I was looking thru a Tactical Knives mag from May 1998. It had an artical on H.I and I thought it would be interesting to read now that I am more familiar with you. What surprised me was the pic. of a 20" sirupati that looked just like the 17.5" visiting kami that I receaved awhile back. The ingraving on the spline was identical. Is this becouse they are made in the same place, or the same kami, or is it just a common design used among the differnt shops?
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Meaning of ingraving
- Thread starter Ice
- Start date
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- Feb 27, 1999
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- 543
Hi Ice,
This type of engraving (I assume that you are thinking of the "s" patterns with brass inlays along the "sword of shiva" next to the spine) is common throughout Nepal. It is traditional. If I remember correctly this topic was discussed in the not so distant past. I don't think anyone knows exactly where the pattern originated from or why it is the way it is. It just...is. If I am wrong in this I will be corrected shortly by forumites (or Bill) who are far more knowlegable than I. Hope this helps.
Mike
This type of engraving (I assume that you are thinking of the "s" patterns with brass inlays along the "sword of shiva" next to the spine) is common throughout Nepal. It is traditional. If I remember correctly this topic was discussed in the not so distant past. I don't think anyone knows exactly where the pattern originated from or why it is the way it is. It just...is. If I am wrong in this I will be corrected shortly by forumites (or Bill) who are far more knowlegable than I. Hope this helps.
Mike
- Joined
- Mar 5, 1999
- Messages
- 34,096
It is a very common design. Even village kamis will use it on some of the khukuris they make -- especially if the are intending to bring the khukuris to the HI shop for possible sale.
The author of that article, Leroy Thompson, is about as tough on knives as Cliff and he doesn't pull any punches.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
[This message has been edited by Bill Martino (edited 01 November 1999).]
The author of that article, Leroy Thompson, is about as tough on knives as Cliff and he doesn't pull any punches.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
[This message has been edited by Bill Martino (edited 01 November 1999).]
- Joined
- Mar 8, 1999
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- 8,911
If I remember the thread you are talking about, Uncle Bill asked Pala what the style of engraving and brass inlay on the spine was and Pala replied "khukuri". At least it's still remembered that it represents the sword of Shiva.
Again my usual rant about preserving what little knowlege is left before it disappears. Thanks again Howard for what you're doing with the FAQ's.
Some of the kamis sound like the nonogenarian friend I lost about half a year ago. Such a wonderful sweet loving old man, and at the same time, what a cantankerous stubborn old goat. He claimed his dad was a young wannabe hanger on around the fringes of the James Gang, and remembered at about age 5 or 6 hiding behind the door while his dad and Frank James ( having served his time in prison ) visited and talked about the old days. Said he had letters from his sis about that. I never saw them, but who knows? He didn't seem to be any more confused than the rest of us. The old guy was pretty honest.
Again my usual rant about preserving what little knowlege is left before it disappears. Thanks again Howard for what you're doing with the FAQ's.
Some of the kamis sound like the nonogenarian friend I lost about half a year ago. Such a wonderful sweet loving old man, and at the same time, what a cantankerous stubborn old goat. He claimed his dad was a young wannabe hanger on around the fringes of the James Gang, and remembered at about age 5 or 6 hiding behind the door while his dad and Frank James ( having served his time in prison ) visited and talked about the old days. Said he had letters from his sis about that. I never saw them, but who knows? He didn't seem to be any more confused than the rest of us. The old guy was pretty honest.
Thank you for the info. I feel silly asking questions all the time but I want to know every thing I can about the khukuri espeally any I own .Not only becouse when someone asks me somthing about it I hate to say" I don't know" but becouse I want to keep the knowledge alive and pass it on to my kids or anyone whos interested, and proubly afew who are not interested but I tell them anyway. This forum is the best place I've found to get the info I crave. I also want to mention that I believe that due to H.I. and Uncle Bill that the art of the kami is not only staying alive but is growing in their indever to better their quality. This not only helps the kamis to live a better life but renews the skills and craftsmanship that may have declined in times to come if not for this market they created. I'm sure the kamis working for H.I will continue to create better khukuri and will pass on this skill to new kamis to come.
- Joined
- Mar 5, 1999
- Messages
- 34,096
Ice, thankfully it is looking just that way. For years I thought it was all going to be lost and all that would be left were khukuris for the tourist market. Shop 2 is turning that around. I believe we will be expanding taking on more masters and more youngsters. It is a very beneficial combination for both. The masters are old and do not have the strength of the young. But they share their knowledge and the young share their strength and learn. I now have more hope than I ever have had.
