Micarta damage

[mrkurtz]

I just got an RD6 and the finish was scraped off some of the handle screws. I put some Break Free CLP on them so they wouldn't rust. The surrounding micarta that got CLP on it darkened tremendously. So I just put a light coating of CLP on the rest of the grips so they look uniform. Actually it looks great. I know micarta is tough stuff, but does anyone know specifically if CLP will cause any breakdown? Or can oils track along canvas fibers and cause them to swell?

 

[Cougar Allen]

 

[Nimravus Nut]

Micarta do have a tendency to absorb oil or petroleum based liquid. Although oil is a slow moving liquid, it does not evaporate at room temperature, so slowly it will swell up the surface of the micarta. Micarta will even absorb water, but it is quickly evaporated. Just don't let it come in contact with solvents like gasoline, kerosene, acetone, etc.

 

[Ilovetoolsteel]

Micarta do have a tendency to absorb oil or petroleum based liquid. Although oil is a slow moving liquid, it does not evaporate at room temperature, so slowly it will swell up the surface of the micarta. Micarta will even absorb water, but it is quickly evaporated. Just don't let it come in contact with solvents like gasoline, kerosene, acetone, etc.

I use acetone to clean micarta when I glue up handles. It does nothing to micarta.

I glue the slabs together with super glue so I can sand a perfect 90 degree angle where the guard meets the face of the handle material. I then seperate the slabs and I use acetone to remove the the super glue residue. Before I found out you could clean up epoxy with alcohol I used to use acetone to clean up the epoxy that aqueezes out when you clamp up a handle. Trust me it doesn't harm micarta.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

I have soaked them in gasoline for fifteen minutes and lit them on fire, it won't sustain a flame. I did this years ago because Kevin McClung claimed it would destroy Micarta grips but not his G10. All it did to the ones I used it on was warm them up. There are different types though and maybe if you soak them for hours it induces significant penetration. I have also did the same to Hytrel (Gerber). I even smeared them down with vasoline after soaking them in lighter fluid and then spraying more lighter fluid on them and lighting them. Hytrel won't wick the vasoline, it just melts and the flame goes out in seconds. It is hard to actually take a picture of it on fire it goes out that fast.

-Cliff

 

[STR]

I've never had any issues with Micarta soaking up oils or anything else. In fact just the opposite. It seems to me to repel these things and be immune to body oils, lubes, water, cracking, splitting, chipping, swelling and any of the ill effects often seen with wood. I think that is why it is preferred to other materials actually when it comes to knife handles. On some that I've made and put oil or miltec in the pivots it was always still there later when I tore them apart so I can't say I've seen evidence of it absorbing it there.

When bead blasted it does change appearance from body oils and moisture when handled but it is temporary and will go back to the way it was after it drys. When bead blasted it does seem to absorb more though because you have created openings or pores in the material but I don't think it goes in any deeper than the blaster went down when it was blasted. That has been the case for all I've used anyway. The bead blasted micarta does give the appearance of absorbing so I can see why some would say it soaks in liguids if its been blasted.

I've used both acetone and gasoline to clean sticky gunk off of what I was getting ready to use for a handle scale with no ill effects.

STR

 

[Cliff Stamp]

STR, do you have a small scrap piece you could leave in the solvent overnight and see if anything significant happens.

-Cliff

 

[STR]

That is so funny that you said that because I already stuck one in a cup of acetone about a half hour ago. LOL. I guess sometimes we do think alike. Thats a scary thought huh?

STR

 

[mrkurtz]

Thanks for the responses. You guys are an amazing repository of knowledge. But given all the bizarre things you've already done, for no particular reason, you may also be insane. So thanks again, I appreciate it.

 

[Phil Brown]

FWIW, CLP temporarily darkens just about anything. It readily soaks into metal, porous or not, so I'm sure the same thing happens with micarta. Worst case scenario, the CLP will form a film of the surface (as it is designed to) and make it slippery.

 

[IUKE12]

I did the same thing with my Tak-1 micarta handles. I removed the oil stains applying the same method I use for cleaning Sharpmaker stones, Comet or similar with a green scouring pad. Good as new.

 

[STR]

The results of the soak tests are in.

I soaked five scraps of ivory, antique linier paper, turquoise, green, black and natural canvas and red linen micarta in acetone submerged and another five scraps in gasoline submerged overnight.

