Military Issue Knife Question

chevyrulez1

chevyrulez1

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I have always been interested in military history, militaria, and knives (of course) so I have a real interest in pocket knives used in the military. I have done hours of searching and reading up on forums but feel that solid info on this subject is lacking.
There are lots of companies who claim to be suppliers to the US Military, and some have models with NSN numbers assigned, but is there any solid data on whether or not any of these have actually been purchased by the military, and if so when?
I have several that come to mind, like the Colonial Knife and Tool items, some of the Benchmade and Gerber items. For example, the Gerber EZ out Junior has a NSN number assigned, but has the government actually ever bought these, or have they ever actually been used or issued? Talking to Vets I know, the only thing they were issued besides bayonets and such were Gerber multitools, and that is consistent with what I am seeing from folks online. I have heard most guys and gals carried whatever they purchased themselves. Is there any way to search awarded contracts and see what has actually been ordered? I am especially curious about Colonial, who claims to be the current supplier of Demo knives, TL29's, and paratrooper knives, but nobody seems to know where these are made or if they have actually sold anything to the military in the last 20 years. Call me curious but I would welcome any insight that others might have.
 
A NSN simply means that a unit can order that product through the national stock system. Everything from uniforms to vehicle parts to watches and knives has a NSN, but it's up to the unit, their needs and their budget to order those items. The big thing is the budget. Most units will use their budget on necessary stuff, and they'll treat knives as personally procured gear. I know of some people who have gotten Benchmades "issued" by their supply guys. More often than not, you'll see people in units pool personal money to buy a special knife or something like that, which can be done through the stock system, or just coordinated with the manufacturer.

Personal experience: during flight training, all the survival vests had Spyderco Pacific Salt Knives in them. These were dummy corded to the vests, and during training we didn't have our own vests, we just checked one out, did our flight and turned it back in. Outside of training, the vests have the standard Ontario ASEK.
 
I've no direct experience re US but have some UK experience. Just do a search for "Knife companies with US army contracts" I did and came up with quite a lot of info.
 
Take any of it with a grain of salt. If a manufacturer sells a knife to even one person in the military, who buys it with their own money, they can claim they make knives for the military. Units can have their supply sergeants buy whatever they want for their specific mission. Gerber multi tools were issued to everyone when I was in, over and over again. Other units had benchmade autos.. it all just depends.

In my opinion it’s just a marketing gimmick and unit leadership could change assigned equipment whenever they want. Meaning just because a seal platoon issued all their guys a rust proof fixed blade, doesn’t mean they all carry it. Knives are usually left up to the discretion of the individual, and not inspectable equipment.. although it CAN be, I haven’t seen it. I’ve seen guys carry Emerson’s, seen green berets with CRKTs.. seen some guys that don’t carry anything but a multi tool.. it varies.
 
I've had a quick look for you for what it matters Bear and Son Cutlery have a US DoD contract, a little searching online will no doubt give you more. But as others who've served are suggesting it's pretty open as to knife brands.

I was a senior manager in large UK public corporation and procurement was in the UK down to meeting basic spec and price. Didn't often mean you got the best service or product.

Camillus used to make folders for the US military that I know but I'm sure it's down to probably what's cheapest for the "grunts" although the more specialised divisions will have a better knife/tool issued I'm sure.

I've a similar interest but in UK military as that's where I'm from where a SAK is common, cheap but fortunately of decent quality.
 
King of the Cheese said:
Take any of it with a grain of salt. If a manufacturer sells a knife to even one person in the military, who buys it with their own money, they can claim they make knives for the military. Units can have their supply sergeants buy whatever they want for their specific mission. Gerber multi tools were issued to everyone when I was in, over and over again. Other units had benchmade autos.. it all just depends. In my opinion it’s just a marketing gimmick and unit leadership could change assigned equipment whenever they want. Meaning just because a seal platoon issued all their guys a rust proof fixed blade, doesn’t mean they all carry it. Knives are usually left up to the discretion of the individual, and not inspectable equipment.. although it CAN be, I haven’t seen it.
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This is what I am seeing and it makes me seriously wonder about the information that is flying around with companies claiming their stuff is "genuine us military issue"
Supposedly Victorinox started making a new US soldier knife a few years ago, and it is marketed as a genuine US Military knife with an NSN assigned, but from some online discussions I have seen there is a lot of questions concerning the legitimacy of these claims, with Victorinox saying they didn't make it, etc.
Colonial is still selling stuff on their website, most of which is out of stock everywhere else, supposedly US made and "current military issue" but no one knows exactly where or when it was made. Googling their address, it doesn't look like they are even there anymore. I thought there must be a way through public access records to verify some of these claims. After all, knife and multitool orders aren't exactly top secret info or a national security threat.
 