But, I need to get a replacement for myself. Time is running out for me.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
But, I need to get a replacement for myself. Time is running out for me.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
Jim March
Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
- Joined
- Oct 7, 1998
- Messages
- 3,022
Now Bill, you're not THAT bad off
.
Actually, I don't think that's as big a concern as you think. I think if Pala and Gelbu manage to grow Shop2 or open similar types of operations, about the point where you double Nepalese employees and output you'll have the resources to set up and staff a genuine US distribution arm in a small office or whatever. Worst case, triple the Nepalese side and you can do it. At that point you could do "nothing but PR" and that only part-time, you'd have somebody else doing order tracking plus a shipping person. That assumes they can maintain a good average per-blade value, and that's NOT a problem. Neither is getting more kamis, not at an average of five applicants a day!
All: you guys need to realize that Gelbu is Pala's understudy as a business manager over in Nepal. While Pala is here in the US Gelbu is acting in his place and quite competently, freeing up the Royal Kami (why can't I recall his name, durnit?) to oversee actual craftsmanship as shop foreman.
In other words, the whole thing is real close to being what normally looks like in the US a long-term stable business. To me, that's just awesome news. I think if Bill and Yangdu can hang in there for another year, two at most, he'll be able to almost completely retire except to remain in PR, which if I know Bill is what he considers the fun part!
Jim
Actually, I don't think that's as big a concern as you think. I think if Pala and Gelbu manage to grow Shop2 or open similar types of operations, about the point where you double Nepalese employees and output you'll have the resources to set up and staff a genuine US distribution arm in a small office or whatever. Worst case, triple the Nepalese side and you can do it. At that point you could do "nothing but PR" and that only part-time, you'd have somebody else doing order tracking plus a shipping person. That assumes they can maintain a good average per-blade value, and that's NOT a problem. Neither is getting more kamis, not at an average of five applicants a day!
All: you guys need to realize that Gelbu is Pala's understudy as a business manager over in Nepal. While Pala is here in the US Gelbu is acting in his place and quite competently, freeing up the Royal Kami (why can't I recall his name, durnit?) to oversee actual craftsmanship as shop foreman.
In other words, the whole thing is real close to being what normally looks like in the US a long-term stable business. To me, that's just awesome news. I think if Bill and Yangdu can hang in there for another year, two at most, he'll be able to almost completely retire except to remain in PR, which if I know Bill is what he considers the fun part!
Jim
- Joined
- Mar 8, 1999
- Messages
- 8,911
Another good reason to ask questions over and over is that Bill and Pala don't always come up with the same answers. Sometimes they remember stuff they'd forgotten earlier. Or that they might have known all of before, but never stopped to put together in the same place.
- Joined
- Mar 5, 1999
- Messages
- 34,096
Thanks for very kind words, advice, forecasts, etc. It's an adventure and we will see where it all takes us.
My problem here is Yangdu hates the computer. And, so does Pala but he is not a prime candidate for a replacement for me. After two days sitting here watching the monitor and answering questions and listening to me try to translate he said, "I'm tired of that screen," and went off to repair handles.
Gelbu just bought a computer a couple of days ago and he can use it with some success. His English is not perfect but he is maybe 75 or 80 percent. He is the guy I have my eyes on for my backup and replacement. He is a hard worker, knows enough to listen to those who REALLY know (like Bura -- that's the name you were trying to think of, Jim)learned honesty and integrity from Pala so I think me might just do okay. And he has developed a very good knowledge of khukuris.
As I said, we'll see where it all takes us.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
My problem here is Yangdu hates the computer. And, so does Pala but he is not a prime candidate for a replacement for me. After two days sitting here watching the monitor and answering questions and listening to me try to translate he said, "I'm tired of that screen," and went off to repair handles.
Gelbu just bought a computer a couple of days ago and he can use it with some success. His English is not perfect but he is maybe 75 or 80 percent. He is the guy I have my eyes on for my backup and replacement. He is a hard worker, knows enough to listen to those who REALLY know (like Bura -- that's the name you were trying to think of, Jim)learned honesty and integrity from Pala so I think me might just do okay. And he has developed a very good knowledge of khukuris.
As I said, we'll see where it all takes us.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
- Joined
- May 18, 1999
- Messages
- 15,395
:
Ice what you are doing is very commendable.You certainly aren't alone in wanting to learn about the Khukuris.
It seems like when I first found the bladeforums.com and then Himalayan Imports,that for every question I had answered I had ten more to take it's place.
I still ask a lot of questions.
