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Military lock ratings
- Thread starter hardheart
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I didn't check the links, but from memory it is rated 150 lbs. per inch of blade, or heavy duty (I think it is called heave duty in that range). The old MBC rating (is it called Very Heavy Duty or Hard use now I think) is over 200 lbs. per inch of blade length with the weight applied 1" from the pivot. It will be nteresting to see if the Titanium Millie makes it into the highest rating, as I thought I remembered reading that most framelocks would fail at the thinned cutout area and that they couldn't reach the MBC rating for the most part.
Mike
Mike
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I thought I had read something similar Mike, about liner and frame locks not being able to hit MBC rating, but I really can't accurately recall. Spyderco is the only company I know of with a rating system and publicly released numbers, plus the Military is considered one of the better engineered liner locks - so I thought I'd ask after some questions came to mind from some recent threads in General.
Sal Glesser
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Hi Hardheart,
Our Military (Walker) linerlock has been running in the "Heavy Duty" or over 100 inch/lbs per inch of blade. The Millie has been running in the 550 range which would be about 137 inch/lbs per inch of blade length.
We've not yet broken a MIL-RIL yet but it's engineered to be in the same range.
sal
Our Military (Walker) linerlock has been running in the "Heavy Duty" or over 100 inch/lbs per inch of blade. The Millie has been running in the 550 range which would be about 137 inch/lbs per inch of blade length.
We've not yet broken a MIL-RIL yet but it's engineered to be in the same range.
sal
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Thanks for the info, that is pretty dang good for a liner lock. I used to think the framelocks were way stronger than liner locks, but with a thin cutout in the titanium there is a weak link in that chain compared to the well engineered, steel liner lock on the Millie. I really like the Ball Lock and the Comp lock for pure strength and also having great smoothness and reliability. I really wish I could be a fly in the wall to see the ratings on my Superhawk, the ATR (the Stainless version had to be REALLY strong, but then again maybe the thickness of the tab doesn't make a huge difference compared to a regular comp lock), and the new Manix 2. I remember you saying the Manix 2 lock is stronger than the famously strong back lock on the Manix, that is real impressive for a lighter knife with thinner blade stock. The smoothness of the ball lock is really impressive considering it's great strength.
Mike
Mike, would you be kind to provide us with a reference to Sal's claim. If true it would be a very interesting fact and I would reconsider my opinion about Manix 2.
Ball lock works very similar to an Axis one. Probably, they are similarly strong. I do not know about reliability. An Axis lock has problem with Omega springs breaking - there were reports on Ball lock failure too. Any opinions?
Franco
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I believe it was on the Usual Suspect Network forums, but it has been a while. I can try to look over there to dig it up, but with the mechanics behind the Ball Lock it makes sense that it is stronger than the old Manix lock. The only ball locks I have used are the D'Allara and the P'kal. Both were amazingly smooth and I have no doubts of their reliability. I believe there is a pretty stout coil type spring behind the ball bearing to keep it lock. I highly doube it can be easily defeated, and it worked perfectly on both examples I tried. My Manix 2 should be here later this week to evaluate.
Mike
yablanowitz
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The ball lock actually uses two coil springs, one inside the other. The Axis lock puts a steel bar across the tang and wedges it against the liners, while the ball lock puts a steel ball between the tang and a steel backspacer. That's why you can have an unlined G-10 knife with a ball lock, such as the Dodo or new Poliwog, whereas the Axis lock pretty much demands liners.
There were some problems with some of the Dodos not engaging properly, but I believe it was due to a minor problem and was easily corrected. At least, mine was an easily corrected minor problem.
I recall hearing about sticky ball locks on the early Phoenix pieces, but that was a hard to unlock problem rather than a failure to lock problem or accidental unlock problem.
Overall, I suspect the ball lock is, or could be made to be, the strongest lock available. I'd love to see a break test on a stainless Poliwog.
There were some problems with some of the Dodos not engaging properly, but I believe it was due to a minor problem and was easily corrected. At least, mine was an easily corrected minor problem.
I recall hearing about sticky ball locks on the early Phoenix pieces, but that was a hard to unlock problem rather than a failure to lock problem or accidental unlock problem.Overall, I suspect the ball lock is, or could be made to be, the strongest lock available. I'd love to see a break test on a stainless Poliwog.
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The AXIS lock uses the weaker omega springs. Similar design, but a little bit different then the BBL. I have never heard of a BBL failure though.