Maybe a silly question. Is char ok for carbon steel?

O

Omega Leather Works

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Jun 13, 2007
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Hey guys. I made a little wooden box for my hook carving knife.

IMAG1011_zpsa5c456f5.jpg


My question, and maybe it's dumb, but better safe than sorry, is... Is there anything in charred wood that can damage 1095 steel?

I like my box, but I love my knife!

As a side note, I didn't come up with the box idea. A kind member here pointed me in the right direction. I've been wringing my hands on how to take proper care of the knife, and I guess I still am... :p

Thanks for any advice!
 
If it's dry I don't see how it can.

It could however, scratch your blade, and maybe even dull it.
I don't know that from first-hand experience, but here's Carter demonstrating sharpening his pocket knife with charred wood.
[video=youtube;lV1-mSPt5Xw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV1-mSPt5Xw[/video]
I think Carter's steels are hardened to something like 61 rockwell hardness.
So if wood ash can sharpen Carter's knife, one might think that it could dull yours as well.
But then again you aren't deliberately rubbing your knife on your charred block.
I'd say go for it, and let us know. I'd be interested to know, at least.
 
char has slightly higher silicate than raw wood - depend on volume shrinkage %. Ash concentrate all wood silicate/volume in much smaller volume, thus more dulling affect on your blade.

Speculating ... Salt in char is low ppm so I wouldn't worry about rust. Otoh, wet ash (taste kindof salty) could has minor oxidization affect. Trees & plants usually has some sort of anti-freeze agent in them, oil/sap/salt/etc..
 
I'd just make sure the wood is DRY, as mentioned, and is stored in such a manner as to keep it dry. Might also be worth sealing or oiling the wood, just to minimize the chance of it absorbing moisture in the first place.

I tend not to like storing any blade in something that's in constant contact with the steel or the edge itself. Anything the wood holds onto (moisture, dirt, salts, acids) will be held against the blade and may create corrosion. Same sort of issues as with storing it long-term in a leather sheath, for example. And as mentioned, if the edge is in contact with the wood, dulling may be a possibility; especially with the charring. Keeping the blade dry and clean, with some space for air circulation around it, is how I'd prefer to store them, unless they'll be used very frequently and therefore watched and kept judiciously clean.


David
 
Good stuff guys. :thumbup:

I've just got back from Lowes, where I bought a pint of Danish Oil. I bought this stuff because they were out of boiled linseed, and it's food safe, which I need since I'll, obviously, be carving spoons and bowls.

The wood that I used is very dry. I can't remember what the company published as a bragging number, but it's supposed to be good stuff.

My concern was with the composition of the ash... Whether it has acid in it or not, that kind of thing, but dulling would be terrible. When I was making it, I thought about trying to line the bottom with cork or something. Maybe I'll carve out a larger channel and line the whole thing with something.

What would be best? Cork? Leather? Other?
 
How about lining it with paraffin wax or some similar product. If you enlarge the area so the blade is loose and line/seal with wax, then no leaching from the wood. You might carve out all the burnt part before lining it.

I know where you got the idea, and nothing was mentioned about any danger of damage to the blade. ??? I guess better safe than sorry.

Blessings,

Omar
 
Danish oil is good stuff. I used it to finish the walnut handle on one of my Opinels. Real easy to work with.

Whatever it's lined with, I'd choose something that doesn't hold moisture. Cork might be good for this, or a synthetic material like rubber/plastic. I'd still try to find a way to keep the blade free of any contact with it, so there's no chance of either dulling or corrosion being caused by it. I remember seeing a thread some time back (linked below), with pics of an old traditional folder that had some 'tells' about some of it's past. There was a specific spot of corrosion in the central portion of the cutting edge, and a small bit of wood (maybe a piece of matchstick) that had been inserted into the blade well, just over the 'hump' in the spring where the spring's anchor pin goes through it. A previous owner of the knife had no-doubt put the piece of wood in there to keep the cutting edge from contacting the backspring when closed (very common problem). The central portion of the blade edge had therefore been in continuous contact with the wood over a long period of time, and had become noticeably corroded. That's why I emphasize making sure nothing is contact with the edge, when stored.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/880104-Case-Slimline-Trapper


David
 
Or maybe felt... maybe felt backed by something like plastic wrap so that it has the quality of the barrier, but doesn't look like ass.

I've got the whole bed of the groove cleaned out now, I just need to get in there with my Dremel and widen, and clean it up.

I'm not too worried about it staying in there for extended periods, but then again that's often how things go. They get "put away" then forgotten about. I read a post by a guy who said that he put a (really expensive!) Busse away in wet leather and promptly forgot about the whole thing for a very long time... I guess anything is possible.

David, that Case is sweet. I'd love to come across something like that. I hope he decided to use it. :)
 
Felt can hold particles that can scratch the blade. I would consider just burnishing the wood and giving the blade a wipe with an oil cloth/gun cloth before putting it away.

-Xander
 
fast14riot said:
Felt can hold particles that can scratch the blade. I would consider just burnishing the wood and giving the blade a wipe with an oil cloth/gun cloth before putting it away.