You've got me going now🤓 Spartan blades also has a current contract and make folders??? Although the price of their knives I'm guessing would mean limited supply for specific more "elite" divisions.

Also you can watch YouTube such as "Tactical Hyve" (Ex navy seal) and similar and reading the comments you'll get lots of first hand info from serving and ex serving personnel.
 
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During my 29 years on active duty as a US Army Infantryman, I can tell you that the only time you get pocket knives or multi-tools issued is during a Real World deployment preparations.
Gerber, Benchmade, and SOG are the prevalent brands. They must have been made in the USA.
Automatic knives are issued as well. Most of the time you’re not required to turn them back into your Supply Room after the deployment.
 
About half of these are military issues

view


Camillus document.
90025624-19C1-42DD-AED8-4B8AAD727B53.jpeg
 
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Have you looked at a Ontario OKC 3s. It's kind of a bayonet but also it could be used as a knife. As of this writing the United States Marine Corps trains its recruits at Parris Island with these. I'm not a Marine but my son is and he told me this. They practice by stabbing tires with it. Affixed to their rifle. But that's in boot camp I can't say what they use for deployment. I bought him one as a present. However the idea of collecting military knives seems very interesting
 
Vlade said:
Have you looked at a Ontario OKC 3s. It's kind of a bayonet but also it could be used as a knife. As of this writing the United States Marine Corps trains its recruits at Parris Island with these. I'm not a Marine but my son is and he told me this. They practice by stabbing tires with it. Affixed to their rifle. But that's in boot camp I can't say what they use for deployment. I bought him one as a present. However the idea of collecting military knives seems very interesting
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I am familiar with most of the fixed blades, I own the Ontario 498 and 499, and have really considered the OKC 3s but haven't pulled the trigger yet.
 
chevyrulez1 said:
I have always been interested in military history, militaria, and knives (of course) so I have a real interest in pocket knives used in the military. I have done hours of searching and reading up on forums but feel that solid info on this subject is lacking.
There are lots of companies who claim to be suppliers to the US Military, and some have models with NSN numbers assigned, but is there any solid data on whether or not any of these have actually been purchased by the military, and if so when?
I have several that come to mind, like the Colonial Knife and Tool items, some of the Benchmade and Gerber items. For example, the Gerber EZ out Junior has a NSN number assigned, but has the government actually ever bought these, or have they ever actually been used or issued? Talking to Vets I know, the only thing they were issued besides bayonets and such were Gerber multitools, and that is consistent with what I am seeing from folks online. I have heard most guys and gals carried whatever they purchased themselves. Is there any way to search awarded contracts and see what has actually been ordered? I am especially curious about Colonial, who claims to be the current supplier of Demo knives, TL29's, and paratrooper knives, but nobody seems to know where these are made or if they have actually sold anything to the military in the last 20 years. Call me curious but I would welcome any insight that others might have.
Click to expand...

This is a knife topic that I've been interested in for many years. There are lots of useful references out there, including many books, scads of old magazine articles, and government Web sites. But there's also plenty of anecdotal, misleading, and outright false information, especially online.

You can look up a company's CAGE code to verify whether the government assigned it one as an official supplier. You can also look up a knife's NSN and find out how many were procured, by which branches, and at what prices (be prepared to cry as a taxpayer!). While procurement numbers don't necessarily equate to quantities issued, one presumes that the knives weren't purchased just to sit on shelves (depending, of course, on the attitudes of individual unit commanders and supply NCOs).

In my research, I've found that most major U.S. knife companies have held military purchase contracts at one time or another. Some have advertised it more than others. Not every purchase was made through the official procurement process, even some bulk orders. Records for those, if available at all, will be hard to come by.


-Steve
 
The Whip said:
This is a knife topic that I've been interested in for many years. There are lots of useful references out there, including many books, scads of old magazine articles, and government Web sites. But there's also plenty of anecdotal, misleading, and outright false information, especially online.

You can look up a company's CAGE code to verify whether the government assigned it one as an official supplier. You can also look up a knife's NSN and find out how many were procured, by which branches, and at what prices (be prepared to cry as a taxpayer!). While procurement numbers don't necessarily equate to quantities issued, one presumes that the knives weren't purchased just to sit on shelves (depending, of course, on the attitudes of individual unit commanders and supply NCOs).

In my research, I've found that most major U.S. knife companies have held military purchase contracts at one time or another. Some have advertised it more than others. Not every purchase was made through the official procurement process, even some bulk orders. Records for those, if available at all, will be hard to come by.


-Steve
Click to expand...
What website or resource do you use to see quantities ordered and by whom?
 
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