I am getting close to 60 years old and I spent 35 years in a machine shop around steel and other metals and cutting it in some form or the other.
I had done like most guys and made some knives.And like most guys my first attempts were very pitiful indeed.These were done when I was about 16.
When I was 19 I made some out of some old car springs that were pretty decent.I would compare them to some of the village models that has come through here once in a while.The blades weren't really highly polished or anything like that.One thing is that they were Big Knives.I sure wish now that I would've somehow kept one of them.
Along about 1973-4 a friend of mine brought the "Gun Digest Book of Knives" to work with him.This was the first time I had ever been introduced to anything like what I saw in those pages.I don't remember what it took to talk him out of that book.I still have it and wouldn't part with it for anything,(almost.)
I had some experience under my belt by then and I decided to "make" me a knife using the "Stock Removal" method all new terms to me then.
I got a piece of O-1 tool steel,it was "The Steel" of that era and proceeded to work on "my knife."
I spent countless hours poring over designs and pix I had drawn.I didn't know the 1st.thing about doing any of this in spite of having made some knives before.I didn't want to copy anyone elses knife and what I wound up doing was Takeing some design tips from a man they called "Zack" for the handle and a blade style from someone else and created a knife that was uniquely mine and mine alone.
I still think "Zack" made some of the prettiest handles in the trade,then and now.
It is one tough and heavy knife for a combo hunter & fighter.I used 1/4" steel.The blade is also much wider than needed and was flat ground but not all the way to the spine.It may be what is called saber ground even.I am still learning more than I ever thought I could know about knives ( and other things
)
I know now and have for many years that the knife wasn't really
"that good" for either purpose.
I had put a "gut hook" on the back of the blade.
Anyway...I made it and I am still proud of it.The fit and finish was impeccable.I used nice brass and good Okahoma Black Walnut for the handles.Good steel properly heat treated ( about 59 - 60 Rc) at a local shop that done only that.It was right across the street and they put it in with some other things one day and it didn't cost me anything to have it done.
It is like a Khukuri in the fact that it is tough,overbuilt and beautiful at least to me and my family and to many other people who have admired it.I gave it to my son.
He has promised to take some pictures of it.I may have to go borrow it back until I change forms one day.
I may even do a knowledgeable test with it.I am kinda curious myself knowing it's "faults."
Maybe if I do that Uncle will be good enough to post a pic of it here if I send him a photo.
The reason for all this? I don't really know.I felt like talking for one thing I guess.Nothing new about that.
Making "my knife" and the 23 hours thereabouts that I put into accomplishing that task was some of the best 23 hours I have ever spent in my life.
The other is to tell you to keep asking questions until you are satisfied you have the answers and to not feel bad about it.
Being on these forums will teach anyone things they might not even know they have learned.And best of all......They are good things!!!
Good to have you here!!
------------------
>>>>---¥vsa---->®
If you mix milk of magnesia with vodka and orange juice do you get a phillips screwdriver?
Khukuri FAQ
Ice what you are doing is very commendable.You certainly aren't alone in wanting to learn about the Khukuris.
It seems like when I first found the bladeforums.com and then Himalayan Imports,that for every question I had answered I had ten more to take it's place.
I still ask a lot of questions.
I am getting close to 60 years old and I spent 35 years in a machine shop around steel and other metals and cutting it in some form or the other.
I had done like most guys and made some knives.And like most guys my first attempts were very pitiful indeed.These were done when I was about 16.
When I was 19 I made some out of some old car springs that were pretty decent.I would compare them to some of the village models that has come through here once in a while.The blades weren't really highly polished or anything like that.One thing is that they were Big Knives.I sure wish now that I would've somehow kept one of them.
Along about 1973-4 a friend of mine brought the "Gun Digest Book of Knives" to work with him.This was the first time I had ever been introduced to anything like what I saw in those pages.I don't remember what it took to talk him out of that book.I still have it and wouldn't part with it for anything,(almost.)
I had some experience under my belt by then and I decided to "make" me a knife using the "Stock Removal" method all new terms to me then.
I got a piece of O-1 tool steel,it was "The Steel" of that era and proceeded to work on "my knife."
I spent countless hours poring over designs and pix I had drawn.I didn't know the 1st.thing about doing any of this in spite of having made some knives before.I didn't want to copy anyone elses knife and what I wound up doing was Takeing some design tips from a man they called "Zack" for the handle and a blade style from someone else and created a knife that was uniquely mine and mine alone.
I still think "Zack" made some of the prettiest handles in the trade,then and now.