-Xander
Click to expand...

Ahh! You guys are killin me... I *just* finalized commissioning a case for all of my carving knives, not 15 minutes ago, and spec'ed a felt interior. :(

Xander, you ever finish that knife? I'm in the same place with a couple of blades, and I haven't installed it yet, but I did rough carve a handle. Also working on a palm grip, but for that I'll buy the chisel, I don't want to make it.

Edit- also, I looked up burnishing and it looks like the definition is rubbing two pieces of wood together in order to create a natural finish that resists elements like an applied finish, which sounds awesome, especially because I LOVE the look and grain of bass, but I can't see how I'd get wood in there to polish against.

I've now cleaned out the channel of most of the ash... to the point that I'm no longer worried about its effect on the blade short term, but I'm still a tiny bit concerned about dulling, and long term storage.

Obviously it's looser in there, which I think is a good thing. I kind of wish that I made it so that the knife was stored edge up though.

Btw, this sandpaper that I got is amazing! It doesn't load AT ALL, has a tacky backing that sticks to itself (which is washable) and cuts like crazy, even at 220. By far the best garnit (I guess... The abrasive is synthetic) sandpaper I've ever used by a wide margin.
 
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I wouldn't worry if you are having a case for all your knives made, that will typically stay clean nd out of dirty areas. Just be sure to keep a soft cloth in the case for wiping down the blades before storing. Presentation type cases usually make the owner maintain the contents a bit better.

Burnishing doesn't have to be with a piece of wood, you can use a polished piece of steel, #0000 steel wool, basicaly any smooth hard surface will work. I've used newspaper to burnish wood before, also glass bottles. Get creative, find something harder than the wood or an extremely fine abrasive (newspaper) and rub it vigorously on the surface. You will see it begin to polish and smooth out.

I've been thinking about the handle for that sloyd knife most of today actually. I have a chunk of myrtle already drilled out for the tang, but I need to make a bolster for it. Got sidetracked with the jewelry making yesterday.


-Xander
 
fast14riot said:
I wouldn't worry if you are having a case for all your knives made, that will typically stay clean nd out of dirty areas. Just be sure to keep a soft cloth in the case for wiping down the blades before storing. Presentation type cases usually make the owner maintain the contents a bit better.

Burnishing doesn't have to be with a piece of wood, you can use a polished piece of steel, #0000 steel wool, basicaly any smooth hard surface will work. I've used newspaper to burnish wood before, also glass bottles. Get creative, find something harder than the wood or an extremely fine abrasive (newspaper) and rub it vigorously on the surface. You will see it begin to polish and smooth out.

I've been thinking about the handle for that sloyd knife most of today actually. I have a chunk of myrtle already drilled out for the tang, but I need to make a bolster for it. Got sidetracked with the jewelry making yesterday.


-Xander
Click to expand...

Thank you for the tips. I'm going to try exactly that. I did go ahead and oil the whole shebang, but burnishing can be done after oiling according to the bottle.

I'll post pics in the carving knife thread (in the projects forum) once I'm finally done. It's actually turning out quite lovely. I do have a couple of concerns, but since they are wood related I'll keep it to the other thread.

What do you mean by bolster? Are you pinning the blade between dowel halves? It's a lovely blade. I'm looking forward to seeing it finished, as I'm sure you are.

I've got to forget about the ring. Seeing it really makes me want to try my hand at it (I use to dabble in jewelry making) and I've already got too much on my plate! ;)
 
I guess I said bolster, but it is a hidden tang and it will be fitted like a guard but not have any protusions. Think of a pukko type handle. Maybe I'll make another sloyd knife like that, I have the perfect chunk of scrap 1084 sitting on my bench!

Anyways, I think you'll be surprised how nice a burnished finish can look.


-X
 
Forgive me if I'm seeing your photo wrong, but it looks like you've heated the bade to get it into the block. If so, wouldn't that kill the temper?
 
I think he used a hot wire for burning the shape in the block, but he can answer this better than me. He did a great job on fitting the blade to the box. Reminds me of my wood burning kit when I was a kid. After trying to "brand" the cat with it, my mother removed it from my possession. (also a little hide from my young butt :eek:)

Blessings,

Omar
 
1084 should make a fine knife I'd think. I've got a chunk of 1095 ,and I know how good a carving knife that makes, but I'm kind of tired of messing with steel. At least until I get an oven, if I ever do. The torches and "one brick" are meh ... At this point I'm more interested in making handles. I can buy great blades cheaply enough to not worry about it.

Post up in that Sloyd thread or make a new one once your done. Actually, some progression pics would be great too.

Ben, no I used a shish ka Bob (or however you spell it) skewer, which I heated with a torch, then formed into the shape of the blade. You can see it bent up in the cluttered pic. That poor thing... after getting it red hot several times it bends like tin.

I really should link to the guy that gave me the inspiration, but I don't have it handy. It was not my idea, other than a few little things like the dowel pivot, which works really well incidentally. Only bit of advice I would give if anyone plans to burn wood for depth is to clear out the char after each burn. It will prevent further burning from taking place if left alone.
 
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