Max legal length

Joined
Oct 23, 1999
Messages
46
Couldn't find community area to post this, thought someone here might know max length concealed for fixed blade knife in Kalifornia and would it be different if non concealed but in sheath? I'm sure when there done banning all the guns, the knives, suv's , and fast food will be next.
 
Hiya Oberkommnetc.!
I'm not sure what the legal length is, but if you're looking for the COmmunity Forum, it's located at: http://www.bladeforums.com/cgi/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&forum=Community+Center&number=2&DaysPrune=5&LastLogin=
Happy Slicing!
VG
PS - Your post is probably appropriate here anyways.
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Vampire Gerbil: Nosferatus Rodentus Moderatus; similar to a domestic gerbil, except for the odd accent and little black cape.


 
Ober, there's a LOT of information already posted on the subject. I'll try and give a SHORT synopsis of STATE law:

There ARE NO LENGTH LIMITS.

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OK, here's the deal: in Penal Code 653k it lists what folders are legal. Balisongs and true springload switchblades are out, unless they're tiny little 1.9" or shorter critters. So are "gravity knives" which are ill-defined. The good news is, if it has a thumbhole, thumbstud or other opener attached to the blade it's 100% guaranteed LEGAL.

Other than the 1.9" thing on micro-switchblades, length isn't mentioned.

In Penal Code 12020 it says you cannot *conceal* a "readily available stabbing implement". There's also a note that a folder in the closed position that's legal under PC653k is NOT "readily available" per this. Fixed-blade knives with a stabbing tip therefore CANNOT be concealed and must be worn open-carry. One *example* of legal open carry is given, "openly suspended from the waist". It's NOT "exclusive" as most cops/DAs think, it's a "suggestion"; in the case of People vs. Terrence Terry, Richmond CA (Contra Costa County) 1998 a jury found that Terrence's totally-open-carry-on-ankle dagger was fine.

Again, there's no length limits either on legally concealed folders or legally open-carry fixed-blades. I regularly carry a 5.5" folder concealed (the REKAT Sifu) - at least until someone makes a good quality 7"+ megafolder
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Penal Code 646.10 covers carry of knives in K-12 schools and Universities, with somewhat different rules for each. Fixed-blades of 2.5" or greater are outlawed but the University rules still allow unlimited folders!

Finally, there's local ordinances in some cities. That I know of: LA, Glendale, Berkeley, San Francisco. Violations are *infractions* only; to me, if you're carrying a concealed folder it's not worth even worrying about, just don't alter your shoelaces or whatever with one in front of a cop. About your only risk is loss of the blade; enforcement tends to be spotty. In San Francisco it's used almost entirely as a homeless control measure, in Berkeley they're more serious. I avoid carrying expensive fixed-blades in Berkeley and I'm cautious about it in SF.

Note: some of these rules are new, as in less than 3 years old. Few cops understand them! It's worth understanding them in detail and then POLITELY explaining it to 'em if you get stopped. Worst case, ask to speak to a supervisor but DO NOT get pissed and don't piss 'em off.

All this may seem nuts, but the truth is Calif knife law is actually pretty damn good compared to almost all other states. Buck Knives helped lobby for the most important change, the one allowing concealed folders under PC12020 so when you're buying gift knives for non-knife-freak people at some point, remember Buck.

Jim March
 
Right! Everything I said applies to "street carry" versus collectors or whatever.

Jim
 
Thanks Jim, for thorough answer I know a buddy of mine with CPC book and will look it up, it's suprising that any law is lenient here, they've been busy here disarming the gun owners give them time.

As to "there are no length limits" that's what my wife says, hehehe.
 
Somebody had one other question about trying to sort out what the local ordinances in a given town might be. Short answer is, it ain't easy. The cops won't have a clue, any three will give different answers. The DAs are barely any better. City Attorneys are less pathetic than most sources if you can get one to talk to you.

You should also get a "feel for local attitudes". Theres no real way of predicting the attitudes of a given department ahead of time. SFPD is unpredictable really, Berkeley is almost completely mad-dog gonzo. Ask James Mattis about the SoCal scene. Your attitude and calm knowlege of STATE law will matter a lot; worst case, try and get a supervisor.

When dealing with a cop, let them take the knife, be polite and matter-of-fact about your goods being legal under state law. Don't even talk about local ordinances, there's a decent chance that if they're in effect the cops won't even know about 'em. If you're on public transit that crosses city lines or on a major road it would be pretty silly to try and apply the local ordinances to you anyways.

If you suspect there's local orninances in place, consider laying off the open-carry-fixed-blades. Go concealed folders. Local ordinances are only infractions, with a concealed megafolder you can just ignore the stinkers.

Jim
 
San Francisco has the "Municipal Police Code", and I couldn't locate any specific knife refernces, though here are some to keep in mind:
1291b MPC: loitering while carrying a concealed weapon.
602 MPC: Sale or possession of sling shots or airguns.

Both are infractions, and are rarely enforced, unless some sort of alercation or disturbance arises from them...but don't quote me as individual Officer's attitude vary...

For an excellent book on the subject, loacte "Peace Officers' Guide to California's Dangerous Weapons Law" (ISBN Number 0-9653621-0-8) by Lt. Rick Bruce, SFPD...It's a really great source, and Lt. Bruce taught at the Academy...

--dan
 
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