Mirror edge back to BM factory edge?

[expidia1]

I have a new WE sharpening system and after I get experienced enough maybe 6 months down the road I'd like to put on a mirror edge with a toothy micro bevel.

BM has a free lifetime sharpening service. Do you think BM if I sent one of my knives back in the future, would BM for free put their factory toothy edge back on my blades even though I put my mirror edge on?

They come from the factory with this rough grind looking like they just hit them for a few seconds on a belt grinder and then box um up and ship um out.

I plan to collect and re-sell certain knives and if the buyer wants to buy one of my used knives without a mirror edge and he preferred an actual BM factory edge I'm wondering if BM would put one back on for free?

Thx

 

[Wolverine666]

I have a new WE sharpening system and after I get experienced enough maybe 6 months down the road I'd like to put on a mirror edge with a toothy micro bevel.

BM has a free lifetime sharpening service. Do you think BM if I sent mone of my knives back in the future, would BM for free put their factory toothy edge back on my blades even though I put my mirror edge on?

They come from the factory with this rough grind looking like they just hit them for a few seconds on a belt grinder and then box um up and ship um out.

I plan to collect and re-sell certain knives and if the buyer wants to buy one of my used knives without a mirror edge and he preferred an actual BM factory edge I'm wondering if BM would put one back on for free?

Thx

Have you asked Benchmade? Give them a call. Then you'll get a definitive answer.

 

[expidia1]

Ok thx. Good idea

 

[NJBillK]

They will tell you that they will not touch the edge if you specify that. But, there have been plenty of people (easily more than 10) in the Benchmade subforum that have had exactly this happen, and come back with a factory edge that was more obtuse or less sharp than when the owner shipped it...

Tell them that you do not want the edge touched or Sharpened by them in youroriginal contact email. Put a note in your shipping box stating such, and I would even go so far as to suggest putting a few layers of painters tape on the edge. This will force them to remove the tape, which will tell you that your edge has been tampered with.

Have all of this stated in your email, and you still run the risk...

 

[Wolverine666]

I think the OP is asking that if he DOES want the factory edge put back on the blade then would BM do it for free.

 

[Twindog]

Every serious collector's knife should have a perfectly beveled, ultra-keen mirrored edge, in my opinion. However, the current wisdom is that the original factory edge adds value. If you ask the factory to convert your mirrored edge to a factory edge, it isn't the same thing as having the original, untouched factory edge. Your reground edge will have less metal behind it, as well as having a rougher, uneven and less keen edge.

It will not be an original factory grind, but a twice reprofiled edge, left in a poorer state than when it was brand new.

 

[evilgreg]

BM has a free lifetime sharpening service. Do you think BM if I sent mone of my knives back in the future, would BM for free put their factory toothy edge back on

Factory toothy edge? At least a third of all Benchmades that I've bought new came with a factory-butter-knife edge incapable of cutting paper, but acceptable for spreading butter or margarine. Probably fully half were less than acceptably sharp, really.

It is amusing to think about using them to get rid of your pretty wicked-edge-mirrored sharpening job just to make a knife look like it came from the factory, but I don't see the point unless you were going to be dishonest and try to claim a knife was new when it wasn't. Otherwise who wouldn't prefer a nice and sharp used Benchmade to a once sharp but now professionally-dulled Benchmade?

 

[NJBillK]

Every serious collector's knife should have a perfectly beveled, ultra-keen mirrored edge, in my opinion.

Why?
Most alloys perform better with a toothier edge. Say, 400-800 grit.

By "most alloys" I mean 90%+ of the ones ranging from 440C to Maxamet. The alloys that like a mirror polished edge tend to be Sandvik, and AEB-L due to their purity, and lack of significant carbides (V, W, and other high hardness ones, not soft/gummy Chromium carbides).

The majority of the alloys that I am talking about will see a longer service life, prior to requiring a touch up. In an EDC carry, I prefer a working edge to one that can push cut receipt paper.

That being said, I can easily get a knife to shave with a 400 grit edge, and depending on the alloy and my time spent, whittling hair is often not an issue in that grit range either.
-----
As far as a factory edge "adding value", that is only due to the buyer can be fairly certain that the previous owner didn't overheat the edge with powered sharpening.

New edge = likely less damage to said edge. Other than factory overheating, which can be common.

 

[Lapedog]

I think that the reason people want a factory edge is because that way they feel confident some hack didn’t eff up the edge. That is the only reason why most people consider a factory edge more valuable, because it is an unmodified knife.

That said if you have the skill to put a mirror polish on the edge generally that means you have the skill to make a good edge, and thus it shouldn’t take away from the value of the knife. Unless you have sharpened the edge back several times and eaten up the metal.

Even if you return the knife to BM for sharpening it would be dishonest to advertise that as a “factory edge”

 

[Boggs]

As been said above...the value of the knife is greatly dismissed once youve re-ground the original blade. Even sharpening the blade will reduce value. If the knife is one that you’re purposing to resell leave as is.