After 24 hours soaking in both solvents all the scraps are unaffected. They are not changed in anyway that I can tell and cannot be distinquished between the ones that were not soaked. In less than a minute in the sun they dried out completely and only a very faint odor can be detected on either of them which is the only way to determine which they were soaked in. The odor is gone now after cleaning with dishwashing liquid and water though.

STR

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Can you see if a small scrap would ignite and burn after a similar soaking. Kevin McClung claimed that Micarta was not suitable for tactical knives because it would absorb gasoline and other flammable materials and thus unlike G10 it could sustain a continued burn.

-Cliff

 

[STR]

I threw the pieces that soaked overnight back into the gasoline and left them soak for another hour or so. My tests do not get anywhere near the same results as Kevin's. Sounds like he is promoting G10 to me but then again maybe he used a different Micarta. I've tested what I have in stock by soaking it and trying to ignite it. What I have is this and scraps of all the following were thrown in for the ignition test. Most was used for the overnight tests as well.

Maroon canvas
Green canvas
black canvas
natural canvas

Red linen
natural linen

ivory paper
antique linier paper

Scraps of each were soaked in gasoline and none of them light up for any longer than it takes the gasoline to burn off, which is seconds. This doesn't even appear to hurt the micarta because it barely burn marks it if at all.

From the results I've seen I would have to reach the following conclusions:

Micarta does not absorb anything and remains structurually sound even after 24 hours of soaking in acetone or gasoline. Neither of which has any affect on it in anyway. Appearance, shape, length width are all unaffected by the soak.

I would also conclude that Micarta is not flamable at all.

I'll add that upon removing the scraps from the gasoline I left them sit in the sun for ten minutes in a separate test and came back to try to light it then. These did not ignite at all, nor did they smell of gasoline after it evaporated.

I see no reason at all to keep one from using Micarta on any tactical folder or fixed blade. In fact it seems to be a fine choice to me.

STR.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Scraps of each were soaked in gasoline and none of them light up for any longer than it takes the gasoline to burn off, which is seconds. This doesn't even appear to hurt the micarta because it barely burn marks it if at all.

Thanks, I found the exact same thing. On handles I could even pick them up and use them immediately, they were warm is all.

-Cliff

 

[IUKE12]

Interesting test results STR, thanks for taking the time to perform them. So I guess we can conclude that Micarta seems to be impervious to heat, I wonder how G10 stacks up. Would it continue to burn after the gasoline or other flammable liquid is consumed?

 

[STR]

Both Micarta and G10 are phenolics so I doubt either of them will absorb anything liquid. You can melt Micarta if you hold the flame on it long enough and you can probably melt or deform G10 with enough heat also. They are a similar material but G10 is probably a bit more rigid. I think the primary reason many prefer G10 is unrelated to strength issues when compared to Micarta because both are pretty good for strength. Its more because there are a wider variety of colors out there for G10 and the colors are more trendy than the ones found in Micarta which are more subdued and natural looking as opposed to the bright colors found for G10. You can just check the inventory of a place like Sheffield supply and see the greater variance available in G10 for color and I think when you are trying to appeal to the larger new generation coming into knives you want bright trendy colors and not sudued 'old folky' color from yesteryear. Just my guess there because there is nothing at all wrong with Micarta when it comes to rigidity, compressive or tear strength or any other factor when considering it for a knife handle.

STR

 

[STR]

Last post on the 14th indicated there was no way Micarta absorbed anything let alone become flamable.

This time I soaked some scrap pieces I had in gasoline from the 14th to today (the 26th of June 06) just to see if the results would be different. To be specific the pieces soaked were one scrap of turquoise canvas Micarata, one piece of red linen Micarta and one piece of antique linier paper Micarta.

The results were exactly the same as last time. Each piece caught fire and burned until the gasoline was gone and then the fire went out. Total time of the burn was no different than before and there was virtually no damage to any of the scraps.

It seems to me that some of the claims made are based on guess work. Its a well known fact that canvas and linen micarta as well as others become grippier when wet. Its been said that its because the canvas and linen absorb the moisture and swell a bit which makes the material more grippy. I do not agree with this theory at all. The test results here seem to indicate to me that something else is going on. If the canvas and linen absorbed anything they would certainly show the effects once soaked in gasoline for this long. And if they did have gas in them surely they would be affected by the burn off and they are not.

STR

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Thanks for the details, i was curious if there was a difference among the various types.

-Cliff

 

[Blue Sky]

Thanks for the responses. You guys are an amazing repository of knowledge. But given all the bizarre things you've already done, for no particular reason, you may also be insane. So thanks again, I appreciate it.

Look out, I think he's on to you.