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Mortised tang and stock removal?
- Thread starter jimbowie7
- Start date
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2002
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- 1,452
My 2 cents.
By the time you get to putting the handle on, there's no difference between a forged blade and a stock removal blade. Both need a proper heat treat, need to be ground and polished, etc.
If you don't have a forge, but want to make knives, just jump on in doing stock removal. Everything you learn/practice will be useful when you start forging.
By the time you get to putting the handle on, there's no difference between a forged blade and a stock removal blade. Both need a proper heat treat, need to be ground and polished, etc.
If you don't have a forge, but want to make knives, just jump on in doing stock removal. Everything you learn/practice will be useful when you start forging.
Thanks for the reply.
I've made both, but like the classic "look" of the mortised tang.
I was just wondering if I could make a knife from D2 with a mortised tang -would it be as strong (in the tang area) as a forged blade? I guess my concern is safety and strength.
I've made both, but like the classic "look" of the mortised tang.
I was just wondering if I could make a knife from D2 with a mortised tang -would it be as strong (in the tang area) as a forged blade? I guess my concern is safety and strength.
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2003
- Messages
- 65
I just read a post on another forum that points out that almost all of the knives used for the ABS cutting compititions are mortised tang knives. If they can take that pounding I think they are planty strong.
Seth
Seth
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- Nov 24, 2003
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- 2,357
jimbowie7 said:
You've really got two questions here:
1) Would forged D2 be as strong as stock removal D2? Given that it's very hard to forge D2 and that D2 isn't as tough as many common forging steels, I doubt that you really meant to ask this.
2) Given the same steel, can a stock removal hidden tang blade be as strong as forged one. IMHO, yes if the tang profiles and heat treatment are comparable. By tang profile I mainly mean a tang that starts out only a little narrower than the blade shoulders and tapers appropriately into the handle as opposed to a rectangular stick.
But now lets hear what some of the real experts have to say.
Dan Pierson
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2004
- Messages
- 216
I have just finished a mortised tang forged 5160 knife. The tang is surrounded by Micarta and epoxy. It withstood a 180 flex with the lower 1/3 clamped in the bench vise.
With today's modern adhesives and materials (i.e. Micarta and stabilized wood) a tang knive is pretty indestructable.
There are two tricks to making a strong tang:
1. A proper heat treat. The tang should be tempered. I edge quench after heating the whole blade so the tang is approximately the same as the spine. For those that do the oxy-act draw back I think it is a blue(?) color.
2. Eliminate stress risers. This means where the tang meets the guard and ricasso area should be a rounded or sloped junction. A 90 degree corner invites stress to focus at that angle.
With today's modern adhesives and materials (i.e. Micarta and stabilized wood) a tang knive is pretty indestructable.
There are two tricks to making a strong tang:
1. A proper heat treat. The tang should be tempered. I edge quench after heating the whole blade so the tang is approximately the same as the spine. For those that do the oxy-act draw back I think it is a blue(?) color.
2. Eliminate stress risers. This means where the tang meets the guard and ricasso area should be a rounded or sloped junction. A 90 degree corner invites stress to focus at that angle.
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2001
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- 3,824
What Joe said, in spades. When it's all said and done a well made hidden tange(or mortised or what ever you want to call it) can be stronger than a full tange. A full tange is strong in two directions, while a hidden tange with solid handle material like a dense wood or mycarta is a solid unit and strong in all directions, has less area for moister to get into and helps insulate shock from the users hand(I mean impact not electricle
)
)- Joined
- Oct 9, 2002
- Messages
- 1,419
Yup, I also like the classic look of a hidden tang knife.
I have no doubt of the toughness of a forged blade's tang area, provided it's done properly. I regularly test my hidden tang blade to destruction and the results are heartwarmingly reassuring. I have never had a knife break at the tang / blade junction. The factors to include for the strongest possible hidden tang are :-
1) the largest, widest possible tang
2) All width/thickness transition areas to be radiused. ie.- no sharp corners to act as stress risers.
3) In a forged blade, the tang should be fully annealled or spring tempered (or slightly softer). In any case, it should be the softest part of the blade.
In a steel that you cannot reliably achieve differential hardening or tempering, eg.- in D2 or other stainless steels, you obviously cannot do #3), but you can still do #1) and #2) .
Ie.- pretty much what Joe Cabaup said. Hope it helps. Jason.
I have no doubt of the toughness of a forged blade's tang area, provided it's done properly. I regularly test my hidden tang blade to destruction and the results are heartwarmingly reassuring. I have never had a knife break at the tang / blade junction. The factors to include for the strongest possible hidden tang are :-
1) the largest, widest possible tang
2) All width/thickness transition areas to be radiused. ie.- no sharp corners to act as stress risers.
3) In a forged blade, the tang should be fully annealled or spring tempered (or slightly softer). In any case, it should be the softest part of the blade.
In a steel that you cannot reliably achieve differential hardening or tempering, eg.- in D2 or other stainless steels, you obviously cannot do #3), but you can still do #1) and #2) .
Ie.- pretty much what Joe Cabaup said. Hope it helps. Jason.