It is one tough and heavy knife for a combo hunter & fighter.I used 1/4" steel.The blade is also much wider than needed and was flat ground but not all the way to the spine.It may be what is called saber ground even.I am still learning more than I ever thought I could know about knives ( and other things
I know now and have for many years that the knife wasn't really
"that good" for either purpose.
I had put a "gut hook" on the back of the blade.
Anyway...I made it and I am still proud of it.The fit and finish was impeccable.I used nice brass and good Okahoma Black Walnut for the handles.Good steel properly heat treated ( about 59 - 60 Rc) at a local shop that done only that.It was right across the street and they put it in with some other things one day and it didn't cost me anything to have it done.
It is like a Khukuri in the fact that it is tough,overbuilt and beautiful at least to me and my family and to many other people who have admired it.I gave it to my son.
He has promised to take some pictures of it.I may have to go borrow it back until I change forms one day.
I may even do a knowledgeable test with it.I am kinda curious myself knowing it's "faults."
Maybe if I do that Uncle will be good enough to post a pic of it here if I send him a photo.
The reason for all this? I don't really know.I felt like talking for one thing I guess.Nothing new about that.
Making "my knife" and the 23 hours thereabouts that I put into accomplishing that task was some of the best 23 hours I have ever spent in my life.
The other is to tell you to keep asking questions until you are satisfied you have the answers and to not feel bad about it.
Being on these forums will teach anyone things they might not even know they have learned.And best of all......They are good things!!!
Good to have you here!!
------------------
>>>>---¥vsa---->®
If you mix milk of magnesia with vodka and orange juice do you get a phillips screwdriver?
Khukuri FAQ
- Joined
- Mar 8, 1999
- Messages
- 8,911
Must have been at least 4 years ago, I sent off and Uncle Bill sent me some pictures. If I had known then, I'd now own a couple of khanjarlis.
I found the HI forum on Knifeforums late February, early March. I went back to day one of the HI forum there and spent an entire week reading one topic and then the next til I got all the way up to date, and then I started posting with questions. Even after reading every topic! I think they had between 3500 and 3900 posts when HI moved over here, and so did most of it's followers. KF closed down their HI forum when noone came over anymore. If it took me a week back then when the KF HI forum had 1/3rd of what BladeForum has now..... it would take me a month of reading most of the day to do it 8 months later. The Spyderco Forum is the only one of the manufacturers forums with more, and they have under 14,000. HI got 10,000 in 8 months.
Oh well, I forgot what the topic was, so maybe I'd better shut up.
I found the HI forum on Knifeforums late February, early March. I went back to day one of the HI forum there and spent an entire week reading one topic and then the next til I got all the way up to date, and then I started posting with questions. Even after reading every topic! I think they had between 3500 and 3900 posts when HI moved over here, and so did most of it's followers. KF closed down their HI forum when noone came over anymore. If it took me a week back then when the KF HI forum had 1/3rd of what BladeForum has now..... it would take me a month of reading most of the day to do it 8 months later. The Spyderco Forum is the only one of the manufacturers forums with more, and they have under 14,000. HI got 10,000 in 8 months.
Oh well, I forgot what the topic was, so maybe I'd better shut up.
Jim March
Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
- Joined
- Oct 7, 1998
- Messages
- 3,022
Bill brings up a good point: if Gelbu spends enough time on the net over the next couple of years he may indeed be ready to handle the customer service/PR side of things, and with the Internet that could be handled in large part from Nepal. However, Bill is doing a lot of that work over the phone too, and if I understand correctly, reliable phone service in Nepal is iffy?
I dunno. I think you'll need to manage customer service out of North America for the forseeable future. If that means Gelbu comes here one day, great. Gotta find a good manager in Nepal then. See, that's the thing: they'll need at least 2 good managers at any one time, one in each country...plus an understudy in each, if possible. Unless things in Nepal get a lot more modern...?
Jim
I dunno. I think you'll need to manage customer service out of North America for the forseeable future. If that means Gelbu comes here one day, great. Gotta find a good manager in Nepal then. See, that's the thing: they'll need at least 2 good managers at any one time, one in each country...plus an understudy in each, if possible. Unless things in Nepal get a lot more modern...?
Jim
- Joined
- Mar 5, 1999
- Messages
- 34,096
When I received Yvsa's wood prototype of the AK Bowie it showed the marks of a man who had made knives before -- in steel.
Yvsa, Pala still wants to hire you.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html
Yvsa, Pala still wants to hire you.
------------------
Uncle Bill
Himalayan Imports Website
http://members.aol.com/himimp/index.html