More sharpening stone questions!

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Shawn7656

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Feb 15, 2012
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Hey guys, I've got some more questions on stones!
My plan is to buy two double-sided DMT dia-sharps: one is EC C - 220, 325 mesh, the other F EF - 600, 1200 mesh. Is the "mesh" the same as a grit number? Or is it different? If it's different, what do each of these stones come out as grit-wise?
(I will also be buying a stand for the stones)

On top of buying those two DMT stones, I was also thinking of a purchasing a waterstone, but an ultra fine one. What would be a good step up in grit from the EF DMT stone? Would it be useful (past aesthetics) to have more than one higher grit stones? I have a strop and I can put paste on it, but tonight I used a 1000/6000 King Japanese waterstone and it was wonderful. It put a beautiful finish on the blades I sharpened (4 Japanese kitchen knives), as well as making them extremely sharp. I do sort of want to buy one, but I'm wondering if it'd be better for me to get something of a different grit to couple with my DMTs.

Any suggestions of grit, brand, etc would be appreciated! I'm trying to keep things relatively cheap (around the same price I'm getting the diasharps, $42). If it'd be better for me to just get the EEF DMT stone I'm not opposed to that. I just want the best quality edge and tools for my money!
 
Grit comes in many numbers so try and look to the micron ratings for a better reference.

I would recommend the 1k and 6k Arashiyama stones over the king, they are all-around a better performer.
 
Check up in the grit chart, it might help you clarify some stuff a bit, Shawn.

Remember, though, the FINISH left by a diamond plate at the same micron size as a waterstone will be completely different! Grit size is not the only thing that determines how an abrasive will cut. Hardness, fragility of the grains and the matrix they are held in, backing material and technique also play huge rolls. In GENERAL, the diamond plate will leave very large scratches for its micron size, since the abrasive does not break down or roll at all. So when you make your transition from diamond plate to waterstone, it would likely be worth picking up a waterstone in the SAME micron size as your last diamond plate to smooth out those scratches, then a finer one to continue refining.

I'd be tempted to get those two, followed by the King you mention. I haven't played with the Arashiyama stones so I really can't say much about them, but you've had good luck with the King so far.
 
I'd take the tip from Knifenut and just get the 1k and 6k Arashiyama stones. Throw in a 220 grit waterstone from Norton or King and you've got things covered very well. If you were able to put the Kings to good use, the Arashiyama are said to produce a much nicer edge. For myself, I don't use my DMTs anymore and can do 80-90% of all my sharpening with the Kings. If I could go back and have half of my sharpening tool money in my pocket, I'd pick up two or three of the better waterstones and not bother with anything else( even tho I get great results from the Kings). Whatever you go with, try to build a complete set from the same abrasive type. Stone progressions work a lot better when they're all of the same kind - silicon carbide, alum ox, diamond. Crossing over from one grinding media to another can work, but it doesn't go smoothly.
 
Hmm.. You guys bring up some very good points. I hadn't really thought about the differences between diamond and stone effecting the blade that way.

So the general consensus would be to pick up <i>just</i> the 1k and 6k Arashiyama stones? And a more coarse-grit stone as well?

What I liked about diamond stones was minimal maintenance and a long life.
...How long do waterstones typically last (With maybe an average of 4 or 5 knives a week)? How often do they need to be ground flat?
 
Shawn7656 said:
Hmm.. You guys bring up some very good points. I hadn't really thought about the differences between diamond and stone effecting the blade that way.

So the general consensus would be to pick up <i>just</i> the 1k and 6k Arashiyama stones? And a more coarse-grit stone as well?

What I liked about diamond stones was minimal maintenance and a long life.
...How long do waterstones typically last (With maybe an average of 4 or 5 knives a week)? How often do they need to be ground flat?
Click to expand...

A real coarse grit stone is always good to have around. It likely won't see a lot of use but for big jobs like thinning a blade, re setting a bevel to a steeper angle, changing a sabre grind into a convex etc you will need one. As for life, I imagine they'll outlast you even with weekly use. I used to lap mine flat every two or three blades, but now I just make sure to use the entire surface as I go and try to wear it down evenly - not as difficult to manage as you'd think. An added bonus, when using whetstones I don't have to stop to clean the stone off as frequently because the swarf doesn't build up in one spot.
I do not know how hard the Arishiyama stones are compared to Kings, but I believe they're much more wear resistant.
 
Well, and another thought for you:

Since you will much more likely use the 1k and 6k waterstones on a day-to-day basis, and coarse waterstones wear much more rapidly than the finer ones, you might be well-served by picking up an XC/C DMT for those occasions when you REALLY need to strip off the metal and use the waterstones alone for your general-purpose sharpening. 1K is typically enough (in my limited experience) to deal with day-to-day wear and moderately dulled blades as far as establishing the edge goes, before the 6K to finish up. That might offer you the best of both worlds, with the diamonds for the work that would typically wear and dish waterstones, and the waterstones for the day-to-day sharpening and fine finish work that standard diamond plates are not as well-suited for.
 
Sorry for my delayed response guys. I've been looking around and I can't find any 1000/6000 combo Arashiyama stones, or any other combo for that matter. As I'm looking to save money I think I'll go with King. I found the King 1000/6000 for 55, and I'm finding the Arashiyama 1000 for 45, but I'm not even finding a 6000 (though I found reference to it's existence lol).

Not trying to deal spot, but can anyone find a site that has Arashiyama combo stones for cheap?

By the way - I'm not limiting myself to these brands. If anyone knows of another high-quality-yet-cheap brand for water stones, please drop some names or links!!
 
The arashiyama stones are individual stones not a combo stone. Combo waterstones are not something I personally recommend but if you don't use them much then you would probably be fine.

The arashiyama stones can be found at Chefknivestogo as can the Imanishi 1k 6k combo stone, another combo stone you might like.
 
Shawn7656 said:
Hmm.. You guys bring up some very good points. I hadn't really thought about the differences between diamond and stone effecting the blade that way.

So the general consensus would be to pick up <i>just</i> the 1k and 6k Arashiyama stones? And a more coarse-grit stone as well?

What I liked about diamond stones was minimal maintenance and a long life.
...How long do waterstones typically last (With maybe an average of 4 or 5 knives a week)? How often do they need to be ground flat?
Click to expand...

The waterstones will last a long time, but before you use them, you should do a few passes on 600 grit wet or dry sandpaper on plate glass to keep them flat. Remember, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

Another alternative is to use diamond lapping film, which cuts very fast and comes in a grit of 0.1 microns. I saw it on Lee Valley's website.
 
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