 

[NJBillK]

Even if you return the knife to BM for sharpening it would be dishonest to advertise that as a “factory edge”

I missed the last paragraph of the OP and I agree.

Just because the factory applies an edge to the knife, doesn't mean it is the "original Factory edge". To sell a knife as having a "factory edge" after it has been sharpened a few times, and had a factory quality edge reapplied is dishonest and disingenuous, and bordering on thievery.

This would be outright lying about the original condition of the edge, and would be grounds for infraction at a minimum and banning at a maximum.
-----
But, I will echo what other above stated. If you can apply a polished edge, do so to the best of your ability, and sell it as such.

If your not going to use the knife, don't touch the edge unless it is already a user, and you are sharpening out damage. But, take note of the damage (with pics to corroborate) and when you list it, state that you repaired edge damage, supplying the pic in the sales listing.

A more in depth sales ad, is a better sales ad.

 

[Lapedog]

I missed the last paragraph of the OP and I agree.

Just because the factory applies an edge to the knife, doesn't mean it is the "original Factory edge". To sell a knife as having a "factory edge" after it has been sharpened a few times, and had a factory quality edge reapplied is dishonest and disingenuous, and bordering on thievery.

This would be outright lying about the original condition of the edge, and would be grounds for infraction at a minimum and banning at a maximum.
-----
But, I will echo what other above stated. If you can apply a polished edge, do so to the best of your ability, and sell it as such.

If your not going to use the knife, don't touch the edge unless it is already a user, and you are sharpening out damage. But, take note of the damage (with pics to corroborate) and when you list it, state that you repaired edge damage, supplying the pic in the sales listing.

A more in depth sales ad, is a better sales ad.

I think alot of prople go “should I mention this tiny scratch that cannot be seen except in the right angle? I want to be honest but the scratch is so tiny I don’t want to advertise the knife as scratched because people will imagine the worst.”

Honesty is always the best policy.

 

[NJBillK]

If I can see it, I mention it. I don't want someone buying a knife from me, and getting something they didn't pay for.
Nor do I want to buy something that isn't listed as accurate as it should be.

Has it been sharpened by you? Has it been carried? Has it been used? Has it been kicked down the street or tossed from a moving car?

None of these will stop me from buying a knife, though each one will make me look at the knife with more scrutiny, and expect the price to reflect the condition the knife is in, for better or worse.

 

[Twindog]

Hey Bill: You missed the "every serious collector's knife" part. I don't use mirrored edges because they're too time-consuming to restore to mirrored condition. But for a collector's knife, a perfectly beveled, ultra-keen mirrored edge takes the knife to the next level as a collector's item, both in looks and performance. But that's in my opinion. Most collectors want the factory edge, whether it's better or worse than a custom edge.

I also prefer a keen, refined edge over a toothy edge when it comes to actual use. I personally think that a keen, refined edge will last longer than a toothy edge, but most people don't see that performance gain because they don't know how to achieve a keen edge -- usually they leave a burr. And a toothy edge seems to last longer because after it's ability to cut is reduced, it still retains the ability to tear.

Sadly, much of what we value is shaped by the wisdom of the crowd and the money that a future sale can bring. A friend of mine collects books. The set he's most proud of is still wrapped in plastic. Not a word of that book will ever be read. No pages will ever be turned. The covers will never flop open. But that cheap film of plastic gives that set of books much more value. In other words, his valuable set of books has no value at all as books. Only as objects of desire.

We often do the same things with knives.

Why?
Most alloys perform better with a toothier edge. Say, 400-800 grit.

By "most alloys" I mean 90%+ of the ones ranging from 440C to Maxamet. The alloys that like a mirror polished edge tend to be Sandvik, and AEB-L due to their purity, and lack of significant carbides (V, W, and other high hardness ones, not soft/gummy Chromium carbides).

The majority of the alloys that I am talking about will see a longer service life, prior to requiring a touch up. In an EDC carry, I prefer a working edge to one that can push cut receipt paper.

That being said, I can easily get a knife to shave with a 400 grit edge, and depending on the alloy and my time spent, whittling hair is often not an issue in that grit range either.
-----
As far as a factory edge "adding value", that is only due to the buyer can be fairly certain that the previous owner didn't overheat the edge with powered sharpening.

New edge = likely less damage to said edge. Other than factory overheating, which can be common.

 

[NJBillK]

Hey Bill: You missed the "every serious collector's knife" part.

I guess a user can't also be a "serious collector". Fyi, absolutes like "Every", "Never", "Always", often tend to be wrong, with very few exceptions, see the following. You will Always be wrong when lumping a bunch of different people together when it comes to such a preferential thing. Every time you do this, you will be wrong about at least one person. Especially when you conflict yourself with a following portion of the quote.

See that? Two absolutes and I wasn't wrong. That is how you use them, (every time).
That makes three times.

I don't use mirrored edges because they're too time-consuming to restore to mirrored condition. But for a collector's knife, a perfectly beveled, ultra-keen mirrored edge takes the knife to the next level as a collector's item, both in looks and performance. But that's in my opinion.

