!! I am telling mere facts so hopefully I won't hurt their sensitivity - OK!

Yvsa, Smoke.

Other traditional blades in Malaysia are Golok, Parang and Mandau.

Pix of Malaysian Golok is # 1 in: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/Indonesn.htm

Pix of Malaysian Parangs (but they are mistakenly referred as Golok) are in: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/mg1.htm http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/gn56.htm

Pix of Malaysian (Borneo part of Malaysia) Mandau is: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/gn85.htm

The standard classification of blades in Malaysia are:
  • <12" OAL is Pisau (knife)
  • >12" but less than 19" is Golok or Parang Pendek (short Parang)
  • >19" is Parang or Parang Panjang (long Parang)
  • Whatever Parang that have guard and sharp edge all along the front part - it is Pedang (Sword)
  • Whatever Pisau, Golok or Parang that have double sharp edge is Badik (Dagger).

I have check with Malaysian Govt and I was inform that I can import any blades except those clasified as Snap Knife and Dagger. Sword is not classified under knife - I don't think they will allow me to import sword! In my case I was lucky because I manage to convince them that Khukuris are knives - short knives, medium size knives and long knives! They agree - alhamdu-li-(A)llaah! So - 25" HI Sirupati Khukuri is a very long knife! - it is not a sword at all!

Pakcik Bill - you are distributing Nepali Steel Handicrafts or Nepali Knives - are not you!


[This message has been edited by mohd (edited 18 October 1999).]

[This message has been edited by mohd (edited 19 October 1999).]
 
Mohd, I can't speak for the others.

For me it is apparent that your culture and country regards edged tools as one thing and firearms as something very different.

Clearly, being caught in posession of a gun in your country can result in the ultimate penalty ( death ) with little chance for leniency. You make it clear that even considering the consequenses of violating those laws is rightfully scary.

It's sometimes difficult for those of us who've grown up with guns as farm and ranch implements, hunting tools, and a form of recreation, as well as a means for protection to understand the concerns of those in other countries.

These forums allow open dialog. They also allow open access to anything said by anyone who wants to look. We need to respect Mohd's situation. Please.

Ghostsix, I, Smoke, Yvsa, live in a different situation than you. Ghost's opinion cuts to the radix ( root ) of the situation for him.
My opinion given my situation isn't far from Ghost's but was arrived at on a way different road. Yvsa's choice of how to live probably comes from a very different starting point to end up fairly close to Ghost and me for practical purposes. We aren't you, we aren't in your situation, so why should we think we know what's right for you halfway around the world.

Take care of yourself, Mohd. I want you around to learn a lot from for a long time to come. Rusty



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I'm thinking, I'm thinking!


 
:
Mohd, et al:
I find the gun laws in Malaysia very fascinating and I do respect mohds wishes.Very much as a matter of fact.
To the point that I wish no one else would bring them up in this thread again.That's why I didn't e-mail Mohd personally with the questions.
To probably shock some people here I think it would be interesting to live in a country like Mohd's where guns weren't to be had,Great Britain not being one of them.

My true interests are in knives and other edged weapons.I have some guns and would like to have a couple of more.Regretfully I think it hard to live in this country wthout guns.Because of the way things are I feel they are needed.

I would much prefer to use a knife or sword.
One,I think it takes more skill and pure damn guts to be up close and personal.I have no problem using knives for offense, defense as well as tools.I always said that if I had a good knife that I could get a gun.I doubt that is true today,it was very true once.
I am one of those that Cliff refers to as already dead and I would be,but not before causing some serious problems.
smile.gif


Two,the warclub was the weapon of choice for my people the Cherokee.
The only reason so many of the Cherokee are still around is that we are very adaptable and also some of the first to meet the Europeans.There is more history than that taught in the schools no matter what level.Most isn't given any credence because it was either written or told by the Indins themselves.Then the things like 38 Sioux Warriors being hanged at Mankato Minnesota for defending the land that was given to them by treaty.That was done on Dec 26th 1862.Abraham Lincoln gave the order.
As Rusty says I do have a different viewpoint.

------------------
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;---¥vsa----&gt;®
Cornbread ain't s'possed ta be sweet!....Dagnabit gurl,whut did they teach you way up north in....;) hehehe.

Khukuri FAQ


 
:
Mohd:
Most interesting.I sure was never aware about the differences in the lengths denoteing different terms for a blade.
I couldn't get the links to work.I had a pop up that kept saying that the address did not exist.
frown.gif

I will see if I can find them later on.

I have a Moro Sword.I guess it would be a Badik because it is double edged.It has always been very sharp.It is hand forged and has a fold line down by the point and a pretty large one just below the hilt.It would be a 9 luk if it were a Keris.
Where the Nepal Khukuri's have the full stick tang the tang on this sword is almost non-existant.It is only about 1" -- 25 mm long and almost looks like a triangle.
The hardwood handle has been badly damaged.
I have another sword that I don't know where it is from.It may be from the Malaysian archipealigo(sp).
It is forged from a single piece of steel and is leaf shaped on the end and also sharp on both sides.

How long did it take you to find out about importing the H.I. Khukuri's?

That is kind of interesting.I suppose it wouldn't take much to find out about such things here,but I have never given it any thought.

Didn't you say your fathr or someone had a coconut grove or plantaion of some sort?
Who were the main customers of such an enterprise?
I am enjoying this a lot.A person can learn things on this forum that it would be hard pressed to learn any where else.
Thanks Mohd.
smile.gif

 
Shiroikuma.
Thanks for your help to explain about Malaysia.

Ghost, Rusty.
No problem! I am not an emosional type - after all this is an open forum - meaning we have to open our mind to what other people say - I always appreciate your points!

Yvsa.
Sorry about URL probs - I corrected it - anyhow I copied them for you in this posting:

Pix of Malaysian Golok is # 1 in: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/Indonesn.htm

Pix of Malaysian Parangs (but they are mistakenly referred as Goloks) are in: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/mg1.htm
http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/gn56.htm

Pix of Malaysian (Borneo part of Malaysia) Mandau is: http://www.liongate-armsandarmour.com/gn85.htm

Yvsa, Pakcik Bill.
When I was a small kid at my village, I used to go to the nearest small town during the weekend. Sometimes there were few handicraft sellers from Nepal - we call them Gorga (later on only I know that it is supposed to be pronunce as Gorkha). Items displayed by them are ring stones, antiquities and small knives. Sometimes they displayed what we called as Kukris (later on only I know that it is supposed to be pronunce as Khukuris) - I guessed about 12" to 15" OAL. I spent my time watching adults unsheating and handling those Khukuris - as a kid I was not allowed to even touch those Khukuris! I said to myself that one day I am going to own those beautiful and unique shaped knives - insyaa-Allaah!

Jan, 1999 - so many years after that episod - while surfing in the net - suddently I remembered about Khukuris - so I made a search thru Altavista using KUKRI as the keyword - then I saw CS Kukri! I think it is a little bit different version of Khukuri - I made another search thru Yahoo - then I saw Himalayan Import!! These are the knives that are in my memory all this time!!! I emailed Pakcik Bill and surprisingly I found out that I am dealing with a very nice and helpfull American ... the 1st, 2nd and 3rd return emailed from Pakcik Bill really impressed me ... this man must be the correct person (which I can trust) with the correct items (genuine Khukuri) that I am looking for ... Alhamdu-li-(A)llaah! When I received my 1st Khukuri - my Kashmiri friend told me "My friend - this is the real thing and the real good one - you have done a good buy!".

[This message has been edited by mohd (edited 19 October 1999).]
 
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