This is Your opinion. A "Serious collector" would prefer factory fresh, see below (and take your "friend" for example).

Most collectors want the factory edge, whether it's better or worse than a custom edge.

I also prefer a keen, refined edge over a toothy edge when it comes to actual use. I personally think that a keen, refined edge will last longer than a toothy edge, but most people don't see that performance gain because they don't know how to achieve a keen edge -- usually they leave a burr. And a toothy edge seems to last longer because after it's ability to cut is reduced, it still retains the ability to tear.

Assuming that most folks that prefer a toothier edge due to their lack of sharpening knowledge is ignorant and rude at a minimum, and can easily be taken as a slap in the face. Great job being much better than the majority of us... I am sure your ego won't (or shouldn't) be taken down a peg or two...

Considering I can't see a wire edge under a 20x and 40x jewelers loupe, I am fairly sure that I am able to rid myself of one quite satisfactorily. Do you rely on a KME, or other aided sharpening to do the work for you or are you able to do as good of a job free hand?

All of my sharpening is done free hand.

Sadly, much of what we value is shaped by the wisdom of the crowd and the money that a future sale can bring. A friend of mine collects books. The set he's most proud of is still wrapped in plastic. Not a word of that book will ever be read. No pages will ever be turned. The covers will never flop open. But that cheap film of plastic gives that set of books much more value. In other words, his valuable set of books has no value at all as books. Only as objects of desire.

We often do the same things with knives.

If your friend collects books, great. I hope he looks at those Shiny plastic wrappers and is absolutely content. How do you think your friend will feel about knowing an absolute stranger is more supportive and welcoming of his hobby and interests than his own "friend" is?

You really need to step back and reevaluate your take on things, and while your at it, let your "friend" know that you look down on his interests and methods, and see how happy he is to hear from you.

Your way isn't the best or only way, it is only your way...

I guess the big difference is that I don't care how others use, store, or appreciate their knives. They are their knives after all. Who am I to say otherwise. What I mean is, I am not some "huge ego" driven, ignorant, and short sighted person that thinks that others should do things my way, or they are wrong.

Who would think (or sound) like that?

 

[expidia1]

Thanks for all those quick replies. I was not trying to pull a future fast one on any buyer. All I stated was if I were to sell a used knife and the buyer preferred the same edge that originally came from the factory and if BM would put that edge back on for me for free due to their lifetime sharpening service would they do this for me if I mirrored the edge already. I would never advertise a knife that came back to me after BM put their edge back on as a never been touched edge. What I said (or meant) was its the buyers choice if he did not like the mirror edge I put on and if I coud get it done for free by BM then the choice of a mirror edge or a factory grinded edge would be up to the buyer.
Like the first poster said its probably best to check with BM on this.

 

[hhmoore]

They offer free sharpening... why would they care if it comes in with a polished edge? I suspect that there is little thought given to the process...a knife is presented for sharpening, it gets sharpened, end of story.
As NJBillK pointed out, there have been enough cases of already sharp knives getting "sharpened" against the owners' wishes, simply because it's the routine, to think they would balk at doing so when there is a valid work order.

 

[willc]

I’m very sure BM will sharpen your knife even though it has a shiny bevel.

I’ve not been lucky with BM edges so there is no way I would let them grind away at it again.

 

[expidia1]

Thx for that repl. It's not a mirror edge yet. It will probably take me a few months of doing a number of BM's before I attempt it. The 490 is S90V steel so I'm doing that one last. At least if I screw it up its nice to know BM will put a factory edge back on it for me on free. I'm not a fan of their grinded on edges but its a solid edge which I should get 6 months out of before I attempt a mirror edge or send it back to them for free sharpening. So far I have 2 BM's in my collection and looking to add a 3rd shortly (my Son also has a BM osborne) all from S30V to S90V and all 3 of mine I expect to at some point after I gain enough experience adding mirror edges with a combo micro bevel on a bunch of my older knives I've collected over the years . . . using my Wicked Edge system.

 

[NJBillK]

Thx for that repl. It's not a mirror edge yet. It will probably take me a few months of doing a number of BM's before I attempt it. The 490 is S90V steel so I'm doing that one last. At least if I screw it up its nice to know BM will put a factory edge back on it for me on free. I'm not a fan of their grinded on edges but its a solid edge which I should get 6 months out of before I attempt a mirror edge or send it back to them for free sharpening. So far I have 2 BM's in my collection and looking to add a 3rd shortly (my Son also has a BM osborne) all from S30V to S90V and all 3 of mine I expect to at some point after I gain enough experience adding mirror edges with a combo micro bevel on a bunch of my older knives I've collected over the years . . . using my Wicked Edge system.

I would like to reiterate that most alloys perform better** with an edge that ranges between 400-800 grit, unless your use is push cutting paper.

You may want a polished edge due to the aesthetics (I agree they are nice looking), but it will not perform any better, and likely will do slightly worse than a toothier finished edge.

Best of luck, and thanks for the update.

**better in the case that they will hold an edge longer, and bit into the material being cut easier, thus requiring less effort, and promoting less force and wear on